China Replacing AL-31F Engines with WS-10A Engines for J-10 jets

[hboGYT]

J-10 has nice looking ***.

Mmmm, I think so, too. I think I'll take it from behind.

 

[Hafizzz]

China Replacing AL-31F Engines with WS-10A Engines for J-10 jets

China is replacing the engines in its J-10 fighter, installing the Chinese made WS-10A in place of Russian made AL-31F. The Chinese consider the WS-10A a superior engine to the AL-31F, even though the WS-10A copied a lot of the Russian technology.

As delivered from Russia, the AL-31 is good for 900 hours of operation. Chinese engineers figured out how to tweak the design of the engine so that it lasted for 1,500 hours. This feat is part of a growing trend. At first, decades ago, China simply figured out how to build Russian weapons they had bought. But in the last decade, they have increasingly improved on those designs.

China has poured much money into developing a jet engine manufacturing capability. The Chinese encountered many of the same problems the Russians did when developing their own engine design and construction skills. But China has several advantages.

First, they knew of the mistakes the Russians had made, and so were able to avoid many of them. Then there was the fact that China had better access to Western manufacturing technology (both legally and illegally). Finally, China was, unlike the Soviets, able to develop their engine manufacturing capabilities in a market economy. This was much more efficient than the command economy that the Soviets were saddled with for seven decades.

J-10 began development in 1988 and it first flew in 1996. The J-10 is based on the abandoned Israeli Lavi (an improved F-16) project. The J-10 initially used a Russian engine (the AL-31F, the same one used in the Su-27), and was to have used Israeli electronics. But the United States leaned on the Israelis to back off making the Chinese air force too lethal, given the probability of American pilots possibly having to fight the Chinese air force some day.

The Chinese developed their own avionics, based on Russian equipment. But this did not work out well. Some J-10s, using the Chinese copy of the Russian AL-31F engine, suffered from poor engine reliability. This appears to have been the cause of several accidents. Earlier this year, for the second time in three years, it was revealed that one of China's J-10 fighters crashed. There may have been more.

The two crashes that are known were initially kept quiet. News of these mishaps escaped only because of special circumstances. The most recent loss (on April 22nd) killed its pilot, who was a senior colonel. That rank and reputation led to a big funeral, attracting a lot of military and political officials. That made it difficult to conceal how the colonel died. The 2007 crash was in a rice paddy in the rural northeast.

The wreckage was not immediately removed, and eventually someone with a cell phone camera and an Internet connection came along, and the pictures got out. It is believed that there have been more crashes, which have been kept from the public. Nearly 200 J-10s have been built so far, but the design has not worked out as hoped.

The J-10 looks something like the American F-16, and weighs about the same (19 tons). Like the F-16 the J-10 has only one engine. The J-10 also turned out to perform poorly in air-to-air combat. In response, the Chinese have been reconfiguring some of them as a fighter-bombers (the J-10C). This two seat version can carry over four tons of bombs and missiles and has been equipped with a fire control system for delivering missiles and smart bombs. The J-10C will have a weapons officer to concentrate on hitting things on the ground.

China is seeking export sales for the J-10, selling the aircraft as an "F-16 replacement", but for half the price. This is not going well, because there are so many used F-16s for sale, at less than what new J-10s cost.

Despite all that, the Chinese are quite proud of the J-10, as it is the first high performance jet fighter designed (albeit with Israeli plans) and built in China. Despite this, China is equipping the J-10 with new generations of electronics and weapons, to give this gear some practical experience.

Warplanes: Out With The Russian, In With The Superior Chinese Copy

Now the Russians can no longer blackmail China with banning exports of Jet Engines to China.

 

[Hafizzz]

How many times people need to know, the WS-10A is based on GE architecture. AL-31 is of totally different structure. There is no copying.

The West and India wants to brainwash people to view China as a "copycat". It won't work. Say what they want to say but no one in China cares.

 

[AMCA]

The West and India wants to brainwash people to view China as a "copycat". It won't work. Say what they want to say but no one in China cares.

China is No Copycat, But its Made to Copy, as it is facing Embargoes from the west, If It has to Succeed it needs to reverse Engineer without Active R&D Input.... I do not know what the world Calls it but it Is Defined to as Copying, Tell me any One Aircraft of theirs which Has a Different Design than an Aircraft which Already is in the Market

 

[lcloo]

China is No Copycat, But its Made to Copy, as it is facing Embargoes from the west, If It has to Succeed it needs to reverse Engineer without Active R&D Input.... I do not know what the world Calls it but it Is Defined to as Copying, Tell me any One Aircraft of theirs which Has a Different Design than an Aircraft which Already is in the Market

Do you know what JH-7 and FC-1/JF-17 are? Do you think J-10 is Lavi? WZ-10, L-15 etc etc etc.....

 

[Martian2]

China is No Copycat, But its Made to Copy, as it is facing Embargoes from the west, If It has to Succeed it needs to reverse Engineer without Active R&D Input.... I do not know what the world Calls it but it Is Defined to as Copying, Tell me any One Aircraft of theirs which Has a Different Design than an Aircraft which Already is in the Market

A Seagull 300 multi-functional light amphibious plane is seen during its test flight in Shijiazhuang, capital of Hebei Province, on Nov. 10, 2010. The Seagull 300 plane, which is developed and manufactured by Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), succeeded in its first test flight on Wednesday. The four- or six-seat plane is designed for a variety of landing surfaces, such as water, grass, asphalt, and concrete. (Xinhua/Wang Min)

Seagull 300 succeeds in maiden flight - People's Daily Online

"Seagull 300 succeeds in maiden flight
16:33, November 11, 2010

The Seagull 300 lands on the runway on Nov. 11, 2010.

China's Seagull 300 light multi-functional amphibious plane made a successful maiden flight in Shijiazhuang, capital city of north China’s Hebei Province on Nov. 11, 2010.

The Seagull 300, the first of its kind in China to have independent intellectual property rights, is developed by Aviation Industry Corporation of China.

It required only 12 months to finish the work from design to maiden flight, setting a new record in China. The success of the maiden flight means the project will switch to testing for flight navigability.

By People's Daily Online"

 

[Martian2]

any idea what advantages there are in having the propeller in the revere position?

Seagull 300 pusher configuration

Pusher configuration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Pusher configuration

Advantages

* Efficiency can be gained by mounting a propeller behind the fuselage, because it re-energizes the boundary layer developed on the body, and reduces the form drag by keeping the flow attached. However, this effect is not nearly as pronounced on a small airplane as it is on a submarine or ship, where it is quite important due to the much higher Reynolds number at which they operate.

* Wing efficiency increases due to the absence of prop-wash over any section of the wing.

* Rear thrust is somewhat less stable in flight than with a tractor configuration. This has the potential to make an aircraft more maneuverable.[citation needed]

* Especially in a single-engined pusher aircraft, the pilot's view both forward and downwards is improved because the engine and propeller do not block forward vision, and because the more rearward centre of gravity makes placement of the cockpit forward of the wings more practical. Consequently, this configuration was widely used for early combat aircraft, and remains popular today among ultralight aircraft.

* The propeller of a single-engined airplane can be placed closer to the elevators and rudder. This increases the speed of the air flowing over the control surfaces, improving pitch and yaw control at low speed, particularly during takeoff when the engine is at full power. This can be beneficial while bush flying, especially when taking off and landing on airstrips bounded by obstacles that must be avoided while the airplane is moving slowly.

* The engine is mounted behind the crew and passenger compartments, so fuel does not have to flow past personnel, any leak will vent behind the aircraft, and any engine fire will be directed behind the aircraft (however, this arrangement puts the empennage at greater risk, if there is one—but this is less of an issue if the fire occurs on, or as a consequence of, landing). Similarly, propeller failure is unlikely to directly endanger the crew.

* The cockpit is generally quieter in a pusher aircraft because both the engine and propeller are behind the crew.

* At the time when many military aircraft were pushers, the engine afforded rear protection to the pilot, and simplified the installation of gun armament."

Any more questions?

 

[SQ8]

Now why does that look like the Lake amphibian of the 60's and 70's to me..it was a very popular aircraft..

 

[Martian2]

China is No Copycat, But its Made to Copy, as it is facing Embargoes from the west, If It has to Succeed it needs to reverse Engineer without Active R&D Input.... I do not know what the world Calls it but it Is Defined to as Copying, Tell me any One Aircraft of theirs which Has a Different Design than an Aircraft which Already is in the Market

WZ-10 attack helicopter undergoing testing

Aircraft | Define Aircraft at Dictionary.com

"air·craft
   /ˈɛərˌkræft, -ˌkrɑft/
–noun, plural -craft.
any machine supported for flight in the air by buoyancy or by the dynamic action of air on its surfaces, esp. powered airplanes, gliders, and helicopters."

 

[Martian2]

China's Advanced Regional Jet for the 21st Century

ARJ21 jets to be delivered starting from 2011 - People's Daily Online

"ARJ21 jets to be delivered starting from 2011
13:38, July 22, 2010

China's first ARJ21 regional jet is expected to be delivered in 2011, the Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China (COMAC), which develops domestically-made jumbo jets and sells the ARJ21 aircraft, reported during the Farnborough International Air Show on July 21.

ARJ21 is a new type of short-to-medium-range, turbofan-powered regional jet independently developed by China. It has 70 to 100 seats and a maximum range of 2,000 nautical miles. Designed in accordance with international airworthiness standards, the aircraft can meet requirements such as takeoff and landing in plateau or high-temperature airports.

According to COMAC, the ARJ21 regional jet had its first test flight on Nov. 28, 2008 and has entered the airworthiness certification and certificate application stage. Four ARJ21 regional jets have participated in test flights with a cumulative flight time of more than 600 hours. Confirmed overseas and domestic orders and orders of intent have amounted to 240 and the first aircraft is scheduled to be delivered in 2011.

The pre-sale price of the new ARJ21 regional jet is 27 million to 29 million U.S. dollars, giving the ARJ21 regional jet a price advantage over its peers in the international market.

COMAC also noted that China's jumbo jet project will enter the engineering development phase next year. The suppliers for the project have generally been selected after key suppliers of the airframe structure, power units and system devices, materials and standard components were fixed.

Equipment for the C919 jumbo jets will be supplied by 13 international aviation manufacturing enterprises. Meanwhile, over 30 domestic enterprises have passed the preliminary material supply reviews and more than 50 domestic enterprises have been selected as potential standard component suppliers.

COMAC added that the overall technical plan, manufacturing plan and customer service plan for the C919 jumbo jets will be compiled in 2010. The C919 jumbo jets are scheduled to conduct the first test flights in 2014 and be delivered in 2016.

By People's Daily Online"

ARJ-21 cockpit

ARJ-21 pilot controls

ARJ-21 throttle control

ARJ-21 interior cabin space

 

[Martian2]

New model of rescue medical helicopter makes debut on PLA hospital ship in Indian Ocean - People's Daily Online

The latest model of a rescue medical helicopter is seen aboard the hospital ship Peace Ark of the Navy of the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) prior to its takeoff during an exercise in the Indian Ocean on Sept. 14, 2010. The helicopter made its first debut on Monday after successfully landing on the Peace Ark. (Xinhua/Zha Chunming)

Two Chinese soldiers pilot a newly-designed rescue medical helicopter during an exercise in the Indian Ocean on Sept. 14, 2010. (Xinhua/Zha Chunming)

Mr. Liu Bingli, head of a medical team on the latest rescue medical helicopter, participates in an exercise in the Indian Ocean on Sept. 14, 2010. (Xinhua/Zha Chunming)

A member of a medical team, on the newly-designed rescue medical helicopter, checks equipment while participating in an exercise in the Indian Ocean on Sept. 14, 2010. (Xinhua/Zha Chunming)

 

[Martian2]

This video includes clips of the WZ-9 in flight:

This video includes clips of the J-10 in flight:

 

[Martian2]

J-10 aerobatics performance.

JF-17 aerobatics performance by Pakistani Airforce.

JF-17 aerobatics performance (second part). K-8 acrobatics performance starts after 5 minutes and 25 seconds into the video.

Bi-planes perform acrobatics at Zhuhai Airshow 2010.

Note: Thank you to "oneman28" for the video links.

 

[Martian2]

Chinese UAV shown at 60th anniversary National Parade

 

[Martian2]

KJ-200 AWACS