China rapidly narrows technology gap with S. Korea

[antonius123]

Lockheed design help Korean T-50 reduce the gap ... ?! China HongDu K-8 jet trainer produced in 1980s and exported 500x to foreign nations ... is that increasing the gap ?

Wiki Hongdu JL-8/K-8

Depend. Will be yes if the T-50 technology content is more advanced than K-8 regardless T-50 is 100% indigenous or not.

IMHO the mastery of technology could be obtained either from own invention, buying (eg: lenovo case), or license.

 

[cnleio]

Depend. Will be yes if the T-50 technology content is more advanced than K-8 regardless T-50 is 100% indigenous or not.

IMHO the mastery of technology could be obtained either from own invention, buying (eg: lenovo case), or license.

OKay, let's just compare Korean T-50 vs China H-6K, J-8IIF, JH-7A, JF-17, J-10A, J-10B/C, J-11B, J-11D, J-15, J-16, J-31, J-20 ... if Korea just behind 4.3 year of China aviation industry, how long do u think Korean can design domestic fighter better than above, need 4.3 year or less ?


About T-50 jet trainer, the American say:

The T-50 program is a joint development between Lockheed Martin and Korea Aerospace Industries to meet the advanced jet pilot training needs of the Republic of Korea Air Force (ROKAF). More than 100 aircraft have been built and delivered to the ROKAF. A second variant is currently in production called the FA-50 light combat aircraft.

Lockheed Martin T-50 Multirole Trainer

 

[antonius123]

Let put this simple. There are areas in which South Korea would never be able to match us. Yet we can match South Korea in all fields. I give credit for South Korea for being a small efficient country, the fastest internet connect speed in the world. But that only because it is small and easily to build infrastructure than a massive country like China/USA. It is also pointless to compare a big and small country as our scale is vast. We able to cover all fields and compete well. South Korea has to choose its niches technological market to compete.

I would put simple like this:

China is clearly ahead S Korea in: Military (plane, ship, tank, etc), Aerospace, Some Heavy Industry (railway, nuclear, etc)
Korea is clearly still ahead China in : Semiconductor, Display, Auto, Chemical, civilian ship building

 

[cnleio]

we have good relations with SK these days!


So I would like to vote that:

China is on par with Korea

As the thousand-year neighbor, in past 95% years both Sino-Korea has good-relationship ... just don't fool China.

 

[j20blackdragon]

I would put simple like this:

China is clearly ahead S Korea in: Military (plane, ship, tank, etc), Aerospace, Some Heavy Industry (railway, nuclear, etc)
Korea is clearly still ahead China in : Semiconductor, Display, Auto, Chemical, civilian ship building

You're just cherry-picking industries South Korea has a lead in.

I can do it too.

China is clearly still ahead in...

PCs
Gartner Says Worldwide PC Shipments Declined 7.7 Percent in Third Quarter of 2015

Servers
Gartner Says Worldwide Server Revenue Grew 7.5 Percent in the Third Quarter of 2015, While Shipments Increased 9.2 Percent

Supercomputers
China nearly triples number of supercomputers, report says - BBC News

Telecommunications Equipment
Huawei - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Machine Tools

Civilian Aerospace

 

[XiaoYaoZi]

Korea is still ahead at least in: Semiconductor technology, Display Technology (OLED), Automotive technology, Ship building technology, Petrochemical technology.

Very very narrow. I also can say the cigar technology of Cuba is ahead of us.

 

[antonius123]

Very very narrow. I also can say the cigar technology of Cuba is ahead of us.

Not really..

Semiconductor, Display tech, Robotic, Medical Equipment, Automotive, Chemicals, Telco, industrial machinery, nano material, ocean, construction, medical care, energy, actually is very ample.

However the gap is small indeed.

You're just cherry-picking industries South Korea has a lead in.

I can do it too.

China is clearly still ahead in...

PCs
Gartner Says Worldwide PC Shipments Declined 7.7 Percent in Third Quarter of 2015

Servers
Gartner Says Worldwide Server Revenue Grew 7.5 Percent in the Third Quarter of 2015, While Shipments Increased 9.2 Percent

Supercomputers
China nearly triples number of supercomputers, report says - BBC News

Telecommunications Equipment
Huawei - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Machine Tools

Civilian Aerospace

Not cherry picking at all.

Based on that data, there are still many field that Korea ahead, though the gap is small or become narrowing.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

We need our myth debunker @Martian2 to sort this out.

What makes South Korea to be only 4 years behind China in the space program?

 

[xunzi]

I would put simple like this:

China is clearly ahead S Korea in: Military (plane, ship, tank, etc), Aerospace, Some Heavy Industry (railway, nuclear, etc)
Korea is clearly still ahead China in : Semiconductor, Display, Auto, Chemical, civilian ship building

None of these commercial tech are vital or in the same technological sophistication as in the military or state tech because commercial tech always derived from military tech.

 

[Martian2]

We need our myth debunker @Martian2 to sort this out.

What makes South Korea to be only 4 years behind China in the space program?

To compare China and South Korea in science and technology, we need to use broad metrics. This avoids the problem of selectively choosing data.

The Nature Index is a good place to start. Across 68 highly-respected publications in all scientific disciplines, we find China is world #2 in the number of Nature articles. South Korea is way down on the Nature Index list at #9 ranking.

China ranks second worldwide in the total number of prestigious Nature science articles published per year.

This is the most updated Nature Index from September 2014 to August 2015.

Country outputs | Nature Index

China's 2015 Nature Index soared by 10%

The most important trend is China's year-over-year increase of 10% in the Nature Index (from 6,037 to 6,728 in weighted fractional index articles). The other Top 7 countries in the Nature Index were mostly flat in their annual quality research output.

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When you look at the World Bank data for high-tech exports by country, China is world #1. South Korea is a distant #5.

High-technology exports (current US$) | Data | Table

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In conclusion, an impartial comparison of China and South Korea shows China is far ahead of South Korea in science and technology. South Korea is only 17% of China's leading-edge scientific output and 23% of China's high-tech exports.

 

[Keel]

It is inept to use per capita innovation ( based on no. of applications of patents. et al ) as a factor to say because S Korean's per capita number is higher than China's so S Koreans are more innovative

Some data can be used for comparison on a "per capita" basis like GDP, average life-span etc because they are readily quantifiable but. many cannot like innovation because it involves the "impact of innovation" and "technical sophistication" which are not quantilfied in the charts. Like the cost of just one jet engine is worth say US$2 to 3 million against the cost of a single cell phone of US$ 500 - 800 apiece

But judging from the sheer number of patent applications filed by China alone. it is about 4 times of that of S korea's and as far as trademarks and industrial designs are concerned, China is the runaway winners in the categories. Yes, no "impact" of those are quanified as yet so using the above to say S Koreans are more "per capita" innovative than China is amateurish

You can arguably scale down the population size of China to that of S Korea's to make the comparison on equal basis if you are stubbornly insistent but then the result looms out easily on who is the winner

.
.

 

[j20blackdragon]

Not really..

Semiconductor, Display tech, Robotic, Medical Equipment, Automotive, Chemicals, Telco, industrial machinery, nano material, ocean, construction, medical care, energy, actually is very ample.

However the gap is small indeed.

Simply rambling out a list of industries without giving examples doesn't prove anything.

Also I know you're bullsh*tting when you say South Korea is ahead of China when it comes to construction. It simply isn't.

The tallest skyscraper in East Asia is in China.

Shanghai Tower - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The tallest skyscraper in East Asia under construction is in China.

Ping An Finance Centre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The world's longest bridges are in China.

List of longest bridges in the world - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The world's largest expressway network is in China.

Expressways of China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The world's largest high speed rail network is in China.

List of high-speed railway lines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Kindly explain to me how South Korea is ahead of China when it comes to construction.

 

[Martian2]

China has larger construction equipment manufacturing companies than South Korea

China's XCMG and SANY are both larger than South Korea's Doosan Infracore.

Obviously, I'm not going to go through each industry to prove my point. It's not worth the work. However, it is common sense that China outmuscles South Korea in just about every industry. Regarding semiconductors, Samsung licenses the technology from IBM. You can't count 14nm as belonging to South Korea. They are merely a licensee.

China's trade surplus is about $600 billion this year. South Korea's trade surplus is only about $100 billion or so. The aggregate trade numbers should tell you that China is the giant in most industries.

• Construction equipment manufacturers: world equipment sales 2014 | Ranking

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The Original Poster (Antonius) really shouldn't ramble and make wild claims.

There is no way you can argue South Korea is ahead of China in telecom.

China's Huawei and Europe's Ericcson are world #1 and #2 in just about every telecom category.

Also, China builds the 10,000-pound 15-year-lifespan DFH-4 telecommunications satellite. As far as I know, South Korea has nothing comparable.

Antonius is making claims that are not true.

In reality, South Korea is behind China in most of the important technology industries.

The Top Five in telecom are:

Huawei (China)
Ericsson
Nokia
Alcatel Lucent
ZTE (China)

South Korea is outside of the Top Five in telecom.

Huawei becomes the world's largest telecom equipment manufacturer - OFweek News

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I also have no idea why Antonius falsely claimed that South Korea is ahead of China in petrochemicals.

China's Sinopec is Asia's largest oil refining and petrochemical company.

Sinopec - Latest China business news – China Business Search

 

[Jlaw]

Very very narrow. I also can say the cigar technology of Cuba is ahead of us.

indeed. No one can match cigars from Cuba. I always buy a lot when I go there even though I don't smoke. I give to friends, etc.

 

[Martian2]

China has 232 companies on the Forbes Global 2000. South Korea only has 66.

The Forbes Global 2000 is a list of the world's largest companies. In general, a company grew into the world's largest because it has the best technology and sales.

China has 232 companies on the Forbes Global 2000. Chinese companies are truly huge. Only American companies can stand toe-to-toe against the Chinese giants.

South Korea has only 66 companies on the Forbes Global 2000. It is pretty cheeky to take such a small country and claim it has better technology than China.

On the Forbes Global 2000, Taiwan has 47 companies. If you want to compare South Korea to Taiwan, that would make sense because they're close. However, South Korea is ranked pretty low compared to China on the Forbes Global 2000 list.

In the map below, the giant yellow circles are first-tier countries with a huge presence on the Forbes Global 2000. The Japanese belong in the second-tier with a smaller blue circle. South Korea is a minor country with a tiny purple circle.

Original data source from Forbes: The World’s Biggest Public Companies List - Forbes

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By the way, China's Shenyang Machine Tool Company is the world's largest (see citation below). I think a German or European company is in second place. I think South Korea is a minor player in machine tools. The South Koreans are pretty small in world rankings.

China-Based Machine Tool Company Introduced Itself to SCV Manufacturers

Here are three videos about China's SMTCL (ie. Shenyang Machine Tool Company Ltd.).