China Plane Crashes With 132 On Board; No Sign Of Survivors, Says Report

[Hamartia Antidote]

Comparing across commercial aircraft models, Boeing crash and fatality rate is horrible. Airbus is much better.

So much for those MBAs who think they are more talented than engineers.

The day C919 and C929 roll out, Boeing will be dead meat. Anything will be safer than Boeing.


View attachment 826217

The 737-100 and 737-200 on that graph are 1960's era planes. Nobody flies them except third world countries who bought them used or on the cheap.

 

[gambit]

All speculations in HERE about the 737 flight control systems -- wrong.

The 737 FLCS is not fly-by-wire. It is a COMPUTER ASSISTED mechanical hydraulics system. Here is how the system works...

There are two parallel command paths: cockpit and computer (flight control computer or FLCC).

The cockpit commands the yoke and rudder, so for ease of explanation, yoke + rudder = cockpit.

Cockpit commands pitch up. The mechanical linkages runs from cockpit to hydraulics actuators and make the airplane pitch up. As the airplane pitches up, the FLCC adds its own command to smooth out any movement fluctuations. This is called 'stability augementation'.

Stability Augmentation - an overview | ScienceDirect Topics

www.sciencedirect.com

There are three SAS for pitch, roll, and yaw axes. The FLCC needs inputs from the Central Air Data Computer (CADC).

Air Data Computer (ADC) | SKYbrary Aviation Safety

Description An air data computer (ADC) is an essential avionics component found in aircraft. This computer, rather than individual instruments, can determine the calibrated airspeed, Mach number, altitude, and altitude trend data from an aircraft's Pitot Static System. In some very high speed...

skybrary.aero

The CADC needs inputs from pitot/static and angle-of-attack (AOA) probes that are mounted OUTSIDE the airplane.

The Boeing 737 Probes

Technical website for Boeing 737 pilots and engineers. Site includes news, system and operating notes, technical photographs, databases and related links.

www.b737.org.uk

The entire process is a closed loop system.

The Flight Data Recorder (FDR) contains critical information about the FLCS, propulsion, environmental controls, lighting, and so on.

So for all of you guys who thinks just because you can operate a home PC, from DOS to Windows, means you can understand aviation to the point that you can preempt aviation mishap investigators, here is a hypothetical question...

What if the FDR recorded a command from the FLCC but NOT from cockpit? Is it possible that such a condition could occur?

 

[_Nabil_]

To give the benefit of doubt to @unrequitted_love_suzy, she must have been confused by the emoji which has tears and an open mouth which can in total look like a crying face. But she should have hovered the mouse on the emoji which would have popped up a text saying "Haha".

You are a so kind person, a slightly naive ......

 

[REhorror]

What a tragedy.
My condolences.

May the government fight the root cause.

 

[jamahir]

You are a so kind person, a slightly naive ......

Well, I just wrote a possibility.

 

[unrequitted_love_suzy]

Well, I just wrote a possibility.

thank you sir , indian people are kind

 

[jhungary]

What about sudden power lost? Will it cause a nose dive like that?

A news segment said Even if both engine lost power, aircraft are made so that they can glide over an extended period of time.

A nose dive crash usually mean catastrophic failure at the tail (which control the stabiliser) or it have to be manually drive into the ground. Plane don't generally nose dive into the earth.

You can pull out 737-800 casualties record. This is a very safe aircraft and perpendicular nose dive at cruise is only one case - the one we see now. Not to mention China has world BEST aviation safety.

Aviation Safety Network > ASN Aviation Safety Database > ASN Aviation Safety Database results

Aviation Safety Network: Aviation Safety Network: Databases containing descriptions of over 11000 airliner write-offs, hijackings and military aircraft accidents.

aviation-safety.net

View attachment 826151

China actually do not have the world best aviation safety. Qantas is the world safest airline according to airlinerating.com and New Zealand is the world safest country in term of aviation accident.

And I think this is still too early to say why that plane crash.

 

[unrequitted_love_suzy]

maybe the pilot had a bad arguement and decided to do a nose dive
a chinese bus driver , crashed his bus over the bridge into the sea for the same reason ...

 

[jamahir]

thank you sir , indian people are kind

You are welcome but many Indians are not kind. India is largely a non-empathetic, high competition and ruthless society where happens things from honor killings to system-enforced farmer suicides, to gangrape-murders, to parents-enforced student suicides to caste oppression to religious disharmony to mob lynchings to many other things. I will tag you soon in a recent thread of mine about a student suicide.

 

[Nan Yang]

3D Rendering. Look like the pilot managed to regain control for a while.

 

[Song Hong]

A news segment said Even if both engine lost power, aircraft are made so that they can glide over an extended period of time.

A nose dive crash usually mean catastrophic failure at the tail (which control the stabiliser) or it have to be manually drive into the ground. Plane don't generally nose dive into the earth.


China actually do not have the world best aviation safety. Qantas is the world safest airline according to airlinerating.com and New Zealand is the world safest country in term of aviation accident.

And I think this is still too early to say why that plane crash.

You want to compare Qantas total flying hours vs China airlines flying hours? And very little flight take off from New Zealand. You need to compare apple to apple.

 

[jhungary]

You want to compare Qantas total flying hours vs China airlines flying hours? And very little flight take off from New Zealand. You need to compare apple to apple.

First of all, this is not "My Comparison" This is a comparison from Airlinerating.com. Which is fully endorsed by IATA.

Second of all, Qantas Group is not really that small, compare to the Chinese biggest Airline (China Southern) Qantas Airline itself have 340 aircraft, Qantas Group (Qantas with Qantas Link and Jetstar) combine have roughly 540 aircraft, While China Southern Airline have somewhere around 620. The Entire Qantas Group service 190 destination compare to China Southern's 216

On the other hand, Qantas and its entire group does not have a single fatal accident since 1951 (Yes, the last time people died in a Qantas Jet, any Qantas Jet is in 1951, 71 years ago.) While China Southern last fatal accident is in 1997. Fun fact, the last time there are any fatality in a Qantas Flight, China Southern wasn't even established as an airline yet, and it would be roughly 30 years after the last Qantas Fatality...

So yes, Qantas IS the safest Airline in the world. And it is apple to apple.

Qantas - Airline Ratings

www.airlineratings.com

China Southern - Airline Ratings

www.airlineratings.com

 

[Song Hong]

Comparing the parent group ONLY, China Eastern is 7x bigger than Qantas. If you want to compare baby, you pull in all the Chinese airlines babies as well.

 

[STREANH]

3D Rendering. Look like the pilot managed to regain control for a while.

View attachment 826690

Looks eerily similar to the Alaska Airlines crash (MD-83).

 

[LeGenD]

Tragic incident and loss of life. My sincere condolences.

I merged this thread with another related thread.