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China is stumbling hard at acquiring the high-tech chip companies it wants so badly

Stole ? How ?

The US is an immigrant country, so if foreigners contributed, it was voluntary of their intelligence and hard word. Whereas, your China had to force foreign companies to get into partnerships where new technologies could be had for free.
The DIFFERENCE is we don't put a gun into any foreign experts head and tell them to work in China. Unlike you, you put a gun into ex-nazi scientists that if they don't work in the US, they would be put on trial.
Did I said "Science and Space should stop now"?

The problem for US and China is both countries are on a different scale when it come down to Space Exploration and Technology, and this gap is HUGE, what I meant huge is at least 40-50 years gap. You can of course denied that, but well, you are probably just lying to yourself.

The problem here is money, say, before ISS, there are 400 different experiment I want to do in space, thus building the ISS would serve to do all these 400 experiment, but after the ISS have been running on 30 + years, you don't have 400 experiment you want to run anymore, you have a few. And yes, it's like you said, Space Knowledge is unlimited, but from now on, the question US facing is not going to be as much as when they started, which mean they may have only a fraction of the question they will need to experiment on compare to when they just started the ISS back in 1998. While China just started this, they will have to go thru that 400 question, which justify the cost for the Chinese, but for the American, to keep a space station to solve a fraction of the question does not worth the money for.

This is the reason NOT JUST WHY US was not interested in space station with China, BUT ALSO WHY US WITHDREW FROM ISS in 2011 as well.
Who told you the US withdrew from the ISS? You sound like a naive soul to me. LOL
 
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The DIFFERENCE is we don't put a gun into any foreign experts head and tell them to work in China. Unlike you, you put a gun into ex-nazi scientists that if they don't work in the US, they would be put on trial.

Who told you the US withdrew from the ISS? LOL

NASA.

Russia in 2015 try to extend an offer to the US to "Extend" the ISS cooperation and the Chief of NASA did not accept this offer. Effectively withdraw from further ISS cooperation

http://spacenews.com/nasa-says-no-plans-for-iss-replacement-with-russia/
 
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The DIFFERENCE is we don't put a gun into any foreign experts head and tell them to work in China.
No, you have not. But that does not do away or even excuse the fact that China effectively coerced foreign companies into giving China whatever needed.

Unlike you, you put a gun into ex-nazi scientists that if they don't work in the US, they would be put on trial.
They did worked for a pretty bad government, at one time.

In fact, the father of your space rocket is an ex-Nazi. LOL
Robert Goddard was an ex-Nazi ? Considering Goddard was born in 1882. :lol:

Do you know how the USA rose to prominence? They stole British inventions during the industrial revolution, and the British were hella mad but there's nothing much they can do.
Everyone got their technologies honestly and dishonestly. Except that the PDF Chinese have always tried to portrayed China as 'honestly'.
 
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The truth of the matter is the US is a protectionist and ideologically against competition in the free market. The rest is just nonsense on your part. The main reason for this block is constraining our ability to catch up and there is a reason for that as we are the only country in the whole world capable to overtaking the US in technological prowess in this century. Had this been one of the European country, Sk, or Japan buying US tech, it would be a non-story.
The truth of the matter is the US is a protectionist and ideologically against competition in the free market. The rest is just nonsense on your part. The main reason for this block is constraining our ability to catch up and there is a reason for that as we are the only country in the whole world capable to overtaking the US in technological prowess in this century. Had this been one of the European country, Sk, or Japan buying US tech, it would be a non-story.

"Overtaking the US".....how many times have I heard that one? China is headed toward demographic decline, while the US population is relatively young and rising. We'll out-innovate you, just like we've done the last century. We've given the world the Airplane, Internet, Digital Revolution, breakthroughs in space, etc. How about China? You are all talk...
 
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After seeing all these failed attempts, I very appreciate the efforts made by China's government and companies. It shows how sober and hard mind the Chinese government and firms are to help the country to establish its own industry in the short board field.

Compared to its neighbors like Japan and S. Korea, China has always been facing a harsh and hostile business environment. But why China rises in such short time? You can also find the answer from those failed cases.
perhaps kite rises against & not with the wind??
 
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This is a dishonest argument.

You are essentially saying that the ISS could not be built unless multiple countries are involved, and yet you offered no credible TECHNICAL explanation on why not.

The International Space Station was originally planned to be multi-national in scope. If the US built Skylab back in the 1970s, we could build something as large as the ISS on our own.

You failed your own forum name.

Actually, you have failed to follow my argument. The argument proves China's ability to trounce restrictions, rather than show anyone else's ability to achieve any goals.

You're trying hard to belittle me. It doesn't befit your image as a professional.

Because the US move away from Space Station. Any sort of experiment you can do up there the American has already done it, as well as the Russian, French, Britain and don't forget, US actually did set aside the difference between Russian and the US to make it happen, the US wasn't interested in this (along with the Brits and French and even the Russian themselves) is mostly irreverent to China. (ISS ran from 1988 to 2011 for the US, that's 23 years)

If China want to start an international adventure in Space Station, Chinese should be aiming on country like South Korea, India, Brazil or other budding Space Nation for it, US, French, Brits, Russia all did their tour and it's basically for them, this is a waste of money to do it again....

I am talking about cooperation in all fields of science, not just space.

China are lacking behind in a lot more field than just three, FINTech, ICT Tech, Software and Biotech, just name a few.

Also, it's not about selling out, but about not being competitive, you don't pump money to float a company which lost their edge, you let go, but this time, you are talking about sensitive tech, this happens a lot. When you have a mature economy and market, you won't still have 100 competition on the same market, you only have a few and the other would be weed out.

Sir, maybe your comments should be limited to grunts exchanging machine gun fire! I am a Software Professional and some of my most intelligent, knowledgeable, and productive colleagues are Chinese graduates of Chinese universities.
 
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US president Donald Trump yesterday (Sept. 13) vetoed a Chinese private-equity firm’s proposed $1.3 billion purchase of Lattice Semiconductor, an Oregon-based chip manufacturer.

The deal’s failure marks the latest instance where foreign governments have pushed back against China’s efforts to acquire technology assets in their country, as China invests heavily in hardware and software companies at home and abroad.

The semiconductor industry in particular has been a focus of China’s ambitions, as chips are the brains of nearly every electronic device. But as of 2014, China still imported 90% of its semiconductors. As a result, the country has gone on a spending spree, buying up semiconductor companies all over the world.

Many of these deals have fallen through, however, due to pressure from the Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States (CFIUS), an inter-agency branch of the Treasury that examines foreign purchases of domestic companies and assesses their potential impact on national security. While CFIUS does not “block” deals outright, it can make “recommendations” to both parties involved that the deal ought to be terminated. If necessary, CFIUS will refer cases to the president, who then holds the power to veto the deals—which is what happened with Lattice.

Lattice marks the seventh such major deal that has collapsed since mid-2015, and it’s the second to be vetoed by the US president within that period. This list shows just how badly China is failing at acquiring foreign semiconductor technology.

Micron
The largest attempted Chinese takeover of a US semiconductor maker began in July 2015, when media revealed that Tsinghua Unigroup, a state-affiliated Chinese chipmaker with ties to with Tsinghua University in Beijing, wanted to buy Idaho-based Micron. Tsinghua Unigroup reportedly had put up $23 billion (paywall) to purchase the company.

Micron made it clear it was cold on the deal from the get-go. Just days after Tsinghua Unigroup’s bid hit news outlets, a source at Micron told Reuters the deal was likely not possible as CFIUS would probably recommend against it. In August that year, senator Chuck Schumer, a frequent critic of China, directly called on CFIUS to formally investigate the potential acquisition.

But the deal didn’t even get that far. Despite reports that Tsinghua’s chairman travelled to the US to talk to Micron, no further details about a deal emerged until November 2016, when Tsinghua confirmed it was not in any talks with the Idaho company.

Had both sides reached an agreement, the deal would have carried historic implications for the US tech industry. Micron to this day remains the last major US-based manufacturer of DRAM flash memory, a critical component in nearly all consumer electronic devices. Its American rivals all ceded ground to competitors in Japan, Korea, and Taiwan.

Fairchild Semiconductor
In December 2015, state-affiliated conglomerate China Resources Holdings made an unsolicited offer to purchase Fairchild Semiconductor, one of the oldest companies in Silicon Valley. The Chinese investors proposed paying $2.5 billion for the company, equivalent to $21.70 per share, a premium over what rival bidder, US-based On Semiconductor, had offered earlier. The Chinese suitors also offered a $108 million reverse termination fee in the event that CFIUS recommended against the purchase.

Despite the markup and the guarantee, Fairchild refused the offer in February 2016, stating that the deal presented an “unacceptable level of risk” of failing should it ever reach CFIUS. It ended up being sold to On Semiconductor in September 2016.

Lumiled
In March 2015, Dutch electronics giant Philips, which is also listed in the US, announced it intended to sell an 80% stake in Lumiled, a subsidiary that manufactures LEDs (light-emitting diodes), a semiconductor, to a Chinese consortium known as GO Scale Capital for $3.3 billion. In October, however, the company stated in its latest earnings report that CFIUS had “expressed certain unforeseen concerns” towards the deal, which could ultimately kill it.

The bid was dead by January 2016. “I am very disappointed about this outcome as this was a very good deal for both Lumileds and the GO Scale Capital-led consortium,” said Philips CEO Frans van Houten. While LEDs are generally associated with lighting, according to the New York Times, CFIUS held concerns that the gallium nitride used to make the components could also be used by China’s military (paywall). Philips eventually agreed to sell Lumiled to US-based private-equity firm Apollo Global Management in December 2016, at a discounted price of $2 billion.

Western Digital
In September 2015 Tsinghua Unisplendour, owned by the same parent as Tsinghua Unigroup, announced it intended to pay $3.78 billion for a 15% stake in Western Digital, the semiconductor maker best known for its hard-disk drive business. The company told investors it did not expect the deal to be subject to a CFIUS review because the stake was non-controlling. But in February 2016 Tsinghua backed out of the deal (paywall) once it became clear that a probe was indeed forthcoming. The two companies’ relationship didn’t end there, however. In September 2016 Western Digital and Tsinghua Unisplendour announced they had formed a China-based joint venture with Tsinghua as the majority shareholder.

GCS
In March 2016, California-based, Taiwan-listed semiconductor maker GCS announced it was in talks to be purchased by Sanan Optoelectronics, a Chinese maker of LED wafers and solar cells, for $226 million. In August, GCS confirmed that the deal had fallen through due to pressure from CFIUS. The body did not state its specific objections, but they likely stemmed from GCS’s contracts with the US military. Like Western Digital, GCS opted to form a joint venture with its Chinese suitor as an alternative.

Aixtron
In May 2016 China’s Fujian Grand Chip announced it had agreed to buy Germany’s Aixtron, a maker of semiconductor manufacturing equipment, for $752 million. In November, Aixtron announced that CFIUS told both parties there were “unresolved U.S. national security concerns regarding the proposed transaction.” Rather than kill the deal, Aixtron and Fujian Grand Chip said they would appeal the recommendation directly to president Barack Obama—who sided with CFIUS. The White House said that there was “credible evidence” that Fujian Grand Chip “might take action that threatens to impair the national security of the United States.” The process—a CFIUS warning, an appeal to the president, and then a veto–was the same process that led to the collapse of the Lattice deal.

https://qz.com/1077186/lattice-lscc...e-high-tech-chip-companies-it-wants-so-badly/
India also blocked a take over of a pharma company by chinese.
 
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NASA.

Russia in 2015 try to extend an offer to the US to "Extend" the ISS cooperation and the Chief of NASA did not accept this offer. Effectively withdraw from further ISS cooperation

http://spacenews.com/nasa-says-no-plans-for-iss-replacement-with-russia/

Because they were already collaborating with others

https://www.nasa.gov/press/2014/sep...-on-mars-exploration-earth-observing-mission/

Looks like you want to cooperate with only a select few. Biased, much?
 
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Actually, you have failed to follow my argument. The argument proves China's ability to trounce restrictions, rather than show anyone else's ability to achieve any goals.
What 'restrictions' are you talking about ?

To 'restrict' someone, first that person must have access to something, then you move in and try to deny him that access. No one can restrict China from having her own space program. No one tried to deny her people from learning advanced sciences. So what 'restrictions' are you talking about ?

What you tried to do was clear: That the ISS was possible only with international efforts.

"It took billions of dollars and collaboration of multiple countries to create the ISS. "

That was absurd.
 
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You brought in Nazi scientists and engineers and not to mention your archenemy Soviet Union to work in the US and you call that an immigrant country. In fact, the father of your space rocket is an ex-Nazi. LOL

One of the first thing the US invaders did in Germany was to occupy the German patent office and looted everything. Operation paperclip granted all Nazi scientist freedom by migrating and cooperating with the US.

BTW, don't forget who financed Hitler's rise.

BTW, the notorious sociopaths are defending their terrorist master.

How to detect a sociopath? It's the 2% of veterans who don't show any symptoms of post trauma syndrome after deployment in Afghanistan or Iraq. They enjoyed the killing.
 
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I am talking about cooperation in all fields of science, not just space.

The problem is, US did actually cooperate a lot with Chinese, do you know both country have a lot (I MEAN A LOT) of joint venture in Automobile Technology SAIC have a joint venture with GM since 1998, and having another Joint Venture with Volkswagen in 2006, Aviation Field we saw how AVIC have a joint Venture with Boeing in China, in FinTEch, we have seen Alibaba having Joint Venture with Western Union. US have a lot of cooperation with Chinese at company level with private venture.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/gm-saic-plan-to-jointly-design-new-cars-1438056061
http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2011-06...eing-Awards-737-Rudder-Contract-to-AVICs-CCAC
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1998/06/980626100030.htm
In Government Service, US and China had sign 10 years Climate Change Cooperation, along as Scientific Research Cooperation to Alternative Energy, Cleaning Energy System. Many other Oceanic Cooperation along the line for Under Water Survey with NOAA and USGS, just to name a few.

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.go...nnouncement-climate-change-and-clean-energy-c
https://www.c-span.org/video/?298126-101/uschina-local-government-cooperation-agreement
https://www.esrl.noaa.gov/news/2011/China_US_Agreement.html
Sir, maybe your comments should be limited to grunts exchanging machine gun fire! I am a Software Professional and some of my most intelligent, knowledgeable, and productive colleagues are Chinese graduates of Chinese universities.

So? I have a Degree in International Politics, and I have a Master of International Business with ICMS in Sydney, and just graduated from a Master of Philosophy with ANU in Strategic Studies and I wrote my thesis on Financial Technology in Strategic and Tactical planning, and I am currently in the process of starting my PhD in the same field. My wife is a Law Grad and a Doctor of Science in Far Eastern Relation from the University of Lund.

Are we qualified enough to comment on how China lagging behind in such field? My Software Professional?

By the way, you have not actually countered my point but question whether or not I am qualified to judge is Chinese lacking behind in those field, had you nominated some point, I would probably go along with your idea on how Chinese is ahead on any of the field I said, but in the end, you are just making an arse out of yourself
 
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BTW, don't forget who financed Hitler's rise.
Since 1937 Japan started invasion to China till 1941, USA was Japan's main(80%) oil and steel supplier. Which were all used in the war against China to kill our people.

People always say Chinese should be grateful to USA for its helping defeat Japan. But the fact is, the war wouldn't even be started without USA-Japan trade relationship.
 
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Because they were already collaborating with others

https://www.nasa.gov/press/2014/sep...-on-mars-exploration-earth-observing-mission/

Looks like you want to cooperate with only a select few. Biased, much?

You either are the biased one or you have not read my post before commenting it.

The article is for NASA to cooperate with India on Mars Mission, while I am talking about US have no further interest on International Space Station with the other member, US cooperate with other people, sure, but if you want a cooperation, you have to have things that benefit your own, at this point, China want Manned Space Mission, US wanted Deep Space and Mars Exploration. The interest does not lapse. There are nothing in it that the US want from China (China does not have a Mars Mission, nor any Deep space research), but there are a lot in it the Chinese want for the US, so why would US want a Cooperation with China now?

What China is doing is what NASA pushing into the Private Sector (ie Space X) if NASA themselves does not have enough funding to overlap what Space X do, what do you think for a US-Chinese Joint venture.

And yes, US wanted to cooperate with China, in other space related issue, would China be interested in those interest is up to the Chinese.

https://phys.org/news/2014-01-china-cooperation-space.html

But as I said, for the issue with ISS, the US wouldn't cooperate with EVERYBODY, not the Russian, not the Chinese, not the French, not the British. And that is the scope of my post.

In the end, aren't you biased much?

Since 1937 Japan started invasion to China till 1941, USA was Japan's main(80%) oil and steel supplier. Which were all used in the war against China to kill our people.

People always say Chinese should be grateful to USA for its helping defeat Japan. But the fact is, the war wouldn't even be started without USA-Japan trade relationship.

lol, how does that make sense? You know China back in 1920 to 1930 have also had Trade Relationship with Japan, then should we pin the war on the Chinese themselves?

The war started because US stopped and actually sanctioning the Japanese, and pushes the Japanese to engage southward for resource, you can say US pushes Japan to the decision to invade China and Russia, but you cannot say the war wouldn't even be started without US-Japan Trade relationship. Japan is going to invade with or without the resource they need.
 
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lol, how does that make sense? You know China back in 1920 to 1930 have also had Trade Relationship with Japan, then should we pin the war on the Chinese themselves?

The war started because US stopped and actually sanctioning the Japanese, and pushes the Japanese to engage southward for resource, you can say US pushes Japan to the decision to invade China and Russia, but you cannot say the war wouldn't even be started without US-Japan Trade relationship. Japan is going to invade with or without the resource they need.
Just like Hitler did in Europe, Japan invaded China step by step to test western reaction. Japanese were encouraged when they realized the western countries couldn't do anything to their aggression moves, not even a trade sanction. Which everyone knows it should be done cause exporting strategic materials to an invader is equal to exporting killing. And trade sanction could really work cause Japan itself doesn't have enough oil or steel to sustain the war.

Four years later after the war broke out, USA finally started the trade sanction. It's not because USA suddenly had mercy to China, but USA realized Japan was actually becoming a big threat to itself.
 
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Since 1937 Japan started invasion to China till 1941, USA was Japan's main(80%) oil and steel supplier. Which were all used in the war against China to kill our people.

People always say Chinese should be grateful to USA for its helping defeat Japan. But the fact is, the war wouldn't even be started without USA-Japan trade relationship.
Trade relationship is unimportant if it comes to politics.

China back in the days also was too unimportant hence the western powers didn't intervene. America started to respond with oil and scrap metal embargo when the Japanese occupied indochina with Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia. Because with the fall of Vietnam, not only the days of western possessions in SE Asia were numbered but the US bases in the western Pacific. The Japanese began to negotiate with the US with last offer to leave Indochina but the US sense Japanese weakness and demand more: Japan can keep Manchuria but must leave Indochina and mainland China. The offer was rejected by Japan. The war became unavoidable.
 
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