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China Inc.’s Boeing Rival Just Won’t Fly

China Inc.’s Boeing Rival Just Won’t Fly
A small order from an African airline can’t diminish the huge challenge Comac faces to disrupt the aviation duopoly.

By David Fickling - March 21, 2019 - Bloomberg

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Not ready for prime time: the C919. - Photographer: Qilai Shen/Bloomberg

It’s generally seen as a good thing for an aircraft manufacturer when an airline plans to buy its planes. So Commercial Aircraft Corp. of China Ltd. — the country’s would-be challenger to Boeing Co. and Airbus SE — should have a lot to celebrate.

Ghana’s Africa World Airlines Ltd. may agree to buy two of Comac’s ARJ21 regional jets this month, the carrier’s Chief Executive Officer John Quan told Moses Mozart Dzawu and Bruce Einhorn of Bloomberg News in an interview.

That looks like a fillip for Comac, especially considering the problems of Boeing’s 737 Max, which was grounded by Beijing’s regulators after two crashes in five months and now will be potentially excluded from a China-U.S. trade deal. The Chinese manufacturer would like to disrupt the existing commercial aircraft duopoly. Overseas purchases for the ARJ21 look like a step down that road.

Not so fast. Such a small order — from an airline part-owned by China’s debt-ridden HNA Group Co., no less — is hardly a ringing endorsement for a plane that’s been in development for the best part of two decades. Moreover, the travails of the 737 Max demonstrate just how challenging developing new aircraft is in the 21st century, let alone for a newcomer like Comac.

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About 60 percent of global air traffic passes through Europe or the U.S., and the two regions will still account for about half of the total by 2037, according to Boeing. As a result, it’s essential for any manufacturer seeking global relevance to get its planes certified as airworthy by the Federal Aviation Administration or European Aviation Safety Agency.

Without that piece of paper, aircraft are excluded from swaths of the world’s aviation market. That’s both a near-term problem — removing flexibility for global airlines in how they deploy their fleet — and a long-term one, killing off the bulk of the secondary market that carriers depend on for selling their worn-out aircraft.

With all their expertise at rolling out new models, Boeing and Airbus still struggle to complete that type certification in less than five years. One of the questions needing answers around the 737 Max is whether Boeing’s attempts to speed that process led to safety failures.

Comac first lodged an application for its would-be 737- and A320-killer, the C919, with the European regulator in 2016, so the best it could hope for would be to see approval some time in 2021. In the case of the ARJ21s being sent to Ghana, the process of winning certification from major regulators proved so challenging that Comac ultimately gave up. When the Republic of Congo — not exactly a major aviation market — became the first foreign country to award a type certificate two years ago, the manufacturer regarded it as enough of a milestone to put out a press release celebrating the fact.

Progress on getting the C919 certified seems to be going slowly, too. Comac plans to carry out 4,200 hours of flight tests, but the third of six planned prototypes took its maiden flight only in December and the rest won’t be ready until later this year. Flying all six for an hour a day, 365 days a year would require two years of testing alone, and even that looks ambitious. Existing prototypes are laid up undergoing modifications for as long as three months, the state-run China Daily reported last month. That could seriously push back the timetable.

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If everything goes to plan, it’s possible to see the C919 getting its paperwork in order before the start of 2022 — but at this rate, a date closer to 2025 would hardly be surprising. At current targeted production rates of around 60 a month for the A320neo and 737 Max, there will already be little shy of 10,000 competing Airbus and Boeing planes in the air by that time, and Boeing’s planned new midsize aircraft could be nearing its first deliveries.

Meanwhile, with maximum ranges about a third less than its competitors and the capacity to carry only about three-quarters of the weight of passengers and cargo, the C919 will be looking a generation out of date. Given it’s largely made of parts from conventional suppliers such as Honeywell International Inc. and General Electric Co., it’s going to be supremely challenging for Comac to find the cost savings necessary to undercut Boeing and Airbus outside China, where airlines will be more or less obliged to support the homegrown hero.

As George Ferguson and Francois Duflot of Bloomberg Intelligence wrote this week, all this means that rumors of an outright Chinese ban on the 737 Max are more likely to be posturing than serious proposals. At some point, the successors to the C919 may pose a formidable threat to Boeing and Airbus. For the next decade, though, the incumbents need not fret.

Source :. https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/a...-plane-isn-t-ready-to-challenge-boeing-airbus

Bloomberg has been slanting China more lately.

The US best geopolitical advantage is also its worst weakness. It is far away from the enemies, but it is also far away from the trade. China is at the center of Global's trade and the US can never beat China in terms of price and logistics. Majority of global's growth is going to be in Asia in the next decade, this is only going to help China and its neighbors.
 
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Bloomberg has been slanting China more lately.

The US best geopolitical advantage is also its worst weakness. It is far away from the enemies, but it is also far away from the trade. China is at the center of Global's trade and the US can never beat China in terms of price and logistics. Majority of global's growth is going to be in Asia in the next decade, this is only going to help China and its neighbors.

All of China's neighbors will hedge. USA is the hedge
 
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China has not gone anywhere
It has. I am middle aged. When I was at school the image of Beijing was poor, 3rd world and swarms of cycles. In just over 30 years look where they are. Now extrapolate that over next 30/60 years. It too USA a century to rise from Wild West to global supremacy by 1950s. We must also not forget that in history the default was China as a hyperpower. We just live in the hiatus in that status and as we move forward we will see China merely return to the normative status it had in history.
 
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How many Boeing jetliners does China operate ? How many Russian civil jetliners does China operate ?

What prevents Vietnams, Indias, Pakistans, Chinas of the world from buying Russian jetliners ?

Russian aircraft are inferior
- engine reliability
- noise
- safety
- avionics
- higher maintenance costs
- higher fuel costs
Keep on bragging about past glory is useless. We can buy all Airbus if we want since Boeing products are unsafe from now. Once again, you are avoiding the issue by sidetracking from how a brand new B737 Max 8 can be so unsafe despite deemed as approve from FAA.

They are in cahoots. Money is first, human lives are second are their motto. :enjoy:
 
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It has. I am middle aged. When I was at school the image of Beijing was poor, 3rd world and swarms of cycles. In just over 30 years look where they are. Now extrapolate that over next 30/60 years. It too USA a century to rise from Wild West to global supremacy by 1950s. We must also not forget that in history the default was China as a hyperpower. We just live in the hiatus in that status and as we move forward we will see China merely return to the normative status it had in history.

You conveniently deleted my comment on combat aircraft

Keep on bragging about past glory is useless. We can buy all Airbus if we want since Boeing products are unsafe from now. Once again, you are avoiding the issue by sidetracking from how a brand new B737 Max 8 can be so unsafe despite deemed as approve from FAA.

They are in cahoots. Money is first, human lives are second are their motto. :enjoy:

How many Russian civil jetliners does China operate ? How many Boeings does China operate ?
 
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Egypt is great civilization unrivaled 4000 years ago. So Egypt is the center of world now in 2019?

You are avoiding the problem with Boeing and FAA now.

The only difference is that Boeing still has 60% of the market in 2019
Boeing and Airbus are essentially a duopoly. Boeing beats Airbus hands down on profit. Business exist to make money.

It is possible FAA or Boeing made a mistake. There is no dodging. They cannot sweep it under the rug. We ain't China

Keep in mind Embraer, Bombardier have went bankrupt or have been acquired
Russians have been trying their luck. I expect China to get a little further than them. Given the nature of civil aviation business the odds are against China
 
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All of China's neighbors will hedge. USA is the hedge
You hedge with something that's reliable. The US is just not reliable.

Keep in mind Embraer, Bombardier have went bankrupt or have been acquired
Russians have been trying their luck.
No, no one should keep anything you said or ever will say "in mind". Brazil and Russia are tiny and China is gargantuan. That's all there is to it.

I expect China to get a little further than them.
"A little" :omghaha:
 
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You hedge with something that's reliable. The US is just not reliable.

Last time I checked no one has laid a glove on any of core American allies - Western Europe, Saudis, Japan, South Korea, Australia

America has dumped tin pot dictators - South Vietnames, Marcos in Philippines, Suharto in Indonesia. I would not confuse it for reliability
 
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Comac is still new and this even their first plane.

I don't think it's trustworthy, it probably will take 3 decades before its started to gain trust.
 
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The only difference is that Boeing still has 60% of the market in 2019
Boeing and Airbus are essentially a duopoly. Boeing beats Airbus hands down on profit. Business exist to make money.

It is possible FAA or Boeing made a mistake. There is no dodging. They cannot sweep it under the rug. We ain't China

Keep in mind Embraer, Bombardier have went bankrupt or have been acquired
Russians have been trying their luck. I expect China to get a little further than them. Given the nature of civil aviation business the odds are against China

You are trying to sweep under table. Its only China start making decision to ban B737 Max 8 that forces FAA and Boeing to ground. China airline safety standard is much superior than US. Your cheapshot will not work.

Everybody knows US try sweep under table and ignoring problem.
 
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Given the nature of civil aviation business the odds are against China
So is this Fukishima's 'End of History?' and the economic dominance that has been established in the American century is writ in granite ~ although even that analogy is incorrect as it weathers over time.

Even Egyptian civilization or even Pakistan's ancestors in the form of Indus Valley Civilization vanished ..

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For commercial aircraft, the biggest issue for China is engine and avionics.

For semiconductor, the biggest issue for China is semiconductor equipment.
 
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