What's new

China Halts Trading After Market Tumbles More Than 7 Percent

Arrrgghh! The PBC announced it's shooting for currency stability: ""Faced with the speculating forces, the central bank has the capabilities to keep the yuan basically stable at an reasonable equilibrium level". The PBC won't promote the proper role of speculation: shouldering risk. The "capabilities" the PGC are using are withdrawing yuan from circulation, to drive up demand. The problem is that destroys confidence and increases the push to move money abroad. They should be flooding the market with yuan and gold instead: the yuan to supply needed liquidity, gold to help stabilize the exchange rate.
 
.
Blame Politics for China’s Market Meltdown

China’s second trading halt in days, coming on the heels of a 7%-plus market plunge and followed by five-year currency lows, is being covered largely as an economic story. In some ways, that’s right. After all, China is in the middle of a debt crisis of epic proportions. The situation dwarfs even the U.S. subprime crisis if you think of it in terms of the pace of debt run up, the surest predictor of financial crises. Chinese debt has increased nearly three times faster over the last few years than U.S. debt did in the period between 2003 and 2007, leading up to the Great Recession.

But in an even more important way, China’s debt crisis and the global market crash that has followed is a political story. Investors are worried about debt, sure. But China has the financial resources to cover its debt, at least in the short term. What investors are really worried about is: What the heck is going on in Beijing? And, more particularly, is Xi Jinping, the power-consolidating Chinese president, a reformer who is helping China transition to a richer and more prosperous future, or a new emperor who will turn back the progress his country has made towards openness and market capitalism?

It’s the question that every investor is worried about right now. China, which has long past the days of double digit GDP growth, is now facing the most difficult economic transition that a country can make. It’s trying to go from being a poor nation to a middle income one. That’s a shift only three countries in Asia have made: Japan, South Korea, and Singapore. All three have much smaller and more manageable populations and political systems. The question is whether China, where unemployment is actually higher for college graduates than for factory workers, can create the sort of upmarket service economy needed to employ more skilled workers — and raise incomes to global middle class levels.

The jury is still very much out on whether this can happen. That’s in part because most every country in the world that has attempted this transition has had to open up its political system. That shift tends to go along with the type of economy that can produce the high-level intellectual property, legal stability, and personal and business security associated with middle income levels.

Xi and the Party claim that the recent consolidation of power is all about trying to make those changes. But the reality is their moves have also come with a rollback of press freedom, the jailing of business leaders and a pushback against those in the Party who disagree with the President’s decisions. Meanwhile, the stop-and-start government support for markets lends a haphazard quality to economic policy management. All of it has raised a big question about Chinese leadership. Is Xi Jinping the new Deng, a reformer who will help China make a true great leap forward? Or is he the new Mao, an autocrat who is undermining economic and political stability?

The truth is, nobody yet knows. Beijing, along with the Party itself, is a notorious black box. Official economic figures can’t be trusted. Most outside economists say Chinese growth may be as low as 2-4%, as opposed to the official figure of 7%. What is known is that debt run-ups of the kind that China has undergone rarely end well.

Ruchir Sharma, the head of macroeconomics and emerging markets for Morgan Stanley Investment Management, has run the numbers since 1960 for 150 countries. He isolated the 30 most severe credit binges, defined as a rapid growth in the private debt of a country over a five-year period. In every case, he found that countries with major debt run-ups experienced a significant slowdown over the next five years, with GDP growth more than halving on average. Meanwhile, 18 out of these 30 countries also suffered a financial crisis in the next five years.

The U.S. did not even make Sharma’s list for its 2003-07 period debt binge, when its debt increased around 25%. That’s compared to the 40% or higher increases for the 30 most extreme cases. The increase in China’s debt to GDP between 2008 and 2013 was around 70% — the largest for any developing country in history. That alone is reason for the Chinese markets to be dropping.

China's Debt Crisis Is Also a Political One
 
.
The Indian stock market and the chinese stock market is unhinged...There aren't any direct collaterals. ..what happens is the that the FII's pull out partially from other markets to cut their losses from Pulling out from the chinese market.

That's the reason why most major markets see a temporary slump.. The FII's investing in the chinese markets are the same one's who are investing in the Indian bourses...They pull out so that they make profits in some markets to compensate what they have lost in the chinese bourse.

Nothing will happen to the Indian stock market even if the chinese market collapses completely..The losses in other markets will only be temporary.

you dont have a clue indian

Nearly all of the stock markets run on their own except for HK and China where a lot of companies are listed on both stock exchanges.

But all of the stock markets are directly linked to the welfare of the world's economy and politics, also due to globalisation, companies that are listed on a particular stock exchange usually engage in worldwide trading. Do you think for large conglomerates like Tata which is procuring some of its raw material and spare parts from China and then selling its cars in Shanghai would not be affected by the performance of the Chinese Stock exchange if its suppliers or dealers are in financial trouble? A systemic risk in one market would cause an unsystemic risk in another. The fact is due to its growing impact on the world's economy, the rise and fall of the Chinese economy can affect the world a lot more than other economies, ahem, like that of india, the Philippines etc

No body except the indians and their closely related will notice the impact of the perennial problems in indian rupees

The fall of indian stock market or even the collapse of it will have much less of an impact on the rest of the world to the point of probably obliviouness relative to China's should we be facing the same which is unlikely

images
 
Last edited:
.
Sensex and Nifty fell because of Chinese market. Remember Chinese share market opens before the Indian Market. Read the news if u can't understand the market trends.
and they will rise rather they will breach historical highs after GST in is passed regardless of crashes in chinese markets which will happen in future too .

India does not have much exposure to chinese market. So not an issue. Its more of FII's pulling out money in panic.
no , it is because the important bills were not passed .

Just wanted to know that is it in China or all over the world that the stock markets are closed if it falls 7% in a day?
only china
 
.
Trying to figure out what it takes to fix things. Probably several hundred billion dollar-equivalent of liquidity, both international and domestic. It will take a substantial bite out of the gold reserves (that China foolishly dumped in the late 1990s, then waited too long to rebuild) and whatever currency swap China can get out of the Brits, who (based on the U.S. experience in 2008) will demand China's cb completely expose all its bad debt secrets before agreeing to act (and maybe not even after that, they aren't nicknamed "perfidious Albion" for nothing. U.S. treasury officials have another even more vulgar expression, but it violates PDF guidelines to post it here). But I guess it's the Brits who have the largest chunk of available foreign renminbi liquidity available at the moment.
 
.
Its pretty meaningless in terms of Chinas economy, alot of people will lose money but it really makes zero difference to the economy. Starting to remind me of Spain though, lots of stupid unnecessary development all over with little use for it, even in China with its money it means bad results.
 
.
I don't reply to chinese posters here because most are dumb and you are one more prime example of a commie fart..

The chinese stock market collapse has nothing to do with Indian bourses..and see if that you dragged Indian bourses in your first post itself..let me give you a clue here about Indian bourses..chinese haven't invested on Indian bourses...except perhaps for a few HK companies most likely. .neither are any chinese companies listed..nor any chinese and Indian collaboration companies listed to cause any major impact. .

The only global impact when any market collapses is when global investors make losses and do corrections in other markets....

You brought in a completely unrelated stuff about sourcing...The world economy moved on too even when your forefathers were growing and selling rice..companies will adopt..and will not stop their operations if cheap chinese stuff is unavailable...btw.

let's call this a halt and I have reported your irrational termperament which aimed to start a fight instead of having a meaningful discussion

.
 
.
let's call this a halt and I have reported your irrational termperament which aimed to start a fight instead of having a meaningful discussion

.

Lol...Looks like I hurt your sentiments, I gave you a perfectly decent reply...don't act funny if you cannot take it in return...and try to be rational to seniors here. .now run to your chinese mod...I know how rational he is..not..
 
.
Lol...Looks like I hurt your sentiments, I gave you a perfectly decent reply...don't act funny if you cannot take it in return...and try to be rational to seniors here. .now run to your chinese mod...I know how rational he is..not..

I dont want to waste time with trolls
This is my last dialogue with you

images
 
.
Trying to figure out what it takes to fix things.

A good old Hammer and a Nail. Hammer being the US Dollar and the nail being the Chinese Yuan (literally) and some oversight from the WB!! :enjoy:

But we've JUST lost 2016's projected growth in markets across the globe. Say goodbye to "Bullish markets" in majority or all of the 2016!! Thank you China, for some serious financial losses I've incurred in the past 72 hours!!
 
.
meh it's nothing when compared to ASEAN financial crisis in 97-98

what China need to do is, regulate the hot investment and made sure not much money flow out from your country. Prepare and make caution for what FED will do with their interest rate. Devaluate Yuan value right now into some manageable level will be hurts for now, but it will be a cushion for what will happened if FED chose to raising their interest rate and spur investor to relocate their portofolio toward US market.
 
.
Ah, the Chinese have suspended their "circuit breakers". Tomorrow will be an interesting day...

Chinese equity markets are highly volatile right now and anything they do to potentially stabilize that market improves the outlook for U.S. equities,” Krishna Memani, chief investment officer at Oppenheimer Funds Inc. in New York, said by phone. “They don’t have a whole lot of experience controlling and monitoring markets and they’ve been going about it ham-handedly making the situation far worse than it needs to be.”
 
.
Chinese equity markets are highly volatile right now and anything they do to potentially stabilize that market improves the outlook for U.S. equities,” Krishna Memani, chief investment officer at Oppenheimer Funds Inc. in New York, said by phone. “They don’t have a whole lot of experience controlling and monitoring markets and they’ve been going about it ham-handedly making the situation far worse than it needs to be.”



images


,
 
.
A good old Hammer and a Nail. Hammer being the US Dollar and the nail being the Chinese Yuan (literally) and some oversight from the WB!! :enjoy:

But we've JUST lost 2016's projected growth in markets across the globe. Say goodbye to "Bullish markets" in majority or all of the 2016!! Thank you China, for some serious financial losses I've incurred in the past 72 hours!!
I feel your pain as I just dived in and bought some emerging market ETF. But as a "professional" gambler, *cough*, investor, I learn to chill out and not to blame anyone for my investment loss.
 
.
Journalists are calling the effect upon the U.S. stock market, "China in a bull shop" - mindless destruction of capitalization due to poor currency rate and liquidity management by China's PBC. They have lost a lot of their hard-won international credibility today.

While the PBC has started injecting liquidity into the system, they are not doing so to scale, they are thinking like China is a middle-size economy, and they aren't taking all the measures they should to alleviate consumer (not just business) liquidity demand.

Nor, apparently, are the Chinese yet appealing to other CBs for reverse currency swaps and other necessary interventions that would prop the renminbi. (Perhaps that's because ownership of some of China's foreign assets like mines and commercial property would go into other hands.)
 
.

Country Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom