Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[Stannis Baratheon]

WS-15 turbo jet

Turbofan.

 

[Beidou2020]

Stopped reading after the first paragraph.

 

[Deino]

A new one ...

 

[RAMPAGE]

Hope you guys clear it for export to Pakistan. Then we can skip 4th Gen twin engine fighter and jump to 5th Gen.

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

Hope you guys clear it for export to Pakistan. Then we can skip 4th Gen twin engine fighter and jump to 5th Gen.

It has already been said before that J20 isn't for export.

 

[Beast]

Hope you guys clear it for export to Pakistan. Then we can skip 4th Gen twin engine fighter and jump to 5th Gen.

Hope PAF invest in J-31 project. PAF after USA and China to operate a 5th gen fighter will be a massive milestone.

 

[S. Martin]

With canard, TVC is not needed. Do you see Rafale, Typhoon needed TVC?

I don't think it's no needed, but just not available due to technology limit or cost limit. You can see TVC work well on SU30-MKI, which has cannard obviously.

 

[Beast]

I don't think it's no needed, but just not available due to technology limit or cost limit. You can see TVC work well on SU30-MKI, which has cannard obviously.

How did you know Su-30MKI really work very well? Is flanker seriously design by Indian or Russian? Dont be misled by India media or western hype of Su-30MKI.

Will you trust Russian designer for their latest Su-35 design compare to Su-30MKI? Su-30MKI is a designed based on Indian request. They have no idea what is the best. If Indian is paying Russian money, the Russian will do it on Indian request. Will Russian bother to tell Indian, this design is not that good?

 

[S. Martin]

How about this little bird?

 

[Beast]

How about this little bird?
View attachment 263793

Does J-20 has thrust vector? My stance is you have canard then you have no thrust vector. You have thrust vector then you have no canard. I never say canard is no good. But if you think having both canard and vector at the same time will make it more invincible then I fully disagreed. It is redundant. I am sure, designer of China , western europe of Typhoon and Rafale will agree with my stance. Rafale, typhoon have canard but not TVC, same as J-20 and J-10. Russian has TVC but not canard as proven on their latest Su-35. They try it and prove it is a massive failure which they eliminated the canrd on their final design of Su-35.

 

[S. Martin]

How did you know Su-30MKI really work very well? Is flanker seriously design by Indian or Russian? Dont be misled by India media or western hype of Su-30MKI.

Will you trust Russian designer for their latest Su-35 design compare to Su-30MKI? Su-30MKI is a designed based on Indian request. They have no idea what is the best. If Indian is paying Russian money, the Russian will do it on Indian request. Will Russian bother to tell Indian, this design is not that good?

It may be because they have different pursues of function characters to meet their different needs. Russia choose no cannard version so as to have heavier payload or get longer combat range, while india choose to increase the fight dog capability, not aiming to get too large range.
Su30-MKI seemed to have shown its good maneuver ability in the allied exercise between Inida air force and UK air force this year.

 

[Beast]

It may be because they have different pursues of function characters to meet their different needs. Russia choose no cannard version so as to have heavier payload or get longer combat range, while india choose to increase the fight dog capability, not aiming to get too large range.
Su30-MKI seemed to have shown its good maneuver ability in the allied exercise between Inida air force and UK air force this year.

I have never heard about Russian designer of Su-35 ditching canard for the sake of long range and lighter weight. Su-35 designer priority is to maximise its dogfight capabilities and to match against the best. Outstanding Dogfight capabilities is one of the most important requirement of Su-35. If canard and vector combo could give Su-35 such important winning factor in dogfight, i am sure Sukhoi designer will surely choose this route. But the fact is, it ditch the canard for vector engine. Mind you, Su-35 is a conventional design, the vector route will be more relevant than canard compare to canard for delta wing configuration.

If you still trust an Indian design of Su-30MKI over Su-35, I am utterly disappoint in your judgement or maybe you shall change your flags.

 

[S. Martin]

I have never heard about Russian designer of Su-35 ditching canard for the sake of long range and lighter weight. Su-35 designer priority is to maximise its dogfight capabilities and to match against the best. Outstanding Dogfight capabilities is one of the most important requirement of Su-35. If canard and vector combo could give Su-35 such important winning factor in dogfight, i am sure Sukhoi designer will surely choose this route. But the fact is, it ditch the canard for vector engine. Mind you, Su-35 is a conventional design, the vector route will be more relevant than canard compare to canard for delta wing configuration.

If you still trust an Indian design of Su-30MKI over Su-35, I am utterly disappoint in your judgement or maybe you shall change your flags.

Definitely I didn't draw a conclusion of Indian design of Su-30MKI over Su-35. And I even don't understand why you say I shall change my flags? Is there any relation with a techincal discussion? My ideas is simple that every design has its gain and loss, just depends on what the designer or user needs/favors.

 

[Beast]

Definitely I didn't draw a conclusion of Indian design of Su-30MKI over Su-35. And I even don't understand why you say I shall change my flags? Is there any relation with a techincal discussion? My ideas is simple that every design has its gain and loss, just depends on what the designer or user needs/favors.

Using MKI as a standard to gauge aviation benchmark compare to a Russian Su-35 is an failure in the first place. Too many Chinese suffer the inferiority complex that they need to seek foreign ideas as the best. The rise of China has happen and its equally important Chinese themselves must believe in it and trust it. The western bashing is always there and they will rubbish whatever they can to shake the Chinese faith. Never trust the usual western media and their hype especially regards to Chinese or anti-west.

The US like to brag how superior their M1A1 tank and bash Russia T-72 or Chinese Type 99A2 as complete failure and claim T-72 as a coffin tank due to the weapon loading compartment cramping together with crew while overhype and praise their blast off and ammunition seperate compartment as perfect to save crew in case of a penetration and claim its the bench mark to follow. I seen too many naive reader easily believe the US hype. The greatest threat to Chinese is not western propangada but when Chinese dont even believe in China and need to seek a foreign source for validation.

Let see if whether the ammo blast off compartment can really protect the crew from this cooking?

Do you still believe US overhype?

@cirr, @SinoSoldier , @cnleio

 

[S. Martin]

Using MKI as a standard to gauge aviation benchmark compare to a Russian Su-35 is an failure in the first place. Too many Chinese suffer the inferiority complex that they need to seek foreign ideas as the best. The rise of China has happen and its equally important Chinese themselves must believe in it and trust it. The western bashing is always there and they will rubbish whatever they can to shake the Chinese faith. Never trust the usual western media and their hype especially regards to Chinese or anti-west.

The US like to brag how superior their M1A1 tank and bash Russia T-72 as complete failure and claim T-72 as a coffin tank due to the weapon loading compartment cramping together with crew while overhype and praise their blast off and ammunition seperate compartment as perfect to save crew in case of a penetration and claim its the bench mark to follow. I seen too many naive reader easily believe the US hype. The greatest threat to Chinese is not western propangada but when Chinese dont even believe in China and need to seek a foreign source for validation.

Let see if whether the ammo blast off compartment can really protect the crew from this cooking?

Do you still believe US overhype?

Buddy, it seems you goes too far and beyond our discussion. Neither did I say any words of looking down to our designs nor dids I say I believe US overhype. Right? So could you please not label me with ideology idea and throughly distort my talking? What I say it's just the choose of design, not related with polictics. I believe you're a patriot, but not to too nervous and not let it destroy our calm thinking and talking.

Do you think is it possible that Russia use a better TVC while the India verison use a inferior version?If so, this may can explain from another view that why SU-35 no need cannard and India version need. I don't exactly have such knowledge of this area, just as a amateur's hobby .