Can Muslims sing "Vande_Mataram"?

[gubbi]

The topic under discussion is about Principle. Vande Mataram or anything like that could not be chanted. If there are Muslims who still chant, then those are deviating from the Principles of Islam and by doing so they don't become any better Muslims or better citizens of India.

Let me clarify that part here. So if a Muslim, who is a thorough gentleman, fulfilling each and every need of Islamic principles, including steadfast devotion to country and duty, will cease to be a good muslim and a good citizen only by just uttering these verses, which in fact praise the motherland a.k.a. country?
God(s) is/are so unforgiving, aint it?
No wonder!

 

[mikkix]

So 95% muslims are munafiqeen ???

As you said that its Allah who knows it then how come you have come up with this figure ?

Do you know the repercussions of such allegation? Dont be silly and just mind your own business and faith. What others believe and what relation they have with Allah is purely between them and Allah and only he know the best. Not you or me or anyone else.

Please refrain from such generalisations.

I said Allah knows better, but Allah clearly identifies those people who acts like a Muslim but they are MunaFiqeen, Quran defines the munaFiqeen in the Quran in Surah Ale Imran, Chapter 4..
Plz feel free to ask..

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

what is it to do with the thread description?
Trolling?

Not trolling. See the list of prohibitions any one can make it never ending if they prefer the taliban way of interpreting khuran. Imagin if taking photo of women is sin how do they go take id's and passports ? If looking at a women wearing short skirts or sleev less blouse is sin how do muslims live in modern world ?
so come out of shell and behave liberal.Remember man is not created for law but law is created for man.Dont always take literal meaning of law grow up to understand the sprit of the law.

 

[MilesTogo]

How do you know the will of God?

if Mata means mother then it is a shirk...
Shirk= include anyone with God Almighty..
if mata means nation it is Kufur
Kufur= going against the will of God

in taaza khudaon mai bara sub se watan hai
jo perhan is ka hai wo mazhab ka kafan hai..
(Dr. Iqbal)
there are 1.5 billion Muslims in the world but only 5% are practicing Muslims..
others are munafiqeen
Munafiqeen= under the umbrella of Islam they behave like Muslims but they are not and Allah Knows that..
I can also be there on that list...

 

[raleigh22]

Yeah but there are efforts being done in the Indian political stage to impose it.

Those who oppose Vande Mataram should go to Pakistan:Uddhav Thackeray - Mumbai - City - The Times of India

Regarding imposing Vande Mataram on anyone, I think the issue has already been settled by the Supreme Court in 1985 in a similar case.

The case involved a child who was a Jehova's witness being kicked out of school for not singing the National Anthem.
The Supreme Court held in that case:

There is no provision of law which obliges anyone to sing the National Anthem nor is it disrespectful to the National Anthem if a person who stands up respectfully when the National Anthem is sung does not join the singing.
...
The question is not whether a particular religious belief or practice appeals to our reason or sentiment but whether the belief is genuinely and conscientiously held as part of the profession or practice of religion. Personal views and reactions are irrelevant. If the belief is genuinely and conscientiously held it attracts the protection of Art. 25

In light of the above judgement, I do not think Uddhav Thackeray, or anyone else can impose Vande Mataram, whatever they might claim.

 

[MilesTogo]

Are we even capable of insulting God? It is like cars insluting humans. God is beyond insult.

No matter what one does, he/she can not insult God.

 

[Hyde]

I said Allah knows better, but Allah clearly identifies those people who acts like a Muslim but they are MunaFiqeen, Quran defines the munaFiqeen in the Quran in Surah Ale Imran, Chapter 4..
Plz feel free to ask..

Munafiqeen were those who used to worship other than God. Who used to come to the Muslims confessing they are worshipping the lord of the universe (Allah) and when go back to their own peoples they used to worship their own lords too. Those were the Munafiqeens who used to pretend to be Muslims. Those were the munafiqeen for whom Allah says in the Qur'an that they think they are deceiving the God but in fact they are deceiving to themselves only.

Here you can talk about Practising Muslims and non-practising Muslims. Do not call them munafiqeens, its entirely a different topic. I would rather call them Good or bad Muslims.

 

[Beskar]

Deleted posts; 101
Members banned; 5

Any more trolling/racism will earn you a ban. Anyone trying to be a backseat moderator will earn an infraction. If you see something wrong REPORT it and move on.

By the looks of it, this thread is running out of gas. Enjoy it while it lasts, fellas!

P.S All the 101 offtopic, oneliner, abusive, personal attack posts were deleted with a single reason. Your post might not have been "Total Crap" but it sure was something from the above mentioned reasons.

 

[Pride]

This is the same way of discussing if nations is bigger than religion or not? What about Pakistani Brits who sing "God Save the Queen"? Are not they muslims or they literally skip this part??

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

LAW IS MADE FOR MAN MAN IS NOT MADE FOR LAW. REMEMBER WHAT JESUS SAID WHO IS A PROPHET ACCORDING TO ISLAM. HE JUSTIFIED HIS FOLLOWERS WHO HAD RICE PELLETS ON 'SABETH DAY '.
IF BOW DOWN MEANS SHOWING RESPECT FOR SOME BODY THERE IS NO HARM IN IT.IT IS NOT THE GESTURE BUT THE INTENTION MATTERS.
BOW DOWN, SHAKE HAND,SALUTE OR WHAT EVER ALL THESE ACTIONS ARE MEANING LESS UNLESS WE GIVE THEM MEANING.SAME ACTION CAN HAVE DIFFERENT MEANING IN DIFFERENT CULTURE.SO IT NOT THE ACTION BUT MEANING AND PURPOSE IS IMPORTANT.WHEN QURAN SAYS YOU SHOULD 'NOT BOW DOWN ' THE MEANING OF BOW DOWN IS DIFFERENT.SAME WORD OR SAME ACTION CAN HAVE DIFFERENT MEANING IN DIFFERENT PLACES,SITUATIONS AND CULTURE.
MODERATORS SHOULD CLOSE THIS THREAD IF IT TOUCHES THE SENSITIVITIES OF PEOPLE.

 

[humanfirst]

What we see here is a taliban style interpretation of "vande mataram".Firstly "i bow to thee" can either mean bowing out of submission(as muslims bow five times a day)and bowing out of respect(like indians bow their heads before teachers and chinese bows at each other,where no submission is meant)And mother here can means mythical bharatmata or just " mother land".If i mean "i respect you motherland"is there any shirk in it?I am 100%sure muslims mean only "i respect you mother land"when they sing that song.Don't islam teaches that ones action will be judged on his intention? please refrain from calling them munafiqs/kafir for singing that
A a lot of pakistani groups have damaged the image of islam and stability of pakistan by calling some other groups (and sometimes establishment) kafirs and killing and bombing whom they consider kafirs.If you guys haven't learned anything from that,from the weekly fireworks,please continue to do so but please leave indian muslims out of it.

What i mean to say is calling someone else munafiqs without knowing their heart will create problems which can evidently be seen in present state of pakistan.So "can indian muslims sing vande mataram"is to be decided based on their interpretation of this song,quran and sunnah and not by some takfiri pakistanis who are famous for killing each other/bombing sufi shrines/bombing religious centres and processions of opposite sects etc accusing them of takfir.I request mods to close this thread because the question"can xxxx do xxxx islamically" is one of the root causes of many troubles in pakistan and else where.

 

[TaimiKhan]

This is the same way of discussing if nations is bigger than religion or not? What about Pakistani Brits who sing "God Save the Queen"? Are not they muslims or they literally skip this part??

What has God Save the Queen to do anything with the topic ??

Where in God Save the Queen does religious terminology comes in ??

Is the Queen asking to bow infront of her or is she saying she is a God ??

 

[KingPin]

Ok can we have multiple versions of the same thing. Hindus do consider mother equivalent to goddess and when they say Vande matram they take it to the religious side. As far as muslims in India are concerned when they sing vande matram they mean that they respect the mother. Just because Hindus are considering the mother as equivalent to goddess does not mean that she becomes goddess to other person. If as idol worshipper if i go into a mosque and pray to Allah does the same Allah becomes impure or something. I dont think so....

 

[kugga]

in taaza khudaon mai bara sub se watan hai
jo perhan is ka hai wo mazhab ka kafan hai..
(Dr. Iqbal)


This is what Islam teaches us.. Our God is only one GOD Allah no country, no patriotism can be superior than our GOD and our Religion...

 

[Fireurimagination]

C'mon guys who in the real world believe in this 'Fatwa' nonsense, I remember someone gave a fatwa that Muslims cannot be photographed and hence somebody asked the high court to have voter ID cards of India muslims without photos or with burqa LOL I mean can you believe it God sake it's the 21st century

Mulla also say family planning or Sania's skirt or Salman's shirt etc are anti-Islamic, I don't know what an educated Indian Muslim has to say about that. What if a Muslim sings the song sexy, sexy, sexy will it be fine or is it same as Vande-Mataram his DNA structure will alter and he will no longer be a Muslim. Mulla's are nothing but a bunch of illiterate and ignorant people