can IRAN & PAKISTAN have a joint space program ?

[SOHEIL]

Don't get too carried away, relations with Iran are diplomatic and cordial. The problem when you co-op with a nation is you do reveal a lot of your technology and information. Most Iranians have a negative view of Pakistan and we should take that into factor. If they want they can go and co-op a space program with their other Chabahar friend.

As for now I say Pakistan-China-Turkiye these countries can trust each other and have potential and all have capable engineers and scientist on Pakistan and China teams already have experience working together. Iran is another case it is more of a wild card, not certain about Iran and what exactly it can offer besides oil as a trade off for entry into the partnership.

you forgot one thing !!!

we are muslims

 

[W.11]

try it by involving some other nation having top space tech.

india i guess??

---------- Post added at 12:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:16 AM ----------

IRAN is sanctioned but have most advanced space program in region

what china had do for pakistan ?

launched satellites into space

 

[Paan Singh]

india i guess??

---------- Post added at 12:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:16 AM ----------



launched satellites into space

russia...........

 

[Edevelop]

Space is a good, but frankly its useless for us. What do we want to get out of space? The only thing i can think of is making and sending a spy satellite. This lies in a military program and that can be useful!

 

[Hack-Hook]

Space is a good, but frankly its useless for us. What do we want to get out of space? The only thing i can think of is making and sending a spy satellite. This lies in a military program and that can be useful!

Space is future , if you don't invest in it you must be ready for another era of colonization.
in 16 and 17 centuries many country get colonized by European because they simply didn't
invest in their Navy and fleets .

 

[lem34]

I think Not only Pakistan and Iran but China and Russia will eventually be drawn together because their interests are and will continue to converge. Relevant article I put up:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-...d-pakistan-our-neighbourhood.html#post2677808

 

[Serpentine]

Not only in Space program.
I hope someday India and Pakistan achieve a permanent peace and then we all together can establish a defense/economical/political zone which extends from Persian Gulf to southern Asia.We all have something that other one doesn't have.
Iran with huge petroleum reserves,easy access to central Asian countries and also Caspian sea.
Pakistan with an excellent human source and an important role in region and also a bridge for ties between India and China and also a shared border with both Iran and India.
India with a fast growing economy,huge population and a bridge to eastern Asia.
Gush if this happens,it's going to be fabulous.I know it's more like a dream,but we can make our dreams happen in real life.

 

[lem34]

Not only in Space program.
I hope someday India and Pakistan achieve a permanent peace and then we all together can establish a defense/economical/political zone which extends from Persian Gulf to southern Asia.We all have something that other one doesn't have.
Iran with huge petroleum reserves,easy access to central Asian countries and also Caspian sea.
Pakistan with an excellent human source and an important role in region and also a bridge for ties between India and China and also a shared border with both Iran and India.
India with a fast growing economy,huge population and a bridge to eastern Asia.
Gush if this happens,it's going to be fabulous.I know it's more like a dream,but we can make our dreams happen in real life.

Unlikely India has for all intents and purposes thrown its lot in with the Americans. Its just a facade that India and Iran are on the same page.


Mr M K Bhadrakumar a former Indian respected diplomat stated:

If you could at least be kind enough to read the parts I have highlighted the picture should become a bit clearer for you as to India's dilemma

Dai Bingguo heading for Islamabad


Francis Fukuyama wrote a sequel to his celebrated book The End of History and the Last Man (1992) no sooner than he realised that he was hopelessly wrong in his prediction that the global triumph of political and economic liberalism was at hand. He wrote: “What we may be witnessing is not just the end of the Cold War, or the crossing of a particular period of postwar history, but the end of history as such… That is, the end point of mankind’s ideological evolution and the universalization of Western democracy as the final form of human government.” But in no time he realised his rush to judgment and he retracted with another book.

However, unlike the celebrated American neocon thinker, Indian foreign policy thinkers who were heavily influenced by his 1992 thesis are yet to retract. The Indian discourses through the 1990s drew heavily from Fukuyama to throw overboard the scope for reinventing or reinterpreting ‘non-alignment’ in the post-Cold War setting and came to a rapid judgment that Russia belonged to the dustbin of history. Our discourses never really got updated despite Fukumaya’s own retraction.

Indeed, western commentators also fuelled the consequent sense of insecurity in Delhi through the 1990s by endorsing that India would never have a ‘Russia option’ again and Boris Yeltsin’s Russia itself was inexorably becoming an ‘ally’ of the west — and, therefore, what alternative is there for India but to take to the New American Century project? Remember the drama of the Bill Clinton administration arm-twisting Yeltsin not to give to India the cryogentic engines?

In sum, India got entrapped in a ‘unipolar predicament’. The best elucidation of this self-invited predicament has been the masterly work titled Crossing the Rubicon by Raja Mohan, which was of course widely acclaimed in the US. While releasing the book at a function in Delhi, the then National Security Advisor Brajesh Mishra even admitted that India’s main foreign policy challenge was somehow to engage the US’s “attention”.

Russia, of course, went on to prove our pundits completely wrong. Russia remerged as a global player and the evidence of it is today spread (and is poised to expand) all across global theatres — Libya, Syria, Iran, Central Asia, Afghanistan, etc.
Why I am underscoring all this is that I am strongly reminded of that sad chapter in the recent history of India’s foreign policy when I see the huge ‘psywar’ being let loose on Pakistan currently when that country too is at a crossroads with regard to its future policy directions in a highly volatile external enviornment.

In Pakistan’s case, the ‘psywar’ substitutes Russia with China. The US’s ‘Track II’ thesis is that China is hopelessly marooned in its own malaise so much so that it has no time, interest or resources to come to Pakistan’s aid, the two countries’ ‘all-weather friendship’ notwithstanding. Let me cull out two fine pieces of this ongoing ‘psywar’.

One is the lengthy article featured by America’s prestigious flag-carrier Foreign Affairs magazine in early December titled “China’s Pakistan conundrum”. Its argument is: ‘China will not simply bail out Pakistan with loans, investment, and aid, as those watching the deterioration of US-Pakistani relations seem to expect. China will pursue politics, security, and geopolitical advantage regardless of Islamabad’s preferences’. It puts forth the invidious argument that China’s real use for Pakistan is only to “box out New Delhi in Afghanistan and the broader region.”

Alongside the argument is the highly-tendentious vector that is beyond easy verification, namely, that US and China are increasingly ‘coordinating’ their policies toward Pakistan. Diplomacy is part dissimulation and we simply don’t know whether the US and China are even anywhere near beginning to ‘coordinate’ about ‘coordinating’ their regional policies in South Asia, especially with regard to Pakistan (and Afghanistan). The odds are that while the US and China may have some limited convergent interests, conceivably, their strategic interests are most certainly in sharp conflict.

A milder version of this frontal attack by US pundits on Pakistan’s existential dilemma appears in Michael Krepon’s article last week titled ‘Pakistan’s Patrons’, which, curiously, counsels Islamabad to follow India’s foreign-policy footsteps and make up with the US. Krepon literally suggests that the Pakistanis are living in a fool’s paradise.

The obvious thrust of this ‘psywar’ — strikingly similar to what India was subjected to in the 1990s — is that Pakistan has no option but to fall in line with the US regional strategies, as it has no real ‘China option’. The main difference between India and Pakistan is that the foreign policy elites in Islamabad — unlike their Indian counterparts — are not inclined to buy into the US argument with a willing suspension of disbelief. In a way, the Sino-Pakistan relationship is proving once again to be resilient. Pakistan is in no mood to get into a ‘unipolar predicament’, as the Indian elites willingly did in the 1990s.

Thus, the visit by the Chinese delegation led by State Councilor, Dai Bingguo to Islamabad at this point in time assumes much significance. Dai is one of the highest-ranking figures in the Chinese foreign-policy establishment and the fact he is leading a delegation that includes of senior Chinese military officials is very significant. Dai is scheduled to meet not only Pakistan’s political leadership at the highest level but also army chief Ashfaq Kayani and ISI head Ahmed Shuja Pasha.

Obviously, Beijing is making a big point through the timing of this visit as well, which, incidentally, is taking place at a time of great uncertainties in Pakistan’s internal affairs. When it comes to relations with China, it must be assumed that Pakistan’s civil and military leaderships are together.

Dai doesn’t really have a US counterpart as he is ranked above the FM. Arguably, it would be secretary of state Hillary Clinton. If so, to what extent Dai ‘coordinated’ his proposed visit with Clinton will be of particular interest. The future of the US’s ‘psywar’ on Pakistan is at stake.

The big question is whether this would be Dai’s last major trip to South Asia, as he is a key member of President Hu Jintao’s team and China is moving into a period of transition at the leadership level. Dai’s visit to Delhi for the Special Representatives meet was called off at the last minute.
Posted in Diplomacy, Politics.

.

By M K Bhadrakumar – December 23, 2011

Dai Bingguo heading for Islamabad - Indian Punchline

 

[Hassan_Ishtiaq]

I think we should also work with Iranians in this field.

 

[SOHEIL]

Space is a good, but frankly its useless for us. What do we want to get out of space? The only thing i can think of is making and sending a spy satellite. This lies in a military program and that can be useful!

space is power

 

[Syrian Lion]

Don't get too carried away, relations with Iran are diplomatic and cordial. The problem when you co-op with a nation is you do reveal a lot of your technology and information. Most Iranians have a negative view of Pakistan and we should take that into factor. If they want they can go and co-op a space program with their other Chabahar friend.

As for now I say Pakistan-China-Turkiye these countries can trust each other and have potential and all have capable engineers and scientist on Pakistan and China teams already have experience working together. Iran is another case it is more of a wild card, not certain about Iran and what exactly it can offer besides oil as a trade off for entry into the partnership.

You know that Iran is an almost isolated country, and with all of the sanctions on Iran, Iran still managed to build many and a lot of technology military wise and civilian wise, without anyone's help. Now Pakistan does collaborate with China on a lot of stuff, however Iran is alone, and still advanced. So i think Iran has a lot to offer to Pakistan, more then Pakistan to Iran.

 

[Kevrai]

Pakistan doesn't need help from any other nation for their space program..... according to Zaid Hamid they can reach the moon in 5 years!!

 

[Fasih Khan]

You know that Iran is an almost isolated country, and with all of the sanctions on Iran, Iran still managed to build many and a lot of technology military wise and civilian wise, without anyone's help. Now Pakistan does collaborate with China on a lot of stuff, however Iran is alone, and still advanced. So i think Iran has a lot to offer to Pakistan, more then Pakistan to Iran.

Agreed to all except Italic part ...

 

[Fasih Khan]

Pakistan doesn't need help from any other nation for their space program..... according to Zaid Hamid they can reach the moon in 5 years!!

And you Indians find it funny If you understand Urdu, he has given a very relevent hint within this 1 minute VDO. Watch Again

 

[A1Kaid]

You know that Iran is an almost isolated country, and with all of the sanctions on Iran, Iran still managed to build many and a lot of technology military wise and civilian wise, without anyone's help. Now Pakistan does collaborate with China on a lot of stuff, however Iran is alone, and still advanced. So i think Iran has a lot to offer to Pakistan, more then Pakistan to Iran.

Iran is almost isolated because it chooses to be, it is a standoffish country, doesn't like to make friends nor partners with its immediate neighbors even when those neighbors have no serious conflict with them. So, most of this isolation comes from Iran's poor management of foreign policy with its neighbors, only neighborly country I can think Iran is friends with is Armenia as far as Turkiye and Pakistan go Iran's relation with them is diplomatic, nothing strong.


I do agree Iran has made self-sufficient progress in many fields and that is certainly respectable, though I disagree with you that Iran can offer more to Pakistan than Pakistan can offer to Iran, it's best to just let both countries to stand on their technological merit.