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Buddhism - Declined or Brutalized in the land of its birth?

Why are you telling me all this??

Because you were attacking Baig's credibility on account of him being a Muslim.

As @salimpheku is trying to divert the thread to Islamic persecution of Buddhists (no doubt established) while trying to gloss over the extermination of the faith by his own in the land of its birth - a long time before Islam even set foot here.

We are simply putting to rest the lie that Hinduism has always been benign and tolerating of other faiths and ideologies on its soil.

Yes, it has. The CAVEAT being as LONG as it has not been threatened.

Cheers, Doc
 
@padamchen

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Source: Buddhism in India: Challenging Brahmanism and Caste - By Gail Omvedt

You can refer this thread

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/hind...indus-destroyed-buddhist-jain-temples.202151/
 
As @salimpheku is trying to divert the thread to Islamic persecution of Buddhists (no doubt established) while trying to gloss over the extermination of the faith by his own in the land of its birth - a long time before Islam even set foot here.

What diversion?
I am showing you the larger canvas of how Islamic persecution has indeed dealt a killer blow to Buddhism and it is still continuing.

Thank god for Hindus that these countries Hindus have been long exterminated, otherwise, we would have had to take blame for these atrocities as well!!
 
What diversion?
I am showing you the larger canvas of how Islamic persecution has indeed dealt a killer blow to Buddhism and it is still continuing.

Thank god for Hindus that these countries Hindus have been long exterminated, otherwise, we would have had to take blame for these atrocities as well!!

No sir. You are plain and simple squirming and deflecting.

The larger canvas, in fact the main picture, is that Hinduism (in fact Shaivism, Vaishnavism, Brahminism, call it what you will) exterminated Buddhism from our land systematically.

Kings. Brahmin priests. Kshatriyas. Revivalists and reformers like Adi Shakaracharya.

They were all equally culpable. Across the land. North to south, east to west.

Ergo, Hinduism is tolerant and secular. ONLY when it is not threatened.

Cheers,Doc
 
Indeed, there are records of several severe persecutions of Buddhists by Hindu kings in the second half of the first millennium. At the end of this period, Buddhism had almost disappeared from India.

Source: http://www.pucsp.br/rever/rv3_2007/f_usarski2_en.htm


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Source: A Matter of Equity: Freedom of Faith in Secular India - John Dayal
 
Indeed, there are records of several severe persecutions of Buddhists by Hindu kings in the second half of the first millennium. At the end of this period, Buddhism had almost disappeared from India.

Source: http://www.pucsp.br/rever/rv3_2007/f_usarski2_en.htm


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Source: A Matter of Equity: Freedom of Faith in Secular India - John Dayal

Never thought I would one day be thanking something from el creepo John Dayal.

Damn sanghi turds to purgatory. The things they make us do.

Cheers, Doc
 
Never thought I would one day be thanking something from el creepo John Dayal.

Damn sanghi turds to purgatory. The things they make us do.

Cheers, Doc
I am not aware about this guy John Dayal. Who is he and why do you dislike him?
 
Because you were attacking Baig's credibility on account of him being a Muslim.

As @salimpheku is trying to divert the thread to Islamic persecution of Buddhists (no doubt established) while trying to gloss over the extermination of the faith by his own in the land of its birth - a long time before Islam even set foot here.

We are simply putting to rest the lie that Hinduism has always been benign and tolerating of other faiths and ideologies on its soil.

Yes, it has. The CAVEAT being as LONG as it has not been threatened.

Cheers, Doc
Did i said cuse he is muslim he is speaking in such a tone?? will you take subrmaniam swami reference to tteach islam

BTW who are you a buddhist a musilm of simple a sickular??
 
Did i said cuse he is muslim he is speaking in such a tone?? will you take subrmaniam swami reference to tteach islam

BTW who are you a buddhist a musilm of simple a sickular??

It was pretty clear where your knee was jerking when you called him Baighairati - did your sanghsahchalak think that was awfully clever?

Cheers, Doc
 
It was pretty clear where your knee was jerking when you called him Baighairati - did your sanghsahchalak think that was awfully clever?

Cheers, Doc
Its also clear that you are hindu hater, we hindus will rule deal with it.
 
Let us examine in this thread the history of Buddhism. And its interactions with Hinduism in ancient India. Long before the advent of Islam.

Did Buddhism simply decline and fall out of favor with the people of the subcontinent, in favor of Hinduism, reformed and revitalized?

Did Buddhism fall prey to the same evils it sought to abolish and fight, and become victim to them?

Was Buddhism absorbed and did it morph peacefully into a pan-Dharmic identity under the larger umbrella of Hinduism?

Or was Buddhism systematically persecuted and exterminated to the point of insignificance?

@Tshering22 @SarthakGanguly @Guynextdoor2 @ranjeet @salimpheku

Cheers, Doc


Around 1000 BCE rishis had started to elaborate the Vedas in the form of Upanishads as they felt that the core message of Vedas was being lost with misinterpretation due to passage of time. 100s of such Upanishads were written before the advent of Jainism and Buddhism. Around 600 BC Jainism and Buddhism took this message forward making these two dharmic philosophies atheistic in nature while Shiva & Vaishnava Vedic philosophies continued to remained theistic in nature. Around 700 AD Adi Shankaracharya debated, convinced and preached for the unity of various Vedic schools of thought and brought most of Buddhists, Jains, Shivites & Vaishnavites of India under the umbrella of modern day Hinduism.

This is the reason why dharmics constructed Buddhist, Shiva and Jain temples next to each other at Ellora rather than destroying and constructing on top of the earlier ones like was done by the invading Islamic armies.



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He is a slimy West loving (sucking) India hating Christian convert slave.

And I hate to bring it up again and infuriate my friend @Bibo manvan, but I suspect he is a fellow chandal as well.

Cheers, Doc

No need to tag me like a coward on this propaganda thread.

I am not going to participate and provide credibility to your desperate propaganda :lol:

I will step in only if I find any Hindu or Buddhist actually falling for this bunch of lies. Rest of you are free to roll in much as your true nature dictates.
 
Let us examine in this thread the history of Buddhism. And its interactions with Hinduism in ancient India. Long before the advent of Islam.

Did Buddhism simply decline and fall out of favor with the people of the subcontinent, in favor of Hinduism, reformed and revitalized?

Did Buddhism fall prey to the same evils it sought to abolish and fight, and become victim to them?

Was Buddhism absorbed and did it morph peacefully into a pan-Dharmic identity under the larger umbrella of Hinduism?

Or was Buddhism systematically persecuted and exterminated to the point of insignificance?

@Tshering22 @SarthakGanguly @Guynextdoor2 @ranjeet @salimpheku

Cheers, Doc
FIRST

DON'T quote me on propaganda troll threads.

1. Nonsense. Even during ibn Qasim's invasion, most of Dahir's kingdom was Buddhist. They suddenly 'saw the light' and became Muslims.
2. ALL BUDDHIST UNIVERSITIES WITHOUT EXCEPTION were burnt down. Buddhism has a monastic order. Its destruction made a recovery impossible.
3. Buddhism declined in India for the same reasons IT DECLINED IN XINXIANG, AFGHANISTAN, TURKESTAN etc. Due to destructive armies of Islam.

The idea of `invasion’ is actually a naive exaggeration. Most of north
western India was fairly sparsely populated in ancient times and the great
Indian cities (after the Harappan period) were mainly in the region of
present day Bihar until the 6th century BC so many alien tribes from less
fertile areas of the north simply entered with little opposition from the
local inhabitants. Pastoralists never made wars on each other and it was
only with urbanization that rulers of the evolving city states had to keep
standing armies that were dedicated to war.

There were therefore not many wars in ancient times though several probably
small tribal skirmishes that became exaggerated by legends as they evolved.
After Ashoka’s reportedly bloody battle against Kalinga, north India entered
a thousand year period of relative peace under predominantly Buddhist rulers
until the time of Harshavardhan who ruled from 606 to 647 AD. But there had
been many local wars between domestic kingdoms like the Cholas, Pallavas and
Pandyas competing with the Satvahanas and the Guptas or the Rashrakutas,
Gurjara Pratiharas and Palas in later times. There must have been
considerable bloodshed in all these conflicts even if not much is recorded
in Brahmin texts. These battles were however territorial and religion does
not seem to have been used to justify aggression.

Then there was a heady period of vigorous Brahmanical revivalism that
rapidly gathered strength after the 7th century AD. It has to be remembered
that this was not a `Hindu’ revival because the idea of Hindu as a religion
was not known at this time. During this Puranic period most people
worshipped numerous animist deities usually presided over by Brahmin priests
who chanted elevating Vedic hymns even though all the Vedic deities like
Indra, Rudra and Nasatyas had now vanished. Many animist deities including
and several goddesses were absorbed into a new Puranic Hinduism that
included non Vedic deities like Shiv, Ganesh, Hanuman, Kubera, Kali, Durga
and others and new philosophies like reincarnation, Karma and Dharma
borrowed from Buddhism and Jainism. Even the Vishnu of the Puranas was very
different from the Vedic Vishnu. At this time Ram or Krishna were still
heroes of legend and had not yet become deities of worship. A. R. Mujumdar
in The Hindu History (1979) observes … “From 650 AD, perhaps to suit the
needs of the age, Hindus rather suppressed history and invented nice legends
instead”.

Many local rulers, probably at the goading of their Brahmin ministers and
priests, now began to ruthlessly exterminate the previously dominant
Buddhist and Jain faiths. Although the class of Kshatriyas had completely
vanished from history during the thousand years of mainly Buddhist rule they
were reinvented at this time to serve Brahmin interests. No doubt the rich
lands and treasures of their monasteries and temples also gave material
incentives to this religious fervor and many Buddhist and Jain stupas and
monasteries were destroyed and Hindu temples established at their sites.
Similar material motives had actuated religious persecutions in many lands
including those by the nobles in England during the much more recent period
of the Reformation. There are many Hindu references to support this
assertion including the unedited versions of the original Puranas even
though most Buddhist and Jain accounts were destroyed.

Hiuen-Tsang, who visited India from 629 to 645 AD, describes the influence
of a south Indian Brahmin queen on her husband who ordered the execution of
many thousand Buddhists including 8,000 in Madurai alone. Kalhana’s
Rajatarangani (written by a Shaivite scholar about 1149 AD and the first
Brahmin account of India’s historic past from the time of Yudishthira)
relates that Mihirikula, the Hun ruler was converted by Brahmins (in 515 AD)
and unleashed a wave of violent destruction on Buddhist monasteries in
Punjab and Kashmir. He reports (verse 290 in book 1) that “crows and birds
of prey would fly ahead eager to feed on those within his armies reach”. He
proudly proclaimed himself as the killer of three crores.

Hired Brahmin killers later tried to assassinate the Buddhist ruler
Harshavardhana. As a Buddhist, he was unwilling to take life and so banished
500 Brahmins involved in the conspiracy to a remote area south of the
Vindhyas.

Kalhan also reports that several avaricious Hindu rulers looted the
treasuries and even burned Hindu temples of the Shahi and Katoch rulers in
neighboring areas long before the well known looting by Mahmud Ghazni.

According to The Rajatarangani (IV/112), Chandradip, a Buddhist ruler of
Kashmir, was killed by Brahmins in 722 AD. His successor Tarapida was killed
two years later. The newly anointed Brahma-Kshastra (Rajput) rulers usurped
power in the kingdoms of Sind and Kota. Graha Varman Maukhari, married to
Harsha’s sister, was treacherously killed by Sasanka, king of Gauda
(Bengal). He proudly destroyed many stupas and cut down the sacred Bodhi
tree at Gaya.

According to Gopinath Rao (East & West Vol 35) the old tribal shrine at
Jaganath Puri was usurped by Vaisnavas and the walls of the temple even
today displays gory murals recording the beheading and massacre of
Buddhists.

Epigraphica India Vol XXIX P 141-144 records that Vira Goggi Deva, a South
Indian king, described himself as… “a fire to the Jain scriptures, a hunter
of wild beasts in the form of the followers of Jina (Jains) and an adept at
the demolition of Buddhist canon”. It also records “the deliberate
destruction of non Brahminical literature like books of Lokayat/ Carvaca
philosophy by Brihaspati mentioned by Albaruni in the 11th century.” The
huge Buddhist complex at Nagarjunakonda was destroyed. According to Shankara
Dig Vijaya, the newly anointed Brahma-Kshastra kings ordered every Kshatriya
to kill every Buddhist young and old and to also kill those who did not kill
the Buddhists. A Jain temple at Huli in Karnataka had a statue of five Jinas
(Jain heroes) that was re carved into a Shaivite temple with five lingas.

E.S Oakley (Holy Himalaya) Rhys Davids (Buddhist India) and Daniel Wright
(History of Nepal) quote several Nepalese and Kumoani documents showing that
Buddhism had been the prevailing religion of the Himalayas with Badrinath
and Kedarnath as Buddhist temples until Shankaracharya (788 -820 AD) usurped
them in the 8th century and the shrines at Badri and Kedar were then
converted into shrines of Shiv and Vishnu. Wright records that “there had
been a curious intermixture of the two religions with Buddhist priests
officiating at the temples of Pashupati (Shiv) and all the four castes
following the religion of Buddha.” There is no evidence that Shankaracharya
directed such persecution but what is likely is that grasping local rulers
may have used his great name to lend legitimacy to their own destruction and
looting. Many local hill rajas now invited Brahmins to their domains to get
themselves elevated to the rank of Kshatriyas. And many were encouraged to
attack Buddhist monasteries.

Several Nepalese accounts state that the followers of Buddha were ruthlessly
persecuted, slain, exiled and forcibly converted. Though many converted
rather than face death, humiliation or exile. The attackers tested their
faith by making them perform ‘Hinsa’, or the sacrifice of live animals, that
was abhorrent to Buddhists and Jains. Many bhikshunis, or nuns, were
forcibly married and the learned Grihasthas were forced to cut off the
distinguishing knot of hair on top of their heads. 84,000 Buddhist works
were searched for and destroyed.

It is believed that Shankara introduced pilgrimages to these holy places in
the Himalayas for the first time to prevent their relapse into Buddhist or
animist ways. As sufficient local Brahmins could not be found who were
willing to preach in such remote places he imported Nambudri Brahmin priests
from Kerala who, to this day, officiate at Badrinath, and Kedarnath.

Later as the mountain settlements grew, other Brahmins like the Joshis and Pants from Maharashtra, Gairolas from Bengal and Negis from Gujarat were also invited to settle in the hills. Holy pilgrimages then ensured a constant influx of Hindu pilgrims with the presence of many traders, priests, and rulers who had a vested interest in sustaining Hindu pilgrimages to these sacred spots.
Ok. Let me put it simply.

Your post disgusts me.

All the 'evidences' have been fabricated in a single essay/post.

Hiuen Xang wrote not about Hindu extermination of Buddhists but by Huns. - Encyclopædia Britannica. "Historical Development of Buddhism in India - Buddhism under the Guptas and Palas".

Now Mihirakula, being a Hun ruler from Central Asia proves that Hindus destroyed Buddhism?
But wait - Hinduism did not exist right? (first paragraph)... then?

The rest of the article is full of 'may have been's 'perhaps' and other conjecture.

Till then, read (not you) A History of Indian Buddhism - Akira Hirakawa; Paul Groner
Levy, Robert I. Mesocosm: Hinduism and the Organization of a Traditional Newar City in Nepal. Berkeley: University of California Press
Annemarie Schimmel, Religionen – Islam in the Indian Subcontinent, Brill Academic Publishers
Synopsis by Nalinaksha Dutt, Accounts of Pala, Sena kings, Vikramshila, Turushkas and status of Buddhism in India, Sri Lanka and Indonesia
Berkwitz, Stephen C. (2012), South Asian Buddhism: A Survey, Routledge
Charles (EDT) Willemen, Bart Dessein, Collett Cox, "Sarvastivada Buddhist Scholastism"

Also go through the chronicles of Tibetan Buddhism and how it evolved from the Indian branch and why they had to 'create' Padmasambhava.

For the future, Dar ul Uloom needs to go and a new Takshashila University should come up in the very same premises. A new Odantapuri complex should come up in the AMU.
 

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