Brothers who raped 14-year-old girl in Pakistan go free after paying 1200kg of wheat

[Vapnope]

So do you not employ more judges in your country who can decide faster and people get justice. Poor and oppressed people should be supported by govt. Are there no volunteer lawyers? Yes nobody wants this kind of fame and shame attached to them for rest of their lives even in west. So my questions is this Jigras court is a legal entity? and not an extra or parallel system?

There are very good and honest judges, there are lawyers who wont charge you a penny for a case no matter how long it takes but overall, the lower courts have become a open market. You pay more money you win. And lack of education and failure to know one's right has caused people to turn towards such jirgas.

 

[Mav3rick]

There was a need to end the Tribal/Jirga system like 20 years ago......today, there is a need to do that as well as to take all the Tribal/Jirga elders into custody and to thrash them and violate all their private parts until death!

And then we move on to the land lords and Jagirdaars and Wadaira system.

 

[ayeshakhan]

I don't know what our Government is up to , they can control all the issues from small to big , and it is a very bad act , one should take action on them with proper law and justice

 

[Paksanity]

There was a need to end the Tribal/Jirga system like 20 years ago......today, there is a need to do that as well as to take all the Tribal/Jirga elders into custody and to thrash them and violate all their private parts until death!

And then we move on to the land lords and Jagirdaars and Wadaira system.

Have you ever been to a court? Pursued a case or watched one closely? I have. And it is downright ugly. If people could get speedy justice without having to pay and bribe everyone in the system, they won't turn to Jirga or Panchayet. You can not finish Jirga without overhauling lower judiciary. And that overhaul, my friend, is not going to happen because current system favours rich and powerful.

 

[I.R.A]

Have you ever been to a court? Pursued a case or watched one closely? I have. And it is downright ugly. If people could get speedy justice without having to pay and bribe everyone in the system, they won't turn to Jirga or Panchayet. You can not finish Jirga without overhauling lower judiciary. And that overhaul, my friend, is not going to happen because current system favours rich and powerful.

Why lower courts only, all the judges and lawyer mafia should be made accountable and this term "Toheen e Adalat" should be shoved up into the rear of the one who invented it.

The local people who decided this case would most probably the landlords themselves, or even if those were village or area elders how can they not be under the influence of these landlords.

 

[Zibago]

I don't know what our Government is up to , they can control all the issues from small to big , and it is a very bad act , one should take action on them with proper law and justice

If you criticize them they cry
Jamhoriyat ko khatra hay

 

[Windjammer]

The name (Miss R) indicates that the girl probably belong to a minority community, may be Christian or Hindu.....hence the judgement.

Really, last time i checked, Rabia, Rozina, Rakhshanda, Raqia, Razia etc. were all Muslim names.

 

[Mav3rick]

Have you ever been to a court? Pursued a case or watched one closely? I have. And it is downright ugly. If people could get speedy justice without having to pay and bribe everyone in the system, they won't turn to Jirga or Panchayet. You can not finish Jirga without overhauling lower judiciary. And that overhaul, my friend, is not going to happen because current system favours rich and powerful.

I have not only witnessed the local legal system but have been burnt by it too. I totally agree that the country needs a major overhaul of the current justice system and that too big time. Even the CJ is aware of the fact and is extremely disappointed at the level of intellect and expertise of the Judiciary. But this is how the elite want the system and this is how they maintain it.

However, the above does not entail ridiculous punishments and inhumane treatment of the accused in Panchayat and Jirga rulings. That system too is designed to protect the influential and to punish the common man.

 

[Paksanity]

Why lower courts only, all the judges and lawyer mafia should be made accountable and this term "Toheen e Adalat" should be shoved up into the rear of the one who invented it.

The local people who decided this case would most probably the landlords themselves, or even if those were village or area elders how can they not be under the influence of these landlords.

Fair enough. However Who will hold them accountable? Who exactly would that be? Government, who is of the elite for the elite? Criminal law has serious flaws and loopholes. They are left in there intentionally. If you have enough money and influence, you can linger on the case for decades in courts. Meanwhile apply all sorts of pressures on victim and his family to give up and force a reconciliation on your terms. And this os all within legal framework. It can't be challenged as it is within bounds of law. Throw in a hefty bribe and you can get away with almost any thing. So there are two basic questions:

1- Who exactly will carry out the accountability? Which institution or entity? (Why would they do it honestly?)

2- Only government has the power to change the law. Why would government (i.e. political elite) change the law it created specifically to help them get away from cases? Just why would they do it?

In the end, it is the people who are suppose to demand this. They are the effectee. But they don't. So they will suffer and continue to do so. That's the sad truth. While all this goes on, as an interim measure, people will continue to approach Jirga and Panchayet for their problems as the cycle continues. Such sad stories will continue to come out every now and then bringing shame on us as a society. But hey, if we are not willing to change all this, why would it change?

 

[Namer Afzal Khan]

They should have been flogged 80 to 100 times rather than letting them go just on wheat. This shows that Islamic system is not even followed by these jirgas.

We already have a system (The Islamic Judicial System). All we need is its implementation. We need Shariah courts at the grass root level in which those judges should be appointed who have Sound knowledge of Quran and Sunnah. We need to replace these local jirgahs.

 

[VCheng]

I guess the normal way. Biologically there might not be anything wrong them.

Socio- Cultural norms in harder to reach geographies are formative for such a thought process. What might seem heinous to you and me might seem perfectly acceptable to a large section of people. Polygamous relations are an anathema in many societies but perfectly acceptable in others. Child labor which will make westerners queasy is considered socially acceptable and economically necessary in countries like India.

Good and Evil, Crime and Punishment and other moral theories are a product of societal constructs and no less arbitrary and as horrifying it might sound, it says something about we as a society when we don't blink when thousands die in Govt led pogroms but a mutually acceptable societal constructs like Jirga or Punchayat (which I might add only have legitimacy due to failings of govt systems) are criticised for imposing the democratic (in the truest sense) will of people.

@Joe Shearer @Solomon2 @Oscar

Yes, but such concepts are always in flux, and societies all across the world lie along a continuum from progressive to regressive.

 

[Spectre]

Yes, but such concepts are always in flux, and societies all across the world lie along a continuum from progressive to regressive.

How would you characterize a society diseased with rampant gun culture, minority rights abuse, drug abuse, highest per capita prison population, penchant for overthrowing governments, invading countries, responsible genocide among many other virtues? Such a country is called bastion of progressiveness and the leader of free world.

As the good book says - judge not lest ye be judged.

Now my purpose here is not to diss off US and engage in point scoring. What I am trying to say that the whole concept of progressive and regressive is arbitrary. There isn't X-Y axis graph where you can score countries on the basis of their progressiveness. Even the very concept of progressiveness and regressiveness keeps getting defined every few decades. Once upon a time eugenics was considered as progressiveness, civilizing the barbarians was considered as progressiveness so much so that it was polished off as white man's burden.

While equality is a goal worth pursuing, one must question two things

- Is it the right time
- Does it do more harm than good

 

[Spring Onion]

Am I the only one having trouble believing the story?

Why you won't believe it? Rural Sindh as well as most of Pakistan is infested with such things. Powerful roam freely despite proven criminals

 

[VCheng]

How would you characterize a society diseased with rampant gun culture, minority rights abuse, drug abuse, highest per capita prison population, penchant for overthrowing governments, invading countries, responsible genocide among many other virtues? Such a country is called bastion of progressiveness and the leader of free world.

As the good book says - judge not lest ye be judged.

Now my purpose here is not to diss off US and engage in point scoring. What I am trying to say that the whole concept of progressive and regressive is arbitrary. There isn't X-Y axis graph where you can score countries on the basis of their progressiveness. Even the very concept of progressiveness and regressiveness keeps getting defined every few decades. Once upon a time eugenics was considered as progressiveness, civilizing the barbarians was considered as progressiveness so much so that it was polished off as white man's burden.

While equality is a goal worth pursuing, one must question two things

- Is it the right time
- Does it do more harm than good

Did I identify any country by name in what I said? No, because there are good reasons not to do so.

 

[Spectre]

Did I identify any country by name in what I said? No, because there are good reasons not to do so.

Fair enough and I clarified that I picked the most conspicuous example possible of contradiction and hypocrisy.

All I am saying is let's not sit in judgement. Consider every case on it's merit and not stereotype entire countries and societies based.