BREAKING NEWS: Benazir Bhutto assassinated

[IceCold]

Grand jirga to demand handover of ‘BB killers’



PESHAWAR: The government has decided to convene a grand tribal jirga comprising all important maliks and elders in which they will be demanded to hand over all those who are facing allegations that they have allegedly a hand in the tragic murder of former prime minister Benazir Bhutto.

"President Pervez Musharraf has conveyed a message to the NWFP governor to make arrangements for the grand tribal jirga at the earliest as he has been facing immense pressure from the international community for the arrest of the mastermind of Bhutto's killing," a reliable source informed on Sunday.

According to the source, the government had taken a final decision for arresting all those involved in the murder of Benazir Bhutto. "The tribal elders and maliks will be told in clear term to either support the government forces in operation against militants or face the consequences," he added.

He said that the governor had started work on convening the jirga in Peshawar within a few days. "The political agents of all tribal agencies will be asked to prepare a list of the real representatives of tribal people as this time the matter is of serious nature," he went on to say.

It may be recalled that the government had alleged that chief of Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan Baitullah Mehsud had a hand in the murder of Mohtarma Benazir Bhutto. Later a purported spokesman of Taliban Maulvi Omar in a telephone message to a newsman claimed that Taliban had no hand in the murder of Benazir Bhutto.

The source said that the jirga would be given the option to either hand over some Taliban elements wanted to the government or the government forces would launch a full-scale operation.

According to the source, the government may ask for help from the US-led forces in Afghanistan for arresting the Taliban leaders. "The government has been expecting a positive response from the tribal elders and maliks as they know the gravity of the matter," he added.

According to reports, sensing danger some of the Taliban leaders have gone underground.

This is a good step. Any operation with the involvement of the locals makes the possibility of its success to a 100%. I just hope and pray that this goes well and this baitullah is sent back to hell.

 

[IceCold]

Will the tribal hand over anyone?

If Osama is not handed over, one wonders if the Pastuns will break their code of brotherhood and all that.

And if they do, then that will be an interesting departure.

Tribals have proved it on numerous occasions that they do not support such terrorist acts by acting against them on their own. And i'm pretty confident that the tribals will do the same.
And there is no brotherhood code of pastuns, afghanies and pastuns are 2 different people. Speaking the same language doesnt make them one. Urdu is spoken in both india and pakistan, but does that makes us one.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Tribals have proved it on numerous occasions that they do not support such terrorist acts by acting against them on their own. And i'm pretty confident that the tribals will do the same.
And there is no brotherhood code of pastuns, afghanies and pastuns are 2 different people. Speaking the same language doesnt make them one. Urdu is spoken in both india and pakistan, but does that makes us one.

I don't think that is correct that Pakistani Afghans do not have affinity with the Afghanistan Pashtuns.

If it were so then the borders would not be so porous and the terrorists not found safe haven in NEFP province, nor would there be a requirement for operations in the Kamran Agencies or Swat because 'foreign' Afghan would have not been entertained if there was no affinity.

You have also read the books "Kite Runner" and "A Thousand Splendid Sunsets" by Khaled Hossien to understand the Afghan affinity.

As far a Indian Moslems who speak Urdu and Pakistani Moslems who speak Urdu, there is enough of cross border marriages to prove you are wrong!

But, yes, quite a few Pashtuns of Pakistan do not support.

But that they are fiercely independent in views is historical!

I know many a Afghan who are here in India as also I know many a Pakistani too.

It is not that I am a total greenhorn!

I take great pride in trying to understand people and their psychology, social customs and way of life. It is a fascinating subject.

 

[natalie]

Will the tribal hand over anyone?

If Osama is not handed over, one wonders if the Pastuns will break their code of brotherhood and all that.

And if they do, then that will be an interesting departure.

Osama bin laden is dead someone has killed him following his son's marriage with a british woman.
BB said that in an interview when she was alive that Osama is dead.

 

[natalie]

I don't think that is correct that Pakistani Afghans do not have affinity with the Afghanistan Pashtuns.

If it were so then the borders would not be so porous and the terrorists not found safe haven in NEFP province, nor would there be a requirement for operations in the Kamran Agencies or Swat because 'foreign' Afghan would have not been entertained if there was no affinity.

You have also read the books "Kite Runner" and "A Thousand Splendid Sunsets" by Khaled Hossien to understand the Afghan affinity.

As far a Indian Moslems who speak Urdu and Pakistani Moslems who speak Urdu, there is enough of cross border marriages to prove you are wrong!

But, yes, quite a few Pashtuns of Pakistan do not support.

But that they are fiercely independent in views is historical!

I know many a Afghan who are here in India as also I know many a Pakistani too.

It is not that I am a total greenhorn!

I take great pride in trying to understand people and their psychology, social customs and way of life. It is a fascinating subject.

i have recently watched the movie KITE-RUNNER and its a very touching film but it also made me feel sick to the stomache seeing child abuse in afganistan and open cross border imigration... it has touched a very sensitive subject of child abuse but there is some amazing characters in the film......
a must watch..........

 

[Spring Onion]

If Osama is not handed over, one wonders if the Pastuns will break their code of brotherhood and all that.

And if they do, then that will be an interesting departure.

Hypocracy at peak Sir on ur part.

OBL is not in Pakistan who knows even if he is alive.



Rest the tribal elders are baing asked for handing over aides of Baitullah Mehsud and him.

 

[Spring Onion]

I don't think that is correct that Pakistani Afghans do not have affinity with the Afghanistan Pashtuns.

Pakistani Afghan ???????

has anyone of you heard that phrase.

Hmmm can we say Indian Pakistani or Pakistani Indian ???

Sir jee either he is an Afghan or Pakistani.

so take a cup of tea if not vinegr

zaida Jor na lagao jee

 

[Spring Onion]

Osama bin laden is dead someone has killed him following his son's marriage with a british woman.
BB said that in an interview when she was alive that Osama is dead.

Yes dear she said it but guess what ???

BBC has edditted that interview of BB soon after she was killed.

Now you can understand what the hypocrate world is up to.

 

[IceCold]

I don't think that is correct that Pakistani Afghans do not have affinity with the Afghanistan Pashtuns.

There is no such term as pakistani afghans, pakistanies are pakistanies and afghans are afghanis who migrated to pakistan following the afghan war with russia. They wanted to protay themselves as pakistanies but that did not happen so a few of them actually got married to get pakistani identy, but that was all over after pakistan government started to register them so it doesnt happen anymore these days.

If it were so then the borders would not be so porous and the terrorists not found safe haven in NEFP province, nor would there be a requirement for operations in the Kamran Agencies or Swat because 'foreign' Afghan would have not been entertained if there was no affinity.

You have also read the books "Kite Runner" and "A Thousand Splendid Sunsets" by Khaled Hossien to understand the Afghan affinity.

Safe heavens you mean according to the western media. Because there are no safe heavens. However you may say that certain elements in pakistan support them in the tribal belt however they are in a minority. Safe heaven you would say a place where they are actually allowed to breed and do things openly. Even the NATO and US army in afghanistan has accepted that upto 40% tailban movement and inflration has been reduced. I take it as much as upto 60% because US obiviously doesnt want us to breathe easy. IF it would be a safe heaven i guess instead of the decrease it should had been increased. Hiding in pakistan near the boder area doesnt make it a safe heaven, one must keep the geopolitical situation in mind and since you are from army, you should know it better, its not easy to block the boder completely.

As far a Indian Moslems who speak Urdu and Pakistani Moslems who speak Urdu, there is enough of cross border marriages to prove you are wrong!

Getting married crossboder doesnt make us one. Pakistanies and indians married in the US, does that make US and pakistanies or indians as one. WHat kind of philosophy it that?

But, yes, quite a few Pashtuns of Pakistan do not support.

Lol! since when did you learned that. Few pashtuns. Let me tell you a fact here that majority of pashtuns doesnt like one bit of afghans and neither they like them calling themselves as pathans.

I know many a Afghan who are here in India as also I know many a Pakistani too.

And your point exactly is??

It is not that I am a total greenhorn!

I take great pride in trying to understand people and their psychology, social customs and way of life. It is a fascinating subject.

I can see that already.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Yes, I agree that there is nothing called a Pak Afghan.

It is just that in my hometown they call all Pastuns as Afghanis and so the mistake done subconsciously.

My apologies.

However, marriages of AFghan Pashtuns and Pak Pashtuns has always been there. So. Icecold, what you are stating is not right! It is not a new phenomenon as you are trying to tell us.

 

[Spring Onion]

Yes, I agree that there is nothing called a Pak Afghan.

It is just that in my hometown they call all Pastuns as Afghanis and so the mistake done subconsciously.

My apologies.

However, marriages of AFghan Pashtuns and Pak Pashtuns has always been there. So. Icecold, what you are stating is not right! It is not a new phenomenon as you are trying to tell us.

whats your hometown ??

and indeed marriages are there but mostly these are bewteen the Pushtuns of Afghanistan as if one family resides here the other is in Afghanistan.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

There is no such term as pakistani afghans, pakistanies are pakistanies and afghans are afghanis who migrated to pakistan following the afghan war with russia. They wanted to protay themselves as pakistanies but that did not happen so a few of them actually got married to get pakistani identy, but that was all over after pakistan government started to register them so it doesnt happen anymore these days.

My apologies on the incorrect nomenclature.

However, it is not correct that before the Russian invasion there was no cross Durand Line marriages.

Safe heavens you mean according to the western media. Because there are no safe heavens. However you may say that certain elements in pakistan support them in the tribal belt however they are in a minority. Safe heaven you would say a place where they are actually allowed to breed and do things openly. Even the NATO and US army in afghanistan has accepted that upto 40% tailban movement and inflration has been reduced. I take it as much as upto 60% because US obiviously doesnt want us to breathe easy. IF it would be a safe heaven i guess instead of the decrease it should had been increased. Hiding in pakistan near the boder area doesnt make it a safe heaven, one must keep the geopolitical situation in mind and since you are from army, you should know it better, its not easy to block the boder completely.

Kamran and Swat is still festering.

Therefore, hiding in Pakistan not being a havens would be stretching the point a bit too elastic. It is true that the Pakistani govt does not want this to happen since they are also turning against the Federal govt and causing woes as they are doing so for ISAF.

How is it that the US does not want Pakistan to breathe easy?

You must realise more that anything, the US respects the Dollar. If Pakistan breathes easy, it means that the TAP will go through and if the TAP goes through, it is $$$$$$ all the way!!!

Getting married crossboder doesnt make us one. Pakistanies and indians married in the US, does that make US and pakistanies or indians as one. WHat kind of philosophy it that?

It is not philosophy. It is mere reality.

When Indian Moslems marry Pakistanis, doesn't it make the Pakistan married in India, an Indian, and vice versa?

What type of logic are you advocating?

Lol! since when did you learned that. Few pashtuns. Let me tell you a fact here that majority of pashtuns doesnt like one bit of afghans and neither they like them calling themselves as pathans.

Really?

Obfuscate away to please your desires and dreams!

And your point exactly is??

Even the blind would understand.

I can see that already.

Good that something has dawned!

 

[roadrunner]

Pashtuns of Afghanistan are not completely different people to Pashtuns of Pakistan. They have the same customs, the same religion, the same ethnic group, and so on. A minority of nationalists on both sides. Only difference between each, is the color of their passport.

Salim, this dream of Pashtun independence you have, is a wet one. Both camps are happy to be Afghan or Pakistani. They can still be Pashtun, and do as they please.

 

[IceCold]

However, it is not correct that before the Russian invasion there was no cross Durand Line marriages.

Jana has cleared this point!

Kamran and Swat is still festering.

Therefore, hiding in Pakistan not being a havens would be stretching the point a bit too elastic. It is true that the Pakistani govt does not want this to happen since they are also turning against the Federal govt and causing woes as they are doing so for ISAF.

How is it that the US does not want Pakistan to breathe easy?

You must realise more that anything, the US respects the Dollar. If Pakistan breathes easy, it means that the TAP will go through and if the TAP goes through, it is $$$$$$ all the way!!!

Thats your way of taking things, you are entitled to your view however facts are different. By the way pakistan is more interested in IPI project which means no money at all for the US. Does it ring any bell. Its now IP only since india couldnt bare the pressure.

It is not philosophy. It is mere reality.

When Indian Moslems marry Pakistanis, doesn't it make the Pakistan married in India, an Indian, and vice versa?

What type of logic are you advocating?

Ok, maybe i'm not good in english, though i try to be. Anyhow look marring someone on the other side and getting passport of that nationality for instance a pakistani becoming indian or vice versa, how does it incline to the fact that we are one. When i mentioned being one was as a whole in larger context. Afghanis are not pathan's, speaking the same language doesnt make them one. Afghanis somehow want to link themselves to the pathans and want to protay that they share same values and stuff like that, but thats their view, and pathans majority of them dont give a damn about it. Simple

Really?

Obfuscate away to please your desires and dreams!

Yes really. I'm sitting in pakistan with pathans both in my family and friends. I know because i come in contact on daily basis with them, may i know how did you come to this consclusion of yours? media i guess and your are "basing yourself on that knowledge challanging me!

Even the blind would understand.

Consider i'm worse

Good that something has dawned!

I wouldnt be saying so if i were you.

 

[Flintlock]

Salim, this dream of Pashtun independence you have, is a wet one.

Sorry to interrupt...but that phrase is hilarious!!