‘Bill to ban Jamaat on way’

[anilindia]

i can argue on that as well they were NOT meant to run Pakistan but one part where they won. it can also be argued the precentage of votes.

rawami leader already was advocating hate and conspiring creating linguistic divide.

anyway some other day will post back up points .

They have won election for whole pakistan at that time. If west pakistan can run east pakistan why not east pakistan can run west pakistan.

 

[SamantK]

They have won election for whole pakistan at that time. If west pakistan can run east pakistan why not east pakistan can run west pakistan.

East could not run west Pakistan because west considered the east as its colony rather that its own people..

Unfortunately we all treated East Pakistan as a colony and never granted them their justly deserved status of being the major human organ of Pakistan's body – 54 percent of the population. As power barons of the Federal government mostly hailed from West Pakistan they never shared the power willingly or happily with their Bengali brethren.

Fall of Dacca - PakTribune

Pakistan came into existence as a result of partition in 1947 comprising of two wings separated by 1,000 miles of Indian territory. It was an unlikely construct to begin with. Subsequently, successive regimes (largely based on West Pakistani bureaucrats, Generals and politicians) treated East Pakistan like a colony, linguistically, culturally, politically and economically.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

 

[Spring Onion]

In other words, Jammat is a value addition for incompetent BNP/

BNP needs good advisors. KZ failed to cash the realities which can be used against hassina

 

[ShadowFaux]

i can argue on that as well they were NOT meant to run Pakistan but one part where they won. it can also be argued the precentage of votes.

No it was the whole Pakistan. Check again.

rawami leader already was advocating hate and conspiring creating linguistic divide.

Nope he was not. About the language part, you just can't change the language of 7 crore people, can you?
Also a point to be noted, before name-calling him, you should know that he was one of the key activists fighting for the creation of Pakistan.

 

[illusion8]

that does not make it legal to ban a political party out of fear

Does many Jamaat leaders being prosecuted, investigated or being given sentences for war crimes, genocide and rape qualify for banning that party?

 

[Hammer-fist]

4.7% votes is good enough a number to declare them eliminated, they are able to survive even after this means they have some dubious funding, is that so @ShadowFaux @Hammer-fist ?

1. Jamat has its own internal supporters and businesses, and also has foreign supporters from the Arab world and Pakistan e.g. the Pakistani Jamat e Islami. I won't say who but it will be pretty obvious to anyone with sense but the organization also recieves support from the intelligence organization of one state which sees the Jamat as a valuable tool in what it sees as its turf war with India. Let's leave it at that.

2. The organizations support in Bangladesh is decreasing and will continue to decrease, and the main way to defeat them is education.

As anyone who really knows the true nature of this organization and its history will be repulsed and disgusted.

3. I do not think Jamat will be banned in Bangladesh.

The main reason is because the USA (which has far more influence than the way overexaggerated Indian influence) wants a fundamentalist "Islamic" party in Bangladesh as a source of leverage against India and part of its strategy of promoting radicals in the Muslim world in order for them to be problematic for America's rivals.

4. So to state again I do not think Jamat will ever be banned.

But in that extremely unlike scenario the Jamat would either do three things.

i: Join with the BNP (which for me would be a good outcome as the BNP is a nationalist organization and not a pro-Pakistani/Pakistanophilic organization like Jamat)
ii: Stand as independents
iii: Regroup under a different name.

Option iii is what Turkey's "Islamist" party, (the Refah, Fazilet, Saadet) has done after successive bans (same party, different name) but more importantly is the younger and more progressive elements of the Refah party went on to form a more moderate AKP, which is now the most successful party in Turkey's history.

If the Jamat were to reform itself and do some of the things suggested by Kalu_Miah (e.g. distancing itself from war criminals, end Pakistanophilia etc) then I could live with them. My greatest concern with them is their agenda to re-integrate Bangladesh with Pakistan, which they deny in public as a group but even some of their supporters say at times.

5. The Awami League are also another corrupt organization and worked and allied with the Jamat before as @Fallstaff has commendably stated so many times. This angered many independent non-partisan liberals in Bangladesh such as Jahanara Imam.

Jahanara Imam

For her efforts in bringing Jamati war criminals to account and opposition to the Awami-Jamat alliance, Jahanara Imam was insulted and attacked by the corrupt and power-hungry Hasina.

This also inconveniences the Jamati narrative and propaganda that the Awami League is an "evil stooge of India" which if it was, then why did the Jamatis ally with Indian "dalals"?

The fact is the Awami League though favourable towards India to an extent and recieving some Indian intelligence support (Jamat recieves the support of "another" foreign intelligence agency) is not an Indian-controlled organization or an Indian puppet.

The Awami League's war crimes and calls to ban Jamat stem less from sincere hatred of the group and its crimes against humanity but from a political agenda, so should not be taken too seriously.

To sum up, the Jamati threat to Bangladesh is not that major and the Awami League engages in Jamati-bashing to gain popularity. However the Jamat is definitely a threat to Bangladeshi national security and should ultimately be neutralized and the best way to do that is education and maintain the economic and socio-economic progress Bangladesh is making.

This forum - dominated by Jamatis (4.6% of the population) - should not be taken seriously.

 

[SamantK]

3. I do not think Jamat will be banned in Bangladesh.

The main reason is because the USA (which has far more influence than the way overexaggerated Indian influence) wants a fundamentalist "Islamic" party in Bangladesh as a source of leverage against India and part of its strategy of promoting radicals in the Muslim world in order for them to be problematic for America's rivals.

Thanks for giving me a crash course in BD politics! I do not know if US has that kind of reach, however I do not understand why US would want an Islamic party in BD, their influence is waning and not due to its rival's rise but due to economic situation..

 

[kalu_miah]

1. Jamat has its own internal supporters and businesses, and also has foreign supporters from the Arab world and Pakistan e.g. the Pakistani Jamat e Islami. I won't say who but it will be pretty obvious to anyone with sense but the organization also recieves support from the intelligence organization of one state which sees the Jamat as a valuable tool in what it sees as its turf war with India. Let's leave it at that.

2. The organizations support in Bangladesh is decreasing and will continue to decrease, and the main way to defeat them is education.

As anyone who really knows the true nature of this organization and its history will be repulsed and disgusted.

3. I do not think Jamat will be banned in Bangladesh.

The main reason is because the USA (which has far more influence than the way overexaggerated Indian influence) wants a fundamentalist "Islamic" party in Bangladesh as a source of leverage against India and part of its strategy of promoting radicals in the Muslim world in order for them to be problematic for America's rivals.

4. So to state again I do not think Jamat will ever be banned.

But in that extremely unlike scenario the Jamat would either do three things.

i: Join with the BNP (which for me would be a good outcome as the BNP is a nationalist organization and not a pro-Pakistani/Pakistanophilic organization like Jamat)
ii: Stand as independents
iii: Regroup under a different name.

Option iii is what Turkey's "Islamist" party, (the Refah, Fazilet, Saadet) has done after successive bans (same party, different name) but more importantly is the younger and more progressive elements of the Refah party went on to form a more moderate AKP, which is now the most successful party in Turkey's history.

If the Jamat were to reform itself and do some of the things suggested by Kalu_Miah (e.g. distancing itself from war criminals, end Pakistanophilia etc) then I could live with them. My greatest concern with them is their agenda to re-integrate Bangladesh with Pakistan, which they deny in public as a group but even some of their supporters say at times.

5. The Awami League are also another corrupt organization and worked and allied with the Jamat before as @Fallstaff has commendably stated so many times. This angered many independent non-partisan liberals in Bangladesh such as Jahanara Imam.

Jahanara Imam

For her efforts in bringing Jamati war criminals to account and opposition to the Awami-Jamat alliance, Jahanara Imam was insulted and attacked by the corrupt and power-hungry Hasina.

This also inconveniences the Jamati narrative and propaganda that the Awami League is an "evil stooge of India" which if it was, then why did the Jamatis ally with Indian "dalals"?

The fact is the Awami League though favourable towards India to an extent and recieving some Indian intelligence support (Jamat recieves the support of "another" foreign intelligence agency) is not an Indian-controlled organization or an Indian puppet.

The Awami League's war crimes and calls to ban Jamat stem less from sincere hatred of the group and its crimes against humanity but from a political agenda, so should not be taken too seriously.

To sum up, the Jamati threat to Bangladesh is not that major and the Awami League engages in Jamati-bashing to gain popularity. However the Jamat is definitely a threat to Bangladeshi national security and should ultimately be neutralized and the best way to do that is education and maintain the economic and socio-economic progress Bangladesh is making.

This forum - dominated by Jamatis (4.6% of the population) - should not be taken seriously.

Thanks for the nice political commentary. Now if I may ask a question, please name names, who in your views is a Jamati in this forum among Bangladeshi's? Let's see then what they have to say about themselves about their own political affiliations.

 

[Hammer-fist]

Thanks for giving me a crash course in BD politics! I do not know if US has that kind of reach, however I do not understand why US would want an Islamic party in BD, their influence is waning and not due to its rival's rise but due to economic situation..

Yes, I perhaps went to too much detail for someone who is not Bangladeshi but let me simplify it.

1. All parties in Bangladesh are corrupt but Jamat (though they deny it) are opposed to Bangladesh's mere existence and are involved in war crimes.

2. The Awami League though somewhat less hostile/favourable to India is not run or controlled by India.

3. Jamatis won't be banned.

The US supported Chechen "Islamists" in Russia to weaken the Russians, supports Uighur nationalists (who happen to be Muslim) to weaken China, supported Bosnian and Kosova Muslims to act as leverage against the Christian EU.

 

[SamantK]

Yes, I perhaps went to too much detail for someone who is not Bangladeshi but let me simplify it.

1. All parties in Bangladesh are corrupt but Jamat (though they deny it) are opposed to Bangladesh's mere existence and are involved in war crimes.

2. The Awami League though somewhat less hostile/favourable to India is not run or controlled by India.

3. Jamatis won't be banned.

The US supported Chechen "Islamists" in Russia to weaken the Russians, supports Uighur nationalists (who happen to be Muslim) to weaken China, supported Bosnian and Kosova Muslims to act as leverage against the Christian EU.

I really thanked you for putting it in one post.. Saved a lot of time!

Maybe but IMO they do not see a threat in India as much as they see in China.

 

[Hammer-fist]

I really thanked you for putting it in one post.. Saved a lot of time!

Maybe but IMO they do not see a threat in India as much as they see in China.

The white west including the Anglo-Saxon powers (the British ruled the sub-continent and deliberately supported the creation of Pakistan and the Kashmir question to cause division amongst south Asians as they created the Israel/Palestine conflict and many other conflicts through out the world) believe in divide and rule.

Though they see China as a big enemy they would never want India to become too strong and would want a counter to excessive Indian influence, e.g. Bangladesh and others. The US btw also supports the mass Christianization campaign of certain ethnic groups in N.E. India.

 

[SamantK]

The white west including the Anglo-Saxon powers (the British ruled the sub-continent and deliberately supported the creation of Pakistan and the Kashmir question to cause division amongst south Asians as they created the Israel/Palestine conflict and many other conflicts through out the world) believe in divide and rule.

Though they see China as a big enemy they would never want India to become too strong and would want a counter to excessive Indian influence, e.g. Bangladesh and others. The US btw also supports the mass Christianization campaign of certain ethnic groups in N.E. India.

IMO, India cannot be strong enough to worry US, at least not in the next 30-50 years even then the kind of politicians sitting in New Delhi, I might be totally off by another 50 years too

 

[Hammer-fist]

IMO, India cannot be strong enough to worry US, at least not in the next 30-50 years even then the kind of politicians sitting in New Delhi, I might be totally off by another 50 years too

1. The US told India not to carry out oil trade with Iran and India showed the US what it thought by rejecting US demands on a sovereign independent country, i.e. India.

The US does not like others to be too powerful so seeks to keep them in check.

2. India is not in the same league as the US of course and is behind China as well but India's national policy makers see the state as a powerful one which must exercise its power and influence to guard what they deem as India's interests.

India is becoming powerful, at what rate we cannot say, but in the future countries like Turkey and India will have more geo-political influence than e.g. France, the UK, Italy etc.

However never understimate western colonialism e.g. France has de facto invaded Mali under the pretext of "Al-Qaeda", but it was in reality a pre-emptive move to stop the US going in there first.

Anyway coming back to the main issue, I do not think Jamat will be banned.

It must however expel all war criminals from the party, renounce its anti-independence ideology (its followers deny there was a genocide) and must reject any agenda of re-integrating with Pakistan.

Whether it does that or not is not that important in my opinion, as it is a small party and not that influential.

 

[SamantK]

1. The US told India not to carry out oil trade with Iran and India showed the US what it thought by rejecting US demands on a sovereign independent country, i.e. India.

The US does not like others to be too powerful so seeks to keep them in check.

2. India is not in the same league as the US of course and is behind China as well but India's national policy makers see the state as a powerful one which must exercise its power and influence to guard what they deem as India's interests.

India is becoming powerful, at what rate we cannot say, but in the future countries like Turkey and India will have more geo-political influence than e.g. France, the UK, Italy etc.

However never understimate western colonialism e.g. France has de facto invaded Mali under the pretext of "Al-Qaeda", but it was in reality a pre-emptive move to stop the US going in there first.

Anyway coming back to the main issue, I do not think Jamat will be banned.

It must however expel all war criminals from the party, renounce its anti-independence ideology (its followers deny there was a genocide) and must reject any agenda of re-integrating with Pakistan.

Whether it does that or not is not that important in my opinion, as it is a small party and not that influential.

Ok, coming back to the topic. Yes Jamaatis want to undo all that was achieved by blood!

 

[Hammer-fist]

@somebozo @darkinsky @SHAMK9 @Redbull



and....


this video shows a Pakistani lady (a politician) who along with her father spoke out against the atrocities in Bangladesh (east Pakistan) in 1971 by Yahya Khan's soldiers, Asma Jahangir.

Asma lays in to the Jamatis.

*Though I don't agree with everything that's said there e.g. the Kafir name calling.