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@Chinese-Dragon Why not diversify your trading partners? Increase exports to Latin America, India, Rich consumer gulf nations and Africa.

They already do. They are the worlds largest trading nation. Its just some markets have a larger middle class and higher living standards, meaning better opportunity to sell Chinese goods.

The gulf nations actually have very low population, despite their high incomes.
 
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They are already toilet papers, Its only your (China's) lust to be precise to remains as a manufacturing house for blind US shopper forever that putting them in worth....but how long? China too needs to adjust its economy from export oriented to domestic consumption which i don't see happening in near future, That's why US is not the only country which is in artificial bubble at this very moment!!


He already said 1/3rd of Chinas reserves are US bonds. Why would China destroy its own wealth? And whats wrong with being the worlds factory? China has the worlds largest population, the middle class is not yet that large as a %age of population where China would have enough jobs for everyone.

China is business oriented, and business is always welcome. Not to mention the US dollar is still the worlds reserve currency in which oil is traded. In fact the IMF loans your govt recently took are US dollar denominated.

Edit: Also Bonds cant simply be called in by the holder unless they are callable.
 
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He already said 1/3rd of Chinas reserves are US bonds. Why would China destroy its own wealth? And whats wrong with being the worlds factory? China has the worlds largest population, the middle class is not yet that large as a %age of population where China would have enough jobs for everyone.

China is business oriented, and business is always welcome. Not to mention the US dollar is still the worlds reserve currency in which oil is traded. In fact the IMF loans your govt recently took are US dollar denominated.

That's the very problem my dear, both shopper & manufacturers wants to remains in status-quo forever.....!!
 
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@Chinese-Dragon Why not diversify your trading partners? Increase exports to Latin America, India, Rich consumer gulf nations and Africa.

Already done.

Name any random country anywhere on the planet, and China will most likely be their #1 or #2 biggest trading partner.

On topic: Actually America isn't trying to wreck its economy to hurt those who are not allied to the West (China and Russia).

In fact, the Republicans are trying to wreck the US economy because they are so opposed to the Democrats and "Obama care" that they are willing to gamble the American economy on it.
 
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Yes, it is like an economic suicide bomb. They'll go down, but they will take half the world with them.

And the blackmail works, because people believe they are just crazy enough to actually do it.



If we started mass-selling US bonds after America is unable to pay its debts, that would make the value of US bonds plummet across the globe and turn those bonds into toilet paper.

Including the US bonds we have in our hands, which is a lot. Almost one trillion dollars worth.

Which would make America unable to borrow money in the future (which is the worst possible outcome for them considering that they run on debt), and destroy up to 1/3 of our total currency reserves.

Not to mention wrecking our largest trading partner besides the EU. So obviously, nobody wants that right now. The global economy is too integrated to prevent the effects from spilling over everywhere.

Just to be accurate, I think about 50-60% of your reserves are denominated in US dollars. I can't remember the exact number but I think it's closer to 60%.

Also, how is that even going to happen? For you to sell, someone else has to buy. Who is going to buy this mass sell-off of bonds? It's never going to happen, because it CAN'T happen. You need someone else to buy what you are selling.

So you can't really mass-sell, and even if you could, what would that do to the Yuan? You buy our currency for two reasons:

1: Nowhere else to put that much US dollars other than to just leave them in your account doing nothing

2: To stop the appreciation of the Yuan relative to the dollar by making the dollar appreciate!

You find a way to sell, you not only lose trillions (about $1.5-$2 trillion today, but in the future significantly higher), you not only lose the US economy and all significant amount of exports in one go, you not only gain the world a depression, but you also insure a significant rise in the Yuan, resulting in the laying off of tens of millions of Chinese in just one year (not to mention that they were already being laid off due to the fall in exports to the US and the depression of the world economy).

People also seem to forget that 2/3 of US debt is held by US citizens. $5 trillion is held by government trust funds, $6.4 trillion is held directly by US citizens, US corporations, the Federal Reserve, and US fed/state/local governments, and finally $5.6 trillion of the $17 trillion is held by foreign investors.

So really, foreign investors only hold a total of approx. 1/3 of our debt, and that is continuously decreasing. This is of course not to mention that we hold nearly $5 trillion in direct investment in foreign countries (y'all forget so quickly!) and therefore are at a net foreign debt deficit (yes, I just made this up) of around $600 billion; seeing as how most of foreign debt is being held in our low-yield Fed Gov. bonds, we make a lot more off of ours than you guys yours.

If you'd like to off-load all of our debt, maybe we should do the same!
 
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You find a way to sell, you not only lose trillions (about $1.5-$2 trillion today, but in the future significantly higher), you not only lose the US economy and all significant amount of exports in one go, you not only gain the world a depression, but you also insure a significant rise in the Yuan, resulting in the laying off of tens of millions of Chinese in just one year (not to mention that they were already being laid off due to the fall in exports to the US and the depression of the world economy).

Yep that was my entire point, that it is bad news for us.

Like I said, the second we begin the mass-sell off of US bonds after a US default, all the US bonds in our hands become worthless and we'll be the ones taking the biggest hit.

China is the one benefiting the most from the current global status-quo, we're not the ones trying to change the equation.

That would be the Republicans, because apparently they don't like Obama care to the extent that they are willing to bet the health of the US economy on it.
 
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There appears to be changes in America's stature under Obama. It appears to closing in with its 'typical' friends like Europe and East Asia.

And attempting to keep the likes of China out. That appears to be a rational behind the likes of Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP).

Republicans are making themselves look like a bunch of immature cry-babies (no offense).
 
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Yep that was my entire point, that it is bad news for us.

Like I said, the second we begin the mass-sell off of US bonds after a US default, all the US bonds in our hands become worthless and we'll be the ones taking the biggest hit.

China is the one benefiting the most from the current global status-quo, we're not the ones trying to change the equation.

That would be the Republicans, because apparently they don't like Obama care to the extent that they are willing to bet the health of the US economy on it.

I agree with everything you said except your blaming this on Republicans - stopping this debt increase should be made top priority. Obamacare will only consign the US to eternal ruin like what's happened in Japan, and it's only the begging.
 
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Just to be accurate, I think about 50-60% of your reserves are denominated in US dollars. I can't remember the exact number but I think it's closer to 60%.

Also, how is that even going to happen? For you to sell, someone else has to buy. Who is going to buy this mass sell-off of bonds? It's never going to happen, because it CAN'T happen. You need someone else to buy what you are selling.

So you can't really mass-sell, and even if you could, what would that do to the Yuan? You buy our currency for two reasons:

1: Nowhere else to put that much US dollars other than to just leave them in your account doing nothing

2: To stop the appreciation of the Yuan relative to the dollar by making the dollar appreciate!

You find a way to sell, you not only lose trillions (about $1.5-$2 trillion today, but in the future significantly higher), you not only lose the US economy and all significant amount of exports in one go, you not only gain the world a depression, but you also insure a significant rise in the Yuan, resulting in the laying off of tens of millions of Chinese in just one year (not to mention that they were already being laid off due to the fall in exports to the US and the depression of the world economy).

People also seem to forget that 2/3 of US debt is held by US citizens. $5 trillion is held by government trust funds, $6.4 trillion is held directly by US citizens, US corporations, the Federal Reserve, and US fed/state/local governments, and finally $5.6 trillion of the $17 trillion is held by foreign investors.

So really, foreign investors only hold a total of approx. 1/3 of our debt, and that is continuously decreasing. This is of course not to mention that we hold nearly $5 trillion in direct investment in foreign countries (y'all forget so quickly!) and therefore are at a net foreign debt deficit (yes, I just made this up) of around $600 billion; seeing as how most of foreign debt is being held in our low-yield Fed Gov. bonds, we make a lot more off of ours than you guys yours.

If you'd like to off-load all of our debt, maybe we should do the same!

The problem is that QE a program to buy up US government and mortgage backed bonds combined with 0% interest rate has turned the entire US bond market (about 36 trillion $) into one huge bubble and the same thing is happening to the stock market in the US (about 34 trillion $) and not to mention the housing market (about 24 trillion $). People both Americans and foreigners are piling into these inflated assets. Sooner or later these markets will have to "correct" read crash. And this won't be just a American crisis but a global crisis on a biblical scale. These US assets are sitting on the balance sheets of banks, central banks, hedge funds and pension funds around the world. They will all have to mark to market down these assets on their balance sheet, causing catastrophic losses. This will make the 2008 crisis look like a bout of cold and the Great Depression look like a case of flu. This is the Real McCoy as far as economic crisis is concerned. And no one is going to be spared wheter they sell their US holdings or not. And if you add on top of that the domestic debts that these countries carry you get quite a picture.
 
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There appears to be changes in America's stature under Obama. It appears to closing in with its 'typical' friends like Europe and East Asia.

And attempting to keep the likes of China out. That appears to be a rational behind the likes of Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP).

Republicans are making themselves look like a bunch of immature cry-babies (no offense).

Its not going to work. Because they can't cut China out or even reduce its role in the regional or global economy no matter what they do. China does more trade then America does in the world today. China has become a integral part of the world economy. Cutting out China is like trying to cut out America or Europe or Japan out of the world economy. On top of that the two biggest members of the TTP the US and Japan are in a extremely precarious economic and financial situation.
 
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Already done.

Name any random country anywhere on the planet, and China will most likely be their #1 or #2 biggest trading partner.

On topic: Actually America isn't trying to wreck its economy to hurt those who are not allied to the West (China and Russia).

In fact, the Republicans are trying to wreck the US economy because they are so opposed to the Democrats and "Obama care" that they are willing to gamble the American economy on it.

You are exaggerating
 
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If the U.S. will not collapse due to war or natural disaster, but because of the fact that politicians can not share the money - I'll be very long laugh!
It will turn out that the two greatest powers in the history of mankind - the USSR and the U.S. destroyed voluntary by its own elite!

Chance for Russia and China to shop for some of their technologies and bring their scientists over to Asia.
 
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