Azerbaijan sees 'great war' risk with Armenia

[pak-yes]

Although it's your internal matter i still can't stop myself from commenting.
Many Countries have a problem with Iran but that doesn't mean that you try to build relation with ISRAEL.

 

[ASQ-1918]

Seems like you didn't understood what I said AT ALL.

I didn't said our relations with Israel are because of Iran. Its for our own interests.

But Iran, wich talks about wiping Israel off the map and calls itself "defender of Muslims" bla bla bla on the other side helped and still helps Armenians against Muslim Azerbaijan.

You see the hypocrisy? So no, no one has any right to talk about Israel-Azerbaijan relations if you ask me.

Thats what I tried to say.

 

[pak-yes]

I absolutely understand what are you trying to say.Iran also sometimes accuses us of supporting terrorists in their country.But that doesn't mean that we go running towards Israel.

All i am saying that there are 200 countries in the world.You could Purchase weapons from anyone why Israel????They don't give you weapons for free do they?

 

[ASQ-1918]

You still didn't. Our relations with Israel has nothing to do with Iran, yet you repeat it. But no one has right to say anything about it, because on the other hand Iran are friend of our enemy. Since in your original post "Hoooo relations with ISRAEL well that's not good.".

West have embargo on selling advanced weapons to countries in Southern Caucasus or to say the least, the countries wich have frozen conflicts ongoing.

Russians neither would sell us any advanced equipment. So all left are Ukrainian and Israel market.

But I would easily say that the relations are above just weapon and there is no shame in it. Like said.

You guys should be freed of such mindset.

 

[pak-yes]

You still didn't. Our relations with Israel has nothing to do with Iran, yet you repeat it. But no one has right to say anything about it, because on the other hand Iran are friend of our enemy. Since in your original post "Hoooo relations with ISRAEL well that's not good.".

Come on Buddy i didn't involved Iran you did POST#16

West have embargo on selling advanced weapons to countries in Southern Caucasus or to say the least, the countries wich have frozen conflicts ongoing.

So you Mean USA and EU has weapons embargo on you like they have on China??Am i right. Or is it just an unofficial Embargo.

Russians neither would sell us any advanced equipment. So all left are Ukrainian and Israel market.

Chinese???JF-17????

But I would easily say that the relations are above just weapon and there is no shame in it. Like said.

If you believe in "Muslim" unity, you will be dissapointed. I even care about Palestinians, but would an Palestinian even care about us?

Well as a matter of fact i do believe in Muslim Unity.So yes i am dissapointed whenever a Islamic Country has Relations with Israel.
And so by your logic all of Arabs are great friends of our enemy India.So what does that mean that we start hating them tooo.
But Hating is a far fledged thing in fact all of Arab Air forces are made up of our Pilots and that too since the 60s.

 

[ASQ-1918]

I did, because you told me how bad it is to have relations with Israel.

Its not the same. There are embargo on any country that have frozen conflict ongoing. So its not comparable to China-situation if thats what you mean. But there are still an embargo on weapons, yes. But not small things. I mean like aircrafts, tanks and such advanced equipments.

We can talk when I see JF-17 in AzAF.

There is nothing as Muslim unity.

With Chechens above and Iran below, no one can understand it better then us believe me. And supposedly both are fanatical "Muslims".

And wich Islamic country helps us? Mention me one? Probably a bit Pakistan. Turkey is our kin, so thats a different matter.

And here is what I say. You mean that having relations with Israel are bad. Then why all Islamic countires have relations with Armenia? They also killed Muslims.

Today it is the 18th anniversary of Khojaly massacre commited by Armenians.

Do any of those even care? Or even knows about it?

 

[pak-yes]

Its not the same. There are embargo on any country that have frozen conflict ongoing. So its not comparable to China if thats what you mean. But there are still an embargo on weapons, yes.

I don't understand what do you mean.Is there some Legislation that is banning weapons import from West(Like Pressler Amendment blocking any kind of defense articles to Pakistan from US in the 90s,Same i think is the with china)
or is it just that you haven't tried.

We can talk when I see JF-17 in AzAF.

What i am saying is that why don't you now try China.

There is nothing as Muslim unity.

With Chechens above and Iran below, no one can understand it better then us believe me. And supposedly both are fanatical "Muslims".

And wich Islamic country helps us? Mention me one? Probably a bit Pakistan. Turkey is our kin, so thats a different matter.

And here is what I say. You mean that having relations with Israel are bad. Then why all Islamic countires have relations with Armenia? They also killed Muslims.

There is a thing as Muslim Unity i will continue to believe in it till my end.

We are also sandwiched between Radical Islam on one side and Radical Hinduism on the other side.We also ourselves suffer from Radical Islam.
But again that is no justification that one should establish relations with Israel.

And Islamic Countries helping well the bitter reality is PRESENTLY there is no such thing as Islamic Unity.

As Far as Countries as other Countries are concerned this frankly is a question many Indians have asked.They call us Hypocrites that USA also kills Muslim but then why you single out Israel.
The Answer is Jerusalem.And USA also kills Muslim but not the way that Israel does.And Israel for that matter has killed more than USA.And also USA doesn't come and say that your territory is ours and kicks you out because it was Promised to them by some 4000 years ago.

 

[ASQ-1918]

There are embargo on advanced equipments, I m not talking about every small thing. Like aircrafts, tanks...

Its not only us like said but any country with such issues. Frozen-conflicts...That includes Georgia aswell, wich is muppet of West.

 

[ASQ-1918]

There is a thing as Muslim Unity i will continue to believe in it till my end.

We are also sandwiched between Radical Islam on one side and Radical Hinduism on the other side.We also ourselves suffer from Radical Islam.
But again that is no justification that one should establish relations with Israel.

And Islamic Countries helping well the bitter reality is PRESENTLY there is no such thing as Islamic Unity.

As Far as Countries as other Countries are concerned this frankly is a question many Indians have asked.They call us Hypocrites that USA also kills Muslim but then why you single out Israel.
The Answer is Jerusalem.And USA also kills Muslim but not the way that Israel does.And Israel for that matter has killed more than USA.And also USA doesn't come and say that your territory is ours and kicks you out because it was Promised to them by some 4000 years ago.

I think I really can't you help about this.

 

[pak-yes]

Ok now Read Carefully.

While our relations with Israel are only for our own interests.

I and all of us condemn Israel's actions against Palestinians, but like said, has nothing to do with our relations.

You said you have relations with Israel only for acquiring weapons because you can't acquire it from west or Russia.So I am Saying that why don't you go for Chinese not only cheap but also reliable.So when you can Acquire the goods from China then what's the Justification left for ISRAEL????

 

[oceanx]

@ Pak-yes

Excuse my short interjection into your spirited discourse: IMO the PRC sees no strategic justification, nor possesses the "intestinal fortitude" well into the forseeable future to "sell"/barter any meaningful weapon systems into ex-Soviet republics - particularly when they are located in mother Russia's sensitive Caucasian underbelly with "frozen conflicts" (as ASQ-1918 said).

Israel could do a lot of things and "get away with them" because the gate-keepers of the West give them a "break", and because of their own capabilities - both points require no further explanations here.

And yes, Pakistan could sell some hardware, and Turkey could do it, too. But If Pakistan sells JF-17s (which I am sure they could), and Turkey sells their remanufactured F-16s (not sure if they could), then how do you know Russia couldn't easily "lease" some Su-xx to their fellow Orthodox Armenians to keep the "balance"?

Look there were people in the West looking to "blame" China for Rwandan genocide when the Interhwanmes bought machetes for $1/piece ...

 

[ASQ-1918]

, then how do you know Russia couldn't easily "lease" some Su-xx to their fellow Orthodox Armenians to keep the "balance"?

Just to correct, there are already a big gap between Azerbaijan and Armenian armed forces. A quick research will you show so.

 

[below_freezing]

@ Pak-yes

Excuse my short interjection into your spirited discourse: IMO the PRC sees no strategic justification, nor possesses the "intestinal fortitude" well into the forseeable future to "sell"/barter any meaningful weapon systems into ex-Soviet republics - particularly when they are located in mother Russia's sensitive Caucasian underbelly with "frozen conflicts" (as ASQ-1918 said).

Israel could do a lot of things and "get away with them" because the gate-keepers of the West give them a "break", and because of their own capabilities - both points require no further explanations here.

And yes, Pakistan could sell some hardware, and Turkey could do it, too. But If Pakistan sells JF-17s (which I am sure they could), and Turkey sells their remanufactured F-16s (not sure if they could), then how do you know Russia couldn't easily "lease" some Su-xx to their fellow Orthodox Armenians to keep the "balance"?

Look there were people in the West looking to "blame" China for Rwandan genocide when the Interhwanmes bought machetes for $1/piece ...

so true. before its rwanda, now it sudan because apparently selling cheap weapons is a crime.

unfortunately if we are going to become a rogue state like the US and Israel, it'll not be for a tiny country with no natural resources or strategic value (at the moment). iran, burma and north korea are far more worthy candidates for aid.

 

[ASQ-1918]

Thank you stealth.

Of course, Pakistan have a special place for us and are one of our few true friends.

 

[oceanx]

so true. before its rwanda, now it sudan because apparently selling cheap weapons is a crime.

unfortunately if we are going to become a rogue state like the US and Israel, it'll not be for a tiny country with no natural resources or strategic value (at the moment). iran, burma and north korea are far more worthy candidates for aid.

Your point is well registered, my friend. Armenia's resource is its enterprising diaspora (unfortunately that's not something obvious from China. But just going into a place like Lebanon you will see).

Armenia's strategic value is its location.

For the forseeable future, the road to "Oghuz" unity passes through Yerevan ... This was explained also by a Turkish member of this forum not that long ago.

More importantly, it's not about pro-anyone. At a principle level, there is no way China could support the Karabakh exclave's full-fledged breakaway from Azerbaijan ...

That would negate the PRC's stance in places like Kosovo and South Ossetia.

It would make no sense.

BTW, I think you should take Iran out of the list with Burma and NK. NK is the tail that is wagging the PRC dog. And we don't know enough about Burma really.

Iran is in a different league altogether.

Iran is not a PRC "ally" IMHO in a conventional sense of the word. Iran is a partner. And Iran could be an American partner, too, and not just under-the-table, but bargaining rather right out in the open (just like Pakistan) ...

I personally take no pleasure in some of the over-the-top rhetotic emanating from certain members of the Iranian ruling circle.

It's just that an overwhelming majority of people inside (and outside!) China do not support "picking on" Iran - especially when other para-nulcear states possess much more destructive potential (eg, Japan or Germany).