Awans could be descendants of Afghans

[Kabira]

Could you link that study?

http://dienekes.blogspot.com.es/2011/01/genetic-map-of-pakistan.html

https://books.google.com/books?id=i...onepage&q=pakistan arain xing genetic&f=false

 

[Pakistani E]

No thanks, in my view most Awans are indigenous descendants of tribes that have been here for a few thousand years. I agree with Professor Dani in this matter, who was more knowledgeable than anyone else on this topic. We are the original inhabitants of West Punjab, KPK and some parts of Afghanistan. Perhaps there may also be some connection to the Hindu Shahi rulers of Afghanistan. As Awans do indeed call them selves "Qutub" Shahis who came from Afghanistan, although this attempt to connect themselves with Arabic ancestry may be a ruse to hide their Hindu ancestry.

Sad that some of our elders felt so ashamed to hide their ancestors' religion that they invented lies.

Maybe Mianwali awans have mixed with Niazi and other pathans there.

That is not true, Awans in Mianwali and surrounding areas do not mix much although we have very cordial relations with the Niazis. My family is from the same area.

 

[lastofthepatriots]

No thanks, in my view most Awans are indigenous descendants of tribes that have been here for a few thousand years. I agree with Professor Dani in this matter, who was more knowledgeable than anyone else on this topic. We are the original inhabitants of West Punjab, KPK and some parts of Afghanistan. Perhaps there may also be some connection to the Hindu Shahi rulers of Afghanistan. As Awans do indeed call them selves "Qutub" Shahis who came from Afghanistan, although this attempt to connect themselves with Arabic ancestry may be a ruse to hide their Hindu ancestry.

Sad that some of our elders felt so ashamed to hide their ancestors' religion that they invented lies.



That is not true, Awans in Mianwali and surrounding areas do not mix much although we have very cordial relations with the Niazis. My family is from the same area.

Awans don't look like Hindus bro.

@friendly_troll96

 

[Pakistani E]

Awans don't look like Hindus bro.

@friendly_troll96

Hindu is not an ethnic group. And I should have clarified to add buddhists in that list too. I have my own theory on the origins of Awans. And I do not believe the myth of some Hashmite origins as this does not match, neither genetically, nor historically.

EDIT: There is no known figure called Qutub Shah in the army of Ghaznavi, there is however a saintly figure by a similar name entering this area around the same time Awan's claim to appear. Which is why I believe that this saintly person converted the inhabitants of this area who then took to calling themselves "Qutub" Shahis, although like I mentioned above, the Shahi bit may stem from an older part in history.

 

[lastofthepatriots]

Hindu is not an ethnic group. And I should have clarified to add buddhists in that list too. I have my own theory on the origins of Awans. And I do not believe the myth of some Hashmite origins as this does not match, neither genetically, nor historically.

EDIT: There is no known figure called Qutub Shah in the army of Ghaznavi, there is however a saintly figure by a similar name entering this area around the same time Awan's claim to appear. Which is why I believe that this saintly person converted the inhabitants of this area who then took to calling themselves "Qutub" Shahis, although like I mentioned above, the Shahi bit may stem from an older part in history.

All I can say is that dilution might be the solution to your skepticism. At the end of the day all humans have mixed origins. Even Arains have a clan of Qutub Shahis.

 

[Pakistani E]

All I can say is that dilution might be the solution to your skepticism. At the end of the day all humans have mixed origins. Even Arains have a clan of Qutub Shahis.

Indeed, but surely there should be some genetic markers which we can check among Awans to see if they are indeed of middle eastern extraction, I haven't found many. My paternal haplogroup is J2b2, which although is known to have arisen in the middle east/caucasus some ~11,000 years ago, my admixture nor of other Awans I've looked at, shows any significant arabic admixture.

Although there hasn't been that big of a study of the genetic history of Awans as some of us are VERY touchy about this topic, some will even threaten you with violence if you ask uncomfortable questions. Which is sad, I consider this subject to be nothing more than academic. No wonder Professor Dani couldn't complete his study of Syeds in the Sub-continent!

 

[Kabira]

Indeed, but surely there should be some genetic markers which we can check among Awans to see if they are indeed of middle eastern extraction, I haven't found many. My paternal haplogroup is J2b2, which although is known to have arisen in the middle east some ~11,000 years ago, my admixture nor of other Awans I've looked at, shows any significant arabic admixture.

Although there hasn't been that big of a study of the genetic history of Awans as some of us are VERY touchy about this topic, some will even threaten you with violence if you ask uncomfortable questions. Which is sad, I consider this subject to be nothing more than academic. No wonder Professor Dani couldn't complete his study of Syeds in the Sub-continent.

Its possible to detect arab origins but impossible to detect distinct central asian genes because from central asia to south india genetic cline is pretty much similar. Even if some central asians came with Ghaznavi thousand years ago and settled in punjab, it would be near impossible to know from genetic tests. Also considering in Ghaznavi era central asians were probably not like todays with significant distinct mongoloid ancestry.

 

[friendly_troll96]

Awans don't look like Hindus bro.

@friendly_troll96

sure we don't.
can't post the pics 'cause of the nature of the forum.

-
i haven't read much on our roots and history so can't say anything on that. but what i said above only requires a pair of eyes.
plus we're almost half mentals -- everyone one of us awans. in fact it's a rule of thumb to tell a real awan from a fake one.
"O awan e ni jo jhalla na hove".

 

[Pakistani E]

Its possible to detect arab origins but impossible to detect distinct central asian genes because from central asia to south india genetic cline is pretty much similar. Even if some central asians came with Ghaznavi thousand years ago and settled in punjab, it would be near impossible to know from genetic tests. Also considering in Ghaznavi era central asians were probably not like todays with significant distinct mongoloid ancestry.

Agreed, which at least discredits the Hashmeite descent. Even the names don't match, Qutub Shah is supposed to have had six sons including some with names like Chohan and Khokhar? Don't sound much like arabic names to me.

The problem with us is that there are so few Awans who have actually had their DNA mapped out, it is impossible to fully study and compare the results. Maybe in the future.

sure we don't.
can't post the pics 'cause of the nature of the forum.

-
i haven't read much on our roots and history so can't say anything on that. but what i said above only requires a pair of eyes.
plus we're almost half mentals -- everyone one of us awans. in fact it's a rule of thumb to tell a real awan from a fake one.
"O awan e ni jo jhalla na hove".

How can I say my Grandfather's side of the family is neem-pagal without being offensive?

My grandfather used to beat the crap out of my dad because my dad played cricket and he (my grandfather) did not like it. How is this not..

 

[friendly_troll96]

Hye Allah na karey kun mujhy un se mila dya

LMAO i never get awans' problem with afghans.

This is what Awans believe in, we have our Shajras linking us with Qutab Shah. Rest is all speculation, theories just trying to prove that Awans are not of Arabic Origin.

I am an Awan, my ancestors have lived in Salt Range for a long time now, We are Pakistani and we speak our own dialect of Punjabi.

Arabic/Afghan origin ?? Who cares or what difference does it make ??

i still do.

 

[Awan68]

Guess most of you know about the abdals of sham?, thier number remains constant, its 40 or somethimg like that, if one dies another takes his place, they remian as the flag bearers of good in this world, the original cast of awans is abdals, awan is a title bestowed upon them by mahmid ghaznavi, the abdals dont know the identity of other choosen abdals, thier leader is termed as qutb and he knows the identity of all abdals, this line is desceded from second wife of hazrat ali (ra), the most famous awan was qutb shah and i already told u qutb is a title for the leader of abdals, not all abdals are the choosen ones only 40 or so are choosen but from this line only.

 

[friendly_troll96]

My grandfather used to beat the crap out of my dad because my dad played cricket and he (my grandfather) did not like it. How is this not..

that's enough to prove that we were never cunning hindus. because converting to another religion doesn't covert your traits and stuff.

My grandfather used to beat the crap out of my dad because my dad played cricket and he (my grandfather) did not like it. How is this not..

i bet your grandfather won't get offended if called neem pagal. no awan does because they know they are and have embraced it.

 

[Tiger Awan]

i haven't read much on our roots and history so can't say anything on that. but what i said above only requires a pair of eyes.
plus we're almost half mentals -- everyone one of us awans. in fact it's a rule of thumb to tell a real awan from a fake one.
"O awan e ni jo jhalla na hove".

LMAO i never get awans' problem with pakhtoons.


i still do.

Visit my village from time to time ( ie Marriages and Funerals ), I have a plan of starting some small business in Soon Sakesar and permanently going back to where I actually belong

 

[friendly_troll96]

Guess most of you know about the abdals of sham?, thier number remains constant, its 40 or somethimg like that, if one dies another takes his place, they remian as the flag bearers of good in this world, the original cast of awans is abdals, awan is a title bestowed upon them by mahmid ghaznavi, the abdals dont know the identity of other choosen abdals, thier leader is termed as qutb and he knows the identity of all abdals, this line is desceded from second wife of hazrat ali (ra), the most famous awan was qutb shah and i already told u qutb is a title for the leader of abdals, not all abdals are the choosen ones only 40 or so are choosen but from this line only.

interesting. i didn't know. thanks for adding to my knowledge.

 

[Pakistani E]

that's enough to prove that we were never cunning hindus. because converting to another religion doesn't covert your traits and stuff.


i bet your grandfather won't get offended if called neem pagal. no awan does because they know they are and have embraced it.

Only God knows where the truth lies. We can only make educated guesses.