Attack & Assault Helicopters Comparison

[Superboy]

What about Ka-52?

 

[Manticore]

What about Ka-52?

its included

 

[Selous]

Focus Model: Denel AH-2 Rooivalk (Kestrel)
Country of Origin: South Africa
Manufacturer: Denel (Atlas) - South Africa
Initial Year of Service: 1999
Production: 12

Crew: 2

Length: 61.45 ft (18.73 m)
Width: 51.12 ft (15.58 m)
Height: 17.03ft (5.19 m)
Weight (Empty): 12,632 lb (5,730 kg)
Weight (MTOW): 19,290 lb (8,750 kg)

Powerplant: 2 x Turbomeca Makila 1K2 turboshaft engines generating 1,845shp each and driving a four-blade main rotor and a five-blade tail rotor.

Maximum Speed: 173 mph (278kmh; 150 kts)
Maximum Range: 438 miles (705km)
Service Ceiling: 20,000 ft (6,096 m; 3.8 miles)
Rate-of-Climb: 2,620 feet-per-minute (799 m/min)

Hardpoints: 6 (including wingtip mounts)
Armament Suite:
1 x 20mm Armscor F2 cannon (chin mounted turret)

Mission-specific ordnance can include any of the following:

16 x ZT6 Mokopa anti-tank missiles
70mm rocket launching pods
Mistral infrared homing air-to-air missiles (on wingtip mounts)
Source: Denel AH-2 Rooivalk (Kestrel) - Attack Helicopter - History, Specs and Pictures - Military Aircraft

Pakistan should look at this...Denel says that in order for it to produce the Rooivalk once again it needs and order of 75-100 helis. Since the Rooivalk was designed to operate in Pakistan like conditions I believe it is ideal for Pakistan...and SA would not mind ToT. The Rooivalk has just proven itself admirably in combat in Congo. The Rooivalk was produced during the sanctions imposed upon SA and thus does not use US components...so the US can't stop Pakistan from using these birds.

 

[C130]

How can WZ-10 even rank lower than T129? A 7tons helo claimed less point than 5ton light weight helo?

Definitely the more modern shaping of WZ-10 is able to add some point compare to some 80s design like AH-64 and Mi-28N.

Z-10 doesn't look anything special.
looks underpowered to be honest like the Tiger, but the Tiger is more advance in design.

AH-64 is a classic that's been approved on continuously
I would even take the AH-1W over unproven Z-10 .

Mi-28 is just a beast with a lot of armor a huge cannon and cheap but deadly ATGM in the Ataka-V

both are clearly superior to the Z-10 or any Chinese copter for that matter.

you can still always just copy the two and add some cosmetic differences

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Focus Model: Denel AH-2 Rooivalk (Kestrel)
Country of Origin: South Africa
Manufacturer: Denel (Atlas) - South Africa
Initial Year of Service: 1999
Production: 12

Crew: 2

Length: 61.45 ft (18.73 m)
Width: 51.12 ft (15.58 m)
Height: 17.03ft (5.19 m)
Weight (Empty): 12,632 lb (5,730 kg)
Weight (MTOW): 19,290 lb (8,750 kg)

Powerplant: 2 x Turbomeca Makila 1K2 turboshaft engines generating 1,845shp each and driving a four-blade main rotor and a five-blade tail rotor.

Maximum Speed: 173 mph (278kmh; 150 kts)
Maximum Range: 438 miles (705km)
Service Ceiling: 20,000 ft (6,096 m; 3.8 miles)
Rate-of-Climb: 2,620 feet-per-minute (799 m/min)

Hardpoints: 6 (including wingtip mounts)
Armament Suite:
1 x 20mm Armscor F2 cannon (chin mounted turret)

Mission-specific ordnance can include any of the following:

16 x ZT6 Mokopa anti-tank missiles
70mm rocket launching pods
Mistral infrared homing air-to-air missiles (on wingtip mounts)
Source: Denel AH-2 Rooivalk (Kestrel) - Attack Helicopter - History, Specs and Pictures - Military Aircraft

Pakistan should look at this...Denel says that in order for it to produce the Rooivalk once again it needs and order of 75-100 helis. Since the Rooivalk was designed to operate in Pakistan like conditions I believe it is ideal for Pakistan...and SA would not mind ToT. The Rooivalk has just proven itself admirably in combat in Congo. The Rooivalk was produced during the sanctions imposed upon SA and thus does not use US components...so the US can't stop Pakistan from using these birds.
View attachment 180993

Apart from tht we do have defence relations with SA... Been hearing about the A Darter since years... apart from tht rumour has it that they helped us with H series stand off weapons..

And we also use some SA systems like Caspirs..etc,

 

[Selous]

Apart from tht we do have defence relations with SA... Been hearing about the A Darter since years... apart from tht rumour has it that they helped us with H series stand off weapons..

And we also use some SA systems like Caspirs..etc,

Pak uses Caspirs ? That is amazing...the technology used in those vehicles was so ahead of it's time. The defense industry in SA is amazing and South Africans like Pakistanis. I was once attending a Pakistan Independence day function in Joburg and the invited guest of honor was an elderly black gentleman who was (I think...not sure, will have to confirm) the ex minister of defense in SA. He told a story about some missiles that SA was supposed to sell Pakistan. He said that the Hindus in SA tried very hard to sabotage the sale but SA still went ahead with it.
Check out this company called ATE that does these amazing upgrades to Mi 34/35 helis...since Pakistan is now acquiring some of these lovely ladies I think they should call in ATE to do some upgrades on them. They call the upgraded helis Super Hinds.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Pak uses Caspirs ? That is amazing...the technology used in those vehicles was so ahead of it's time. The defense industry in SA is amazing and South Africans like Pakistanis. I was once attending a Pakistan Independence day function in Joburg and the invited guest of honor was an elderly black gentleman who was (I think...not sure, will have to confirm) the ex minister of defense in SA. He told a story about some missiles that SA was supposed to sell Pakistan. He said that the Hindus in SA tried very hard to sabotage the sale but SA still went ahead with it.
Check out this company called ATE that does these amazing upgrades to Mi 34/35 helis...since Pakistan is now acquiring some of these lovely ladies I think they should call in ATE to do some upgrades on them. They call the upgraded helis Super Hinds.
View attachment 181033 View attachment 181034

yeah i think a limited number were bought a couple of years back..

 

[Water Car Engineer]

Blackhawk

 

[FNFAL]

He said that the Hindus in SA tried very hard to sabotage the sale but SA still went ahead with it.

Would it have been a lesser shock if a muslim indian tried to block your sale?
INDIA=HINDU is a wrong notion.

 

[Beast]

Z-10 doesn't look anything special.
looks underpowered to be honest like the Tiger, but the Tiger is more advance in design.

AH-64 is a classic that's been approved on continuously
I would even take the AH-1W over unproven Z-10 .

Mi-28 is just a beast with a lot of armor a huge cannon and cheap but deadly ATGM in the Ataka-V

both are clearly superior to the Z-10 or any Chinese copter for that matter.

you can still always just copy the two and add some cosmetic differences

That is just based on your personal opinion. Clearly WZ-10 with special attention to Low RCS shaping like tail and fuselage will appear smaller on radar compare to Mi-35 or Apache who is a product of 70s that no attention to low RCS design. Wz-10 will have very strong capabilities in enemy penetration.

Regarding under power, WZ-10 has demonstrated it's strong flight characteristic in zhuhai airshow to debunk the myth. It's glass cockpit with multi function LCD and multi use HMS with night vision and anti armour targeting all can be carry out by the helmet command without pilot using the cockpit function.

Battle proven is just a relative term. It so F-15 shall prove more superior to F-22 in aerial combat since it has shoot down enemies fighter before while F-22 has none?

 

[C130]

That is just based on your personal opinion. Clearly WZ-10 with special attention to Low RCS shaping like tail and fuselage will appear smaller on radar compare to Mi-35 or Apache who is a product of 70s that no attention to low RCS design. Wz-10 will have very strong capabilities in enemy penetration.

Regarding under power, WZ-10 has demonstrated it's strong flight characteristic in zhuhai airshow to debunk the myth. It's glass cockpit with multi function LCD and multi use HMS with night vision and anti armour targeting all can be carry out by the helmet command without pilot using the cockpit function.

Battle proven is just a relative term. It so F-15 shall prove more superior to F-22 in aerial combat since it has shoot down enemies fighter before while F-22 has none?

you do know AH-64 have on many occasions has carried out SEADs.
the design might be outdated, but the WZ-10 low detectability isn't worlds better I bet..

 

[Manticore]

here is the part2

tried to stay away from medium lift choppers

 

[Manticore]

Stick to topic guys.

Chinese and turkish members, would you be kind enough to enumerate the avionics/weapons packages of t129/wz10 - ty

How can WZ-10 even rank lower than T129? A 7tons helo claimed less point than 5ton light weight helo?

Definitely the more modern shaping of WZ-10 is able to add some point compare to some 80s design like AH-64 and Mi-28N.

How much of a difference is in the effective weight for carrying weapons between the 2? [Useful load]

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

What is with the mind set "Battle Proven" ?

Over the history we can see that when ever any new technology or weapon was made it was not tested rather went straight to the war zone.

During peace time when new weapons are manufactured they ought to be tested so test scenarios and live fire tests are conducted. Hence the cost & trainig of producing has significantly reduced.

T-129 & Z-10 both have been tested in different simulated battle exercises.

T-129 was tested by the Turk's against PKK fighters in both bordering areas of Iraq and Syria. Further to that some were sent to be used against Taliban fighters.

Z-10 is now being sent to do the same against Taliban fighters.

 

[Beast]

Stick to topic guys.

Chinese and turkish members, would you be kind enough to enumerate the avionics/weapons packages of t129/wz10 - ty


How much of a difference is in the effective weapons carrying capability between the 2?

Do you think a 5tons max weight helo is going to carry more weapons than a max weight 7tons helo?
Do you think a 5tons max weight helo is going to be better armour than a max weight 7tons helo?

Its clearly that T129 is better than WZ-10 is based on basic stereotyping with no merits to data or hard facts.