Army to have Apache attack choppers in Mountain Strike Corps on China borde

[jhungary]

Nope what I said is that if India fire the first shelf, we will be able to pin point the location of your artillery. Similar to this..

Army Career 13R - Field Artillery Firefinder RADAR Operator - YouTube

He is not saying how you counter. But traditionally a force behind defilade (Reverse slope) are of advantage than a force attack from flat. The only way you can touch a defilade is by indirect fire and you cannot put an observer to gauge your effectiveness of your indirect fire.

However, when you are on that flat, your move are observed and your enemy can pinpoint your location using an observer to gauge their own effectiveness.

It's not how you know the battery position, but how you attack them, and there are ALWAYS an advantage with the troop on reserve slope.

 

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

People have to be stupid to say any Helicopter now in the market have a chance to head up with a Apache LongBow

What make Apache deadly is not their Operational Envelope (Although this is very deadly too) Nor because of their 16 hellfire missile (Again, this is very deadly too but not the most). The most deadliest thing on an Apache is they can communicate to whatever they want, whoever they want.

In Iraq, i once had an apache guide our unit thru a maze of urban area, and on the way turn on all observation equipment and tell us exactly which window have a rifle stuck outside of it and ready to fire. But you can also use it to communicate and co-oridinate with other Apache asset and take the threat yourselves. Or you can connect to a Air Force Pilot have it drop bomb or strafe your target.

It's sensor and radar detect, then they have a bout million choice how to kill the threat and apache will make the choice easier for you. This is how apache beign A LOT MORE deadlier than any of the gunship in the world. They can kill you, but they can also share the task to everybody and use in any situation.

Before you can scream "apache" sitting in your own gunship, there are probably 2 or 3 solutions, maybe more, provided and aiming/shoot at you then.

Apache operate within U.S military system, military doctrine and professional, this machine will become deathly but under Indian's hand , they don't have the same competency as American to effectively operate this machine , we will looking forward to collect some for analysis.

 

[jhungary]

Apache operate within U.S military system, military doctrine and professional, this machine will become deathly but under Indian's hand , they don't have the same competency as American to effectively operate this machine , we will looking forward to collect some for analysis.

So, your argument is "Indian are incompetent"

Do you think this part would already be covered BEFORE we sell those item to India??

by the way, from what i heard, Chinese did study the Apache in the 90s when they were able to build 2 Apache (or quasi Apache) from the parts destined for blackhawk you guys bought back then. Afterall, they shared about 60-70% the same parts. And we all know how well the Reverse engineering skill the Chinese process......

granted it's not a longbow version. But still an apache

 

[satishkumarcsc]

Nope what I said is that if India fire the first shelf, we will be able to pin point the location of your artillery. Similar to this..

Army Career 13R - Field Artillery Firefinder RADAR Operator - YouTube

Ok....but you can only track the fired shell....not the position of the artillery. The reason is the artillery is hidden away from the line of sight of the radar. You can just pick put the shell fired from the artillery gun but not the position of the artillery gun. This is one of the tactics that the Pakistanis used in the Kargil war and were pretty darn successful with their mortar fire.

We also had the AN/TPQ 53 but is was one of the Achilles heel of the fire finder radar.

 

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

So, your argument is "Indian are incompetent"

Do you think this part would already be covered BEFORE we sell those item to India??

by the way, from what i heard, Chinese did study the Apache in the 90s when they were able to build 2 Apache (or quasi Apache) from the parts destined for blackhawk you guys bought back then. Afterall, they shared about 60-70% the same parts. And we all know how well the Reverse engineering skill the Chinese process......

granted it's not a longbow version. But still an apache

As matter of fact, Indian military is not highly sophisticated as American's in term of organization such c4I and other systems to support the Apache...I certainly not mean they're incompetent.

Ok....but you can only track the fired shell....not the position of the artillery. The reason is the artillery is hidden away from the line of sight of the radar. You can just pick put the shell fired from the artillery gun but not the position of the artillery gun. This is one of the tactics that the Pakistanis used in the Kargil war and were pretty darn successful with their mortar fire.

We also had the AN/TPQ 53 but is was one of the Achilles heel of the fire finder radar.

you can extrapolate the position of artillery base on the trajectory of the shell, I think all these calculations are done automatically by the radar's computer.

 

[satishkumarcsc]

As matter of fact, Indian military is not highly sophisticated as American's in term of organization such c4I and other systems to support the Apache...I certainly not mean they're incompetent.



you can extrapolate the position of artillery base on the trajectory of the shell, I think all these calculations are done automatically by the radar's computer.

Well then how would you eliminate it after that without airstrikes?

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Lol, you seems to forget that station Radar at hightest location on earth (~5km altitude) is equivalent of Earlier warning airplane without the need of refueiling, we can track vitually any movement objects on Indian side incluse your artilleries location once the shelf is fired. That why we're interest to get Aksai Chin first intead of South Tibet, it allows China to monitor vituallly all Indians activities from movement of any objects to intercept of your communications of most vital Indians cities include New Dehli.


Claude Arpi: The Radar over Tibet

Again u don't understand the basic concept of radar,radar waves deflect of the target and back to source.Very useful if terrain is flat,no matter how high u go,ur radar waves will only bounce off the rugged mountains in our side.You can't pick up any arty behind ridges in this fashion using radar waves,nor pick up aircraft approaching to spring surprise by using terrain masking to make radars ineffective on your side.
But ur side being flat doesn't have this advantage.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

As matter of fact, Indian military is not highly sophisticated as American's in term of organization such c4I and other systems to support the Apache...I certainly not mean they're incompetent.



you can extrapolate the position of artillery base on the trajectory of the shell, I think all these calculations are done automatically by the radar's computer.

1.No one is as sophisticated as the USA in this regard,so thats moot comparison.We have been emphasizing EW,C4I for last 5 yrs.Early this yr exercise livewire ,biggest exercise in IAF history including 640 aircraft was based solely on C4I network centric warfare.

2.This is possible.But PLA isn't only army to have these.almost armies have these fire locating radars these days.IA bought some from USA 10 yrs ago i think.

 

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

Again u don't understand the basic concept of radar,radar waves deflect of the target and back to source.Very useful if terrain is flat,no matter how high u go,ur radar waves will only bounce off the rugged mountains in our side.You can't pick up any arty behind ridges in this fashion using radar waves,nor pick up aircraft approaching to spring surprise by using terrain masking to make radars ineffective on your side.
But ur side being flat doesn't have this advantage.

your fix objects such artilleries can be located with reconnaissance sat regardless of how rugged mountain, your aicrafts such tranport, earlier warning or command and control are not flying at low altitude, our Radar station at high altitude will take care of these. As your low fly attaccker, we have multi layers of local point defense radar and...and you think only India side has rogged mountain? look at the background scene of this video

PLAAF J10A exercised and droped LT2 laser-guided bombs on the Tibetan highlands - YouTube

1.No one is as sophisticated as the USA in this regard,so thats moot comparison.We have been emphasizing EW,C4I for last 5 yrs.Early this yr exercise livewire ,biggest exercise in IAF history including 640 aircraft was based solely on C4I network centric warfare.

2.This is possible.But PLA isn't only army to have these.almost armies have these fire locating radars these days.IA bought some from USA 10 yrs ago i think.

1. that why we're not really scare of Indian Apache, we know Indian army won't be able to fully exploite it potential as American but some Indians will think that the Apache will be deadly as how American used in Irak conflict.

2. Nobody said that India don't have this system, what I try to said that you don't have any advantage as you claim with reverse slope...once the fisrt round of shell is been fired, you will betray your location even if our radar couldn't pick up your artilleries at first place.

 

[jhungary]

As matter of fact, Indian military is not highly sophisticated as American's in term of organization such c4I and other systems to support the Apache...I certainly not mean they're incompetent.

This is about how you use your platform. And by comparing Indian's capability to the US, you unwittingly also put the PLA to the standard of US. Otherwise the comparison is not balance. I mean, you need to reach the US standard to fight an enemy like the US, but did PLA reach the standard that require the same sophistication for India to defeat??

 

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

This is about how you use your platform. And by comparing Indian's capability to the US, you unwittingly also put the PLA to the standard of US. Otherwise the comparison is not balance. I mean, you need to reach the US standard to fight an enemy like the US, but did PLA reach the standard that require the same sophistication for India to defeat??

No I has never implied that PLA is at same standard as U.S, what I said was that Apache under Indian's hand will not effective as Americans.

 

[AADHAAR]

No I has never implied that PLA is at same standard as U.S, what I said was that Apache under Indian's hand will not effective as Americans.

India has sufficient deterrent that PLA withdrew its "tent" without India mobilizing a single soldier.

That should tell you something about the balance of conventional weapons power.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

No I has never implied that PLA is at same standard as U.S, what I said was that Apache under Indian's hand will not effective as Americans.

Sir,

Kindly educate me on how a US Army Apache would be more efficent than a IAF Apache?

 

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

India has sufficient deterrent that PLA withdrew its "tent" without India mobilizing a single soldier.

That should tell you something about the balance of conventional weapons power.

Such as water right? , you know who has invented recently the term of hydrological weapon, hydrological agression? the answer is Brahma Chellaney


China's new war front: Natural resource as a political tool - Times Of India

 

[AADHAAR]

Such as water right? , you know who has invented recently the term of hydrological weapon, hydrological agression? the answer is Brahma Chellaney


China's new war front: Natural resource as a political tool - Times Of India

Try.. if you can do it.

The truth is PLA understands the details better than you do .. hence you saw happened to the "tent" just a few months back.