Army pledges support for capacity building of Saudi land forces

[Dubious]

why doesnt saudi ask india for military help.. they gave him an award? or uae gave him an award?

They gave him award to make him happy without realising half of Pakistan would be passed despite them giving whole of Pakistan much more...

We are the ungrateful lot who whine after a shinny award rather than count the endless support they have given our military....many of our military packages did come through Arab land...and a lot of our own forces are in GCC...just as long as Pakistanis don't sell Pakistan...


But Pakistan is cry a river over an award? Without thinking which ally gave them funds when we MOST needed it (nuclear program/ earlier this year and many other stuff military related too)...but no we need to cry about a shinny award around modi's neck

Why dont they ask the American and Israelis

If they did you wouldn't be in the equation like EVER

 

[Signalian]

They were there before in Saudi uniforms in the 80's. Two brigades worth at the height of their deployment.

I know of one of my subordinates who was stopped by a Shurta near Tabuk and was taken aback that the Saudi Land forces Colonel in uniform turned out to be a Pakistani!

Same is the case of another one of my subordinates who was stopped at the immigration line when he was coming back to Riyadh from an emergency leave, the Saudi showed him the usual disdain and was shocked when the Pakistani brigadier in civil clothes produced his RSLF card. He was escorted out by Saudi immigration personnel immediately.

But all of this was before Desert Storm

Good that you highlighted this and its Not just KSA Military. PA/PAF/PN personnel can also be found in militaries of Other GCC also.

 

[Signalian]

KSA has over 0.2 Million troops, some sources give even 0.4 million or more. They can increase that size to half million if and when they want. Their ground forces have a better ratio of armor and mechanised forces to infantry when compared with PA or IA. They can acquire weapons en mass and much more quickly than Pakistan Army, whether MBT, IFV, SPG or Gunships and can press them into service almost at once. KSA has modern weapons in all cadres. Their SP Arty is more than PA's or IA's. Their artillery is almost close to PA's in quantity. Their APC's and IFV's are more than PA's in quantity. KSA inducted IFV decades before than PA and PA is now looking to induct an IFV. They have 1 primary MBT type, M1 Abrams and most of the Armored forces are trained on that type, and KSA has the capacity to order and purchase surplus M1's from USA if it wants to increase numbers. Where as PA operates 4-5 types of MBTs and cannot acquire a new type quickly. What will PA do if it requires to increase numbers quickly? PA will get in a fix coz T-59/T-69 is out of question, T-85 maybe from China if stock is there, and just maybe T-96 being closest to AK series as T-99 is different from AK. Forget the T-80 as Ukraine may or may not give. Any MBT (say T-85) from China will require up-gradation process, thus more time and more work required in factor and that depends upon availability of parts also. So KSA is better placed.
KSA has modern Gunships than PA, better heavy lift capability than PA. On top of that KSA has the fuel to carry on a war and can get stocks (ammo, parts, supplies) for war on urgent notice from USA. KSA's RSSMF has been setup and probably Pakistan has taken part in KSA's missile program. Pakistan should also help KSA go nuclear in civilian and military technologies.

RSAF is ahead of PAF in terms of acquisition of modern aircraft, no 3rd gen in service. There are 4.5 Gen aircraft in service. The EW aircrafts, AWACs and refuellers are almost same in number. Fixed wing transport is better than PAF's. The number of fighters and squadrons are lesser than PAF's but being mostly 4 gen and 4.5 gen aircrafts, RSAF is a very capable AF.

I have mentioned the above since few members have given views about KSA's military which do not carry justice. It maybe lack of foresight on their part.

Back in the 60's and 70's, Pakistani Military started helping the GCC and other nations like Syria in training as well as combat. This ofcourse included KSA also. That trend is continuing till today. KSA Military has been in combat since 2015 till today. This is where KSA actually lacked for some time; military experience in a war, although KSA forces did take part in Gulf war but didnt lead the campaign. Pakistani Military has continuously experienced war since 1947 and thus carries the experience which it can share with other countries. Now KSA is leading the campaign in Yemen's war and this war has come at a price but nonetheless KSA's Military has learnt important military lessons during all these years that come with leading a battle. Pakistan Military though has trained and advised KSA's Military in the past however KSA has been improving its warfare techniques and strategy and along that path pointing out the areas where it needs improvement. If capacity building is an area which has been highlighted by KSA for improvement then by all means Pakistan should provide resources and expertise in this domain. KSA could have also looked towards other countries/militaries like USA/NATO etc but it considered Pakistani Military to lend a hand in this regard.

Capacity building usually arises when a larger venture needs to be undertaken which requires planning or designing, developing the methodology and assigning resources to achieve the goal. This could highlight that KSA could be planning something bigger in Yemen war or wants to change the strategy to sustain, win and end the war. Pakistan has a Brigade sized formation in KSA already and if more advisors or military personnel are required by KSA then Pakistan should consider increasing its Military presence in KSA.

 

[ADIL SHERDIL]

arabs? Are you just an illiterate racist, first of all, KSA is not just Arabs, but Saudi Arabians! Saudi Arabia stood always with us in every difficult time, did you forget the 20 billion investment plan, the half-million oversea Pakistanis in KSA, the cheaper Oil prices (and during some decades it was even free) which they gave us

Hi. I m not being racist I m being honest. I might be illiterate but still I have my concern which you or people like you who have gone to ivy league university can't dismiss.
First of all when has Saudia Arabia helped us in the war. Did they sent us any soldiers in 1971. Or have they helped us in our recent war against terrorism or have they mentioned that they will send troops(although they won't matter) if the situation esclate to full fledge war.
If half a million are working in Saudia and other arab countries then that doesn't mean we owe us. They do their jobs and get paid. Many Pakistani citizen are working in great number in England.
Countries invest in other countries for their own benifits. Are you saying the investment is a charity?
Next time if you really want to brag about your education status I would really like to read your research paper on how these countries were made. And where do their true loyalties lies.

 

[mingle]

KSA has over 0.2 Million troops, some sources give even 0.4 million or more. They can increase that size to half million if and when they want. Their ground forces have a better ratio of armor and mechanised forces to infantry when compared with PA or IA. They can acquire weapons en mass and much more quickly than Pakistan Army, whether MBT, IFV, SPG or Gunships and can press them into service almost at once. KSA has modern weapons in all cadres. Their SP Arty is more than PA's or IA's. Their artillery is almost close to PA's in quantity. Their APC's and IFV's are more than PA's in quantity. KSA inducted IFV decades before than PA and PA is now looking to induct an IFV. They have 1 primary MBT type, M1 Abrams and most of the Armored forces are trained on that type, and KSA has the capacity to order and purchase surplus M1's from USA if it wants to increase numbers. Where as PA operates 4-5 types of MBTs and cannot acquire a new type quickly. What will PA do if it requires to increase numbers quickly? PA will get in a fix coz T-59/T-69 is out of question, T-85 maybe from China if stock is there, and just maybe T-96 being closest to AK series as T-99 is different from AK. Forget the T-80 as Ukraine may or may not give. Any MBT (say T-85) from China will require up-gradation process, thus more time and more work required in factor and that depends upon availability of parts also. So KSA is better placed.
KSA has modern Gunships than PA, better heavy lift capability than PA. On top of that KSA has the fuel to carry on a war and can get stocks (ammo, parts, supplies) for war on urgent notice from USA. KSA's RSSMF has been setup and probably Pakistan has taken part in KSA's missile program. Pakistan should also help KSA go nuclear in civilian and military technologies.

RSAF is ahead of PAF in terms of acquisition of modern aircraft, no 3rd gen in service. There are 4.5 Gen aircraft in service. The EW aircrafts, AWACs and refuellers are almost same in number. Fixed wing transport is better than PAF's. The number of fighters and squadrons are lesser than PAF's but being mostly 4 gen and 4.5 gen aircrafts, RSAF is a very capable AF.

I have mentioned the above since few members have given views about KSA's military which do not carry justice. It maybe lack of foresight on their part.

Back in the 60's and 70's, Pakistani Military started helping the GCC and other nations like Syria in training as well as combat. This ofcourse included KSA also. That trend is continuing till today. KSA Military has been in combat since 2015 till today. This is where KSA actually lacked for some time; military experience in a war, although KSA forces did take part in Gulf war but didnt lead the campaign. Pakistani Military has continuously experienced war since 1947 and thus carries the experience which it can share with other countries. Now KSA is leading the campaign in Yemen's war and this war has come at a price but nonetheless KSA's Military has learnt important military lessons during all these years that come with leading a battle. Pakistan Military though has trained and advised KSA's Military in the past however KSA has been improving its warfare techniques and strategy and along that path pointing out the areas where it needs improvement. If capacity building is an area which has been highlighted by KSA for improvement then by all means Pakistan should provide resources and expertise in this domain. KSA could have also looked towards other countries/militaries like USA/NATO etc but it considered Pakistani Military to lend a hand in this regard.

Capacity building usually arises when a larger venture needs to be undertaken which requires planning or designing, developing the methodology and assigning resources to achieve the goal. This could highlight that KSA could be planning something bigger in Yemen war or wants to change the strategy to sustain, win and end the war. Pakistan has a Brigade sized formation in KSA already and if more advisors or military personnel are required by KSA then Pakistan should consider increasing its Military presence in KSA.

Real challenge is now these Hothi drones which are cheap and lethal let's see

 

[waz]

Good move, Saudi is among the top three allies of Pakistan along with China and Turkey.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Look, it's not even about the awards to Modi. The problem is that gulf arab rulers in general have become quite arrogant in picking fights with half the rest of the middle east from their comfortable seats of power bequeathed unto them by the ailing British empire, and Pakistan should certainly not become hostage to any childish policies enacted by these Arabs that would cause war with other sovereign states. They act tough also because, much like their royal family members "on tour", they have expensive toys and huge privilege but they don't really seem to know how to use them responsibly.

However, having stated that very necessary caveat, business is business - and economically KSA has helped pk. Moreover, the hard truth we are facing is that where we leave gaps in our foreign policy, Hindustan may very well fill those gaps - which is in fact our great failure of the last three decades. No reason we cannot be pragmatic and realistic. We should also if possible push our national agenda down their throats and try to bring the saudis in line with us regarding Kashmir.

 

[araz]

Hi. I m not being racist I m being honest. I might be illiterate but still I have my concern which you or people like you who have gone to ivy league university can't dismiss.
First of all when has Saudia Arabia helped us in the war. Did they sent us any soldiers in 1971. Or have they helped us in our recent war against terrorism or have they mentioned that they will send troops(although they won't matter) if the situation esclate to full fledge war.
If half a million are working in Saudia and other arab countries then that doesn't mean we owe us. They do their jobs and get paid. Many Pakistani citizen are working in great number in England.
Countries invest in other countries for their own benifits. Are you saying the investment is a charity?
Next time if you really want to brag about your education status I would really like to read your research paper on how these countries were made. And where do their true loyalties lies.

His first sentence apart he has a lot of substance to his post. Saudis are short on manpower so there is no reason for them to send forces to Pak. Nor has Paklands ever requested manpower support from the Saudis or any other nation. They have constantly contributed to your upkeep as highlighted. We on the other hand have been negligent with their earlier investments and they have lost money so they are shy to invest in Paklands. Indians on the other hand are good business men and mke money for their investors so the world is investing in India including the Arab world. When we start being honest and hard work8ng and have the infrastructure to be able to absorb 50-70 billion investment it will come our way as well.
Award to Modi is just their way of appreciating how India has made/ will make money for them. At the end of the day it is about managing the state.
We dont make anynoises when they sign .5 Trillion dollar military acquisition programme with the US. They also have other programmes on going with other nations so why worry about India?
We need to build our infrastructure, develop the trade environment provide safety and security energy resources and other facilities nd the whole world and their aunts will come in and invest in Paklands. Till then we wait and bide our time.
A

 

[ADIL SHERDIL]

@araz thats what i meant to say it all about money nothing to do with this ummah stuff. We need to get our priority straight and work for the best interest of our country. Arabs have teaches us a very good lesson we should learn from them.

 

[araz]

@araz thats what i meant to say it all about money nothing to do with this ummah stuff. We need to get our priority straight and work for the best interest of our country. Arabs have teaches us a very good lesson we should learn from them.

Funny that it is all about money but the Sauds have been supporting us for at least 4 decades with critical injection of money which is generally converted into grant. If the ummah was dead then we are a lost case and should be thrown in the bin. A part of me actually feels that they should do so but the reasons are different.
Ummah concept is dying but not dead. It has become very complicated and resolving this issue will derail this thread immensely. We too have looked after our national interests and still make choices in accordance with that. It might not be ideal but we have to do so.
The concept of ummah is a direct enemy of statehood and therefore cannot be practiced in the way our Hadi SAW taught us. It is a sad state of affairs but it is a reality. The other thing I would like to comment on is we often lament the loss of the feeling of Ummah when it concerns our interests. Yet we blatantly sit there like bloody hypocrites when it concerns the matter of giving a home to our Bihari brothers as well as speaking in support 9f the Uighur muslims or Rohingya muslims because our tail is caught under the foot of the National interest genie. "Let he who has never committed a sin cast the first stone" comes to mind does it not?
A

 

[M.AsfandYar]

Funny that it is all about money but the Sauds have been supporting us for at least 4 decades with critical injection of money which is generally converted into grant. If the ummah was dead then we are a lost case and should be thrown in the bin. A part of me actually feels that they should do so but the reasons are different.
Ummah concept is dying but not dead. It has become very complicated and resolving this issue will derail this thread immensely. We too have looked after our national interests and still make choices in accordance with that. It might not be ideal but we have to do so.
The concept of ummah is a direct enemy of statehood and therefore cannot be practiced in the way our Hadi SAW taught us. It is a sad state of affairs but it is a reality. The other thing I would like to comment on is we often lament the loss of the feeling of Ummah when it concerns our interests. Yet we blatantly sit there like bloody hypocrites when it concerns the matter of giving a home to our Bihari brothers as well as speaking in support 9f the Uighur muslims or Rohingya muslims because our tail is caught under the foot of the National interest genie. "Let he who has never committed a sin cast the first stone" comes to mind does it not?
A

Iss dour main main aur hai jaam aur aur jam aur
Saqi nai bina ki rawish-e- lutf-o- sitam aur
Muslim nai b taamir kia apna haram aur
Tehzeeb kai azr nai tarshwai sanam aur
In taza Khudaoun main sab sai bara watan hai
Jo pairahun is ka hai wo mazhab ka kafn hai
-------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------

Gufatar-e-Siyasat mai watanaur hi kuch hai
Irshad-e-Nabowat main watan aur hi kuch hai

--------------------------------------------------

 

[fitpOsitive]

Army pledges support for capacity building of Saudi land forces
By News Desk
Published: September 12, 2019
TWEET EMAIL
Chief of Army Staff (COAS) General Qamar Bajwa affirmed on Thursday Pakistan’s support for capacity building of Royal Saudi Land Forces.

The pledge was made in his meeting with Major General Talal Abdullah Al-Otaibi, military adviser to KSA’s defence minister at the GHQ, Rawalpindi.

According to Inter-Services Public Relations (ISPR), the military’s media wing, the visiting dignitary lauded Pakistan Army’s contributions towards regional peace and stability.



“Matters of mutual interest, regional security and ways to enhance bilateral defence collaboration including training exchange programme were discussed,” the communique added.

The kingdom’s ambassador Nawaz Saeed al Malkiy was also present in the meeting.

The two Muslim countries have doubled down on the strategic military partnership.

Islamabad has reached out to the Middle Eastern state to lend their support for Pakistan’s stance on the Kashmir issue.

Last week, Saudi Deputy Foreign Minister Adel bin Ahmed al-Jubeir and UAE Foreign Minister Sheikh Abdullah bin Zayed bin Sultan Al Nahyan had also visited Islamabad to reassure their support to Pakistan.

The diplomatic mission has remained active ever since New Delhi moved to strip Indian Occupied Kashmir (IOK) of its autonomy on August 5.

The Indian government has resorted to strong-arm tactics as the siege of the Himalayan valley enters its second month.

The Pakistan Army has resolved that Kashmir is Pakistan’s jugular vein, and would fight to the end for the freedom struggle of its eight million residents.

If I were in place of Imran Khan, I would have called both Saudi and Irani parties in Kaaba, and would have tell both parties : either you guys are forgiving each other, or we will kill you.

 

[El Sidd]

If I were in place of Imran Khan, I would have called both Saudi and Irani parties in Kaaba, and would have tell both parties : either you guys are forgiving each other, or we will kill you.

last time Mush was invited in the kaaba and both of them said nuking india in 2001 was haram

 

[Malik Alpha]

If I were in place of Imran Khan, I would have called both Saudi and Irani parties in Kaaba, and would have tell both parties : either you guys are forgiving each other, or we will kill you.

Seriously we are militarily stronger than Arab and Persian forces combined. We can nuke them if they won't surrender like imagine if it was just like the old times we would be ruling these niggas today.

They are the main reason why Muslims are being persecuted all over the world by pathetic countries like Burma India and Israel. Grow some balls and stop cheerleading for Sheikh Trump and Imam Putin sort your sh!t out and stop being a cancer to Islamic world.

 

[araz]

If I were in place of Imran Khan, I would have called both Saudi and Irani parties in Kaaba, and would have tell both parties : either you guys are forgiving each other, or we will kill you.

And they would have promptly forgiven each other and then gone thier ownb ways to do their old things. It is not as simple as what you think. Their are national and deep seated ideological/religious differences which hold their roots in events which took place hundreds of years ago. It is not going to change just like that. We have dug our won grave and now need to lie in it as well.
A