Are Pashtuns descendents of lost tribes of Israel?

[Infiltrator]

So is every Indo-European language.

Anyway Rig Vedic Sanskrit is closer to Avestan, not Classical Sanskrit.

Yes, but I'd argue that Pashto, Farsi, Balochi, Kurdish. etc. are much, much closer to Rig Vedic Sanskrit than European languages like Italian, French, Spanish, English, German, etc.

 

[roadrunner]

PLoS Genetics: A Peer-Reviewed Open-Access Journal

This is the original source. It is actually on the page I posted. Now, your ridiculous claims mean nothing.

Here is another picture from the same page that shows genetic clusters. Look how close Pashtuns, Punjabis, Kashmiris and Sindhis are.

PLoS Genetics: A Peer-Reviewed Open-Access Journal

---------- Post added at 04:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:14 AM ----------



I've found the original. Since you've proven that you have great knowledge of the terms Aryan and Dravidian, I take your interpretation of the chart with a grain of salt.

Thanks for the original, but you're not understanding this at all. They're markers that mean nothing except ancestral stock. They don't mean all that much regarding ancestral stock. I'll give you an example. Population A goes to Area A and population B goes to Area B. Population A and B look similar. Population A and B have a small number of people. One individual in population A picks up a mutation slightly different from population B. 2,000 years later, each population is a thousand times larger and the mutation has multiplied. The two population still look the same, but their markers are completely different even though they originated from the same place. You can work through it in reverse so that populations A and B don't look similar, but pick up small numbers of mutations early on that cluster them into particular groups. They can be genetically the opposite.

 

[roadrunner]

On Indian Punjabis and Pakistani Punjabis. You can view it like this. If Pakistani Punjabis were surrounded by Uttar Pradesh Dalits then Pakistani Punjabis would look more like Indian Punjabis. They're not though. The difference is visible.

A final point is that there's agendas at play in a lot of genetic work nowadays.

 

[LaBong]

Yes, but I'd argue that Pashto, Farsi, Balochi, Kurdish. etc. are much, much closer to Rig Vedic Sanskrit than European languages like Italian, French, Spanish, English, German, etc.

Closer but following a whole different path.

Anyway Rig vedic language should not be called sanskrit, the sanskar happened thousand of years later.

 

[LaBong]

Thanks for the original, but you're not understanding this at all. They're markers that mean nothing except ancestral stock. They don't mean all that much regarding ancestral stock. I'll give you an example. Population A goes to Area A and population B goes to Area B. Population A and B look similar. Population A and B have a small number of people. One individual in population A picks up a mutation slightly different from population B. 2,000 years later, each population is a thousand times larger and the mutation has multiplied. The two population still look the same, but their markers are completely different even though they originated from the same place. You can work through it in reverse so that populations A and B don't look similar, but pick up small numbers of mutations early on that cluster them into particular groups. They can be genetically the opposite.

The reverse doesn't work, mutation is random, it's doesn't work in such a way that two genetically different population will be of same genetic pool thousands of years later. In other words, mutation doesn't work to suit your "agenda".

 

[roadrunner]

it does work very well. you need to think outside the box.

 

[khanz4996]

this means i am jew aswell coz i am yousefzai.where is israeli embassy i want to apply to emigrate to israel my second third homeland 1st afghanistan 2nd pakistan and 3rd israel

 

[Infiltrator]

Thanks for the original, but you're not understanding this at all. They're markers that mean nothing except ancestral stock. They don't mean all that much regarding ancestral stock. I'll give you an example. Population A goes to Area A and population B goes to Area B. Population A and B look similar. Population A and B have a small number of people. One individual in population A picks up a mutation slightly different from population B. 2,000 years later, each population is a thousand times larger and the mutation has multiplied. The two population still look the same, but their markers are completely different even though they originated from the same place. You can work through it in reverse so that populations A and B don't look similar, but pick up small numbers of mutations early on that cluster them into particular groups. They can be genetically the opposite.

I already stated you have no idea what your talking about. How can anyone with half a brain believe anytime that comes out of your mouth when you use the words Aryan and Dravidian like they are scientific and say people are more Aryan or Dravidian based on their ethnic groups. Your deluded and living in denial. I've read the page and what the chart means numerous times. It doesn't say anything like what your saying and neither do the members at anthropology and genetic forums across the internet.

Honestly, having a discussion with you is like like talking to a brick wall. Even when your proven wrong, you still deny everything or make up some excuse as to why the other person is wrong.

 

[Infiltrator]

On Indian Punjabis and Pakistani Punjabis. You can view it like this. If Pakistani Punjabis were surrounded by Uttar Pradesh Dalits then Pakistani Punjabis would look more like Indian Punjabis. They're not though. The difference is visible.

A final point is that there's agendas at play in a lot of genetic work nowadays.

Surrounded by Uttar Pradesh Dalits? Indian Punjab is bordered by Pakistan Punjab to the west , Haryana to the south, Jammu and Kashmir to the north and Rajasthan to the south/southwest. To further my point, Indian Punjabis still look at caste/occupation when intermarrying so what would it matter if Indian Punjabis were surrounded by Uttar Pradesh Dalits? Your anecdotal evidence of seeing the difference means nothing. Your the one with agenda trying to separate Pakistan from India as much as possible and going to the extent of saying Pakistani Punjabis are ethnically different than their Indian Punjabis counterparts without a shred of evidence.

If you can prove to me that Afghan Pashtuns and Pakistani Pashtuns, Iranian Balochis and Pakistani Balochis and North and South Koreans are genetically much different from one another, then you have a point. Until then, your shouting agenda driven bullshit.

An agenda to play in genetic work nowadays? I'm sure Noah Rosenberg has an agenda regarding South Asian genetics. Oh wait, since your saying the chart means nothing regarding genetic clusters and similarity, then there would be no problem if there was some ridiculous agenda.

If there is anyone with an agenda, it is you Roadrunner. You can't accept the fact that Pakistani Punjabis and Indian Punjabis are the same population separated by an imaginary border or that Pashtuns are so genetically similar to their Pakistani brothers and other northwest Indian populations.

 

[khanz4996]

we are bani israel

 

[*Awan*]

Surrounded by Uttar Pradesh Dalits? Indian Punjab is bordered by Pakistan Punjab to the west , Haryana to the south, Jammu and Kashmir to the north and Rajasthan to the south/southwest. To further my point, Indian Punjabis still look at caste/occupation when intermarrying so what would it matter if Indian Punjabis were surrounded by Uttar Pradesh Dalits? Your anecdotal evidence of seeing the difference means nothing. Your the one with agenda trying to separate Pakistan from India as much as possible and going to the extent of saying Pakistani Punjabis are ethnically different than their Indian Punjabis counterparts without a shred of evidence.

If you can prove to me that Afghan Pashtuns and Pakistani Pashtuns, Iranian Balochis and Pakistani Balochis and North and South Koreans are genetically much different from one another, then you have a point. Until then, your shouting agenda driven bullshit.

An agenda to play in genetic work nowadays? I'm sure Noah Rosenberg has an agenda regarding South Asian genetics. Oh wait, since your saying the chart means nothing regarding genetic clusters and similarity, then there would be no problem if there was some ridiculous agenda.

If there is anyone with an agenda, it is you Roadrunner. You can't accept the fact that Pakistani Punjabis and Indian Punjabis are the same population separated by an imaginary border or that Pashtuns are so genetically similar to their Pakistani brothers and other northwest Indian populations.

dear infiltrator
you speak very high about your research.i thanked you for showing interest in us.you said Pakistani punjabis and indian punjabis has lot of similarities and they are one genetically.
my dear pakistani punjab is very big.
upper punjab ==pothohar
central punjab
lower punjab == sariki belt
as you said we pakistani punjabis are same to indian pujabis ,i request you please enlighten us on the basis of above division which part of pakistani punjab shares more similarity to indian punjab.
in pakistani punjab( 3 parts) who dominates the region and their genetic origin.thanks

 

[Desert Fox]

Yes, but I'd argue that Pashto, Farsi, Balochi, Kurdish. etc. are much, much closer to Rig Vedic Sanskrit than European languages like Italian, French, Spanish, English, German, etc.

They are not closer to any of the above mentioned languages. Though they may have borrowed a few words from sanskrit, german, french etc.

 

[Infiltrator]

They are not closer to any of the above mentioned languages. Though they may have borrowed a few words from sanskrit, german, french etc.

What are you saying? Farsi, Pashto, Balochi are closer to Sanskrit than European languages are. They are both part of the Indo-Iranian branch of the Indo-European languages. The Indo-Iranian languages are divided into Iranian languages like Farsi, Pashto, Balochi and Kurdish and Indo-Aryan languages languages like Punjabi, Hindi, Sindhi, Bengali, Potwari, Hindko, etc.

The Indo-Aryan languages also as a sub-branch known as the Dardic languages which consists of languages like Kashmiri, Kohistani, Chitral etc.

 

[Infiltrator]

dear infiltrator
you speak very high about your research.i thanked you for showing interest in us.you said Pakistani punjabis and indian punjabis has lot of similarities and they are one genetically.
my dear pakistani punjab is very big.
upper punjab ==pothohar
central punjab
lower punjab == sariki belt
as you said we pakistani punjabis are same to indian pujabis ,i request you please enlighten us on the basis of above division which part of pakistani punjab shares more similarity to indian punjab.
in pakistani punjab( 3 parts) who dominates the region and their genetic origin.thanks

Is it that hard to split your response into neatly phrased paragraphs? Yes, I realize the Punjab region is somewhat large but you act as if they are over a thousand miles separating the most northern and southern parts. The only real different part of Punjab is southern Pakistani Punjabi which has the Saraiki belt like you mentioned. These people are slightly different than most Punjabis but even then the ethnic differences are negligible as the people are still closely related to most other Punjabis. In northern parts of Pakistani Punjab, the speak Potwari but that is only considered a dialect of Punjabi. Indian Punjab borders central Pakistani Punjab up until Northeast Pakistani Punjab.

According to you, the different parts of Pakistani Punjab have different genetics. This may be true to an extent but that is the same with any population. The differences are too small to consider the people of different ethnic groups. There will be slight genetic differences between Afghan Pashtuns and Pakistani Pashtuns and Iranian Baloch and Pakistani Baloch as well but the differents are negligible.

The charts I posted showed how similar Punjabis, Kashmiris, Sindhis, Pashtuns and even Balochis are to one another so why would there be any significant differences between Punjabis from different parts of Punjab.

Here is picture depicting part of the Punjab region. Look how close the major cities are to one another. This picture includes parts of Pakistan Punjab and Indian Punjab.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Punjab_map_(topographic).png

What people don't seem to realize is that Punjabis on both sides of the border used to live peacefully with one another pre-partition. Thousands of Sikhs, Hindus and Muslims lived on opposite sides of the border pre-partition. Jalandhar was majority Muslim at one point and Amritsar was very close to being Muslim dominated as well.

Here is another picture of the Punjab region at its largest extent. The majority of the Punjabi population is concentrated close to the center of the region near Lahore. Although, this map shows parts of the historical Punjab region that are dominated by Pashtuns, Sindhis, Himachal Pradeshi, etc. people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Punjab_1909.jpg

 

[Kambojaric]

Here is an actual study on the ethnic groups of Pakistan and other populations throughout the world. Balochis, Pashtuns, Punjabis, Kashmiris and Sindhis for the most part are genetically very similar.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f9/Rosenberg2007.png

It is amazing how similar we are actually. Btw what do the different colours represent on the image? Im assuming red is South Asian and blue is European/West Asian?