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An Arab-Israeli alliance is taking shape in the Middle East

BAck on Topic...
The Moment ANY Arab country start any official peace/normalization with Israel,
he would be the main target of the others... Whoever it is...
Israel is the Red line.... you can do anything... Absolutely anything... But except that...

So whatever some Arabs are favorable for that... it's their own opinion... No need to make a generality...

It seems not to have hurt Egypt, Jordan or Turkey for that matter. Or Azerbaijan. That is because the current hypocrisy of the Muslim world dictates that wealthy, successful and stable states such as the GCC (which are envied (the living standards and even the role of Islam in the society by the same anti-Israeli - as in people not preferring a political solution to the Palestinian question), if they establish some kind of relations with Israel, it is the greatest sin in the universe, while when other Muslims do it (even other Arabs), people barely take notice.

Let me even go further. When the former Emir of Qatar used to shake hands with Shimon Peres, nothing was thought about it, similarly when the Omani Sultan was shaking the hand of Netanyahu. Or when Erdogan used to shake hands with freaking Ariel Sharon.

There is not going to be a normalization as long as the Palestinian question is not solved. The ball is at the Israeli court. This has been stated time and time again.

And those of us who would prefer a political solution, who understand that almost 25% of all Israeli citizens are fellow Muslim Arabs, that 2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews (Jews from Arab countries that we share everything in common with except for a closely related religion, passport and at times political ideology = not all Jews are Zionists), that Israel is not going to disappear overnight as long as the US/West exists (even China and Russia have excellent ties with Israel, let alone India) or that 80-90 years of conflict, does not equal eternal Arab-Jewish hostility, rather the contrary, for most of recorded history Arabs and Jews had very close ties, most of all the ancient Israelite kings were half Arab (for instance the mother of King Herod the Great was a Nabatean Arab princess from Hijaz) and his father himself was an Edomite (a Semitic people originally from Hijaz as well).

Quite clearly the current status quo is not working nor the empty speeches. As is the case with Kashmir and Uyghur's in China and many others (Rohingya etc.).

But was I wrote already, this statement from Netanyahu, is a deliberate statement that must be understood in the Israeli political context and the Israeli psyche.


The guy on the right is a Yemeni Jew. (the accent alone gives it a way), such Israelis are not our enemies and never were. Nor is the average Israeli Tunisian Jew an enemy.

In fact the whole notion of "permanent enemies" is completely moronic.

Prophet Muhammad (saws) had numerous dealings with Jews in Arabia but somehow 1400+ years later, we people, in 2019, cannot attempt to solve this issue politically and peacefully for the benefit of everyone, first of all Palestinians.

It is a regressive, backward and counterproductive philosophy that has brought nothing good. Not saying that you share it but unfortunately many Arabs do as we have been taught to do so by large or have shaped such opinions due to being exposed to the injustices that the Palestinians face. This is understandable, I was that way once too. I could never imagine even talking with a Jew until I met actual Jews, Arab Jews included, and had to change my narrow viewpoints and do some critical thinking. That does not mean that I support what Israel is doing at all, on the contrary, but it makes me understand that Jewish Israelis are humans like any other, with good and bad apples, and that politics, like anywhere else, in particular in our region, is cancer mostly.

Somehow our grandparents, great-grandparents, great-great-grandparents etc. generations lived with Arab Jews peacefully side by side, but now we are supposedly deemed to kill each other until the end of times. I don't subscribe to that notion.
 
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Armenian genocide is a genocide, Palestinians were never victims of genocide. As I said, there would be no Palestinians if they wanted.
Genocide denier right here.

Do you not comprehend that if Israel wanted to kill all Palestinians it would have?
And what does that have to do with whether Israel has already committed genocide against Palestinians? You're bringing in a fake hypothetical case to compare to an actual reality we are trying to clarify.

Do you not comprehend that if Israel wanted to kill all Palestinians it would have?
Look at the sort of disgusting comments you make about fellow Arabs who are suffering at the hands of Israel. You Arabs really have no dignity, only sensitive egos.
 
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Genocide seems to be a concept you are completely unable to comprehend and understand.


But according to that etho-Supremacist Arab guy on this forum the entire Arab world can overwhelm Iran so easily...if that was the truth, then why form an alliance with people they shouldnt(at least for now)??

My Arabized Nigerian friend who started following me for some strange reason (I am honored), when Iraq alone (1 small Arab state) gave Iran a beating, what the hell do you think that all of us would do if theoretically united (the only saving line of the Mullah's?) There would be no Iran, similar to how our ancestors ended pre-Islamic Iran once and for all and threw it in the dust bin of history almost 1500 years ago.

As for genocide, you are clearly not familiar with the term either. There is a difference between genocide (that never occurred in Palestine) and DISPLACEMENT. Similarly almost ALL Arab Jews were displaced from the Arab world. There are less than a few 1000 left while there are still MILLIONS of Palestinians left in Israel proper. Arabs in Israel and Palestine now outnumber Israeli Jews, not withstanding that 2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews to begin with (Jews from Arab countries).

I know that you somehow want to pretend that you are some great anti-Israeli warrior, while living in the Zionist-controlled US that bankrolls Israel, as well as somehow thinking that Iran will defeat Israel ( :lol: ) while never once firing a single bullet at Israel (on the contrary, the Arab Mullah's ruling Iran where busy buying Israeli weapons during the Iraq-Iran war when Iraq was giving them a beating) but give it a rest. I know that your entire purpose on PDF is to try to give Arabs a bad name and obsess about internal Arab affairs 24/7. You are not much different from many other users on PDF, sadly, many of them already having visited this thread and contributed with their great "wisdom" as usual.
 
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Look at the sort of disgusting comments you make about fellow Arabs who are suffering at the hands of Israel. You Arabs really have no dignity, only sensitive egos.
I am being completely honest with you. You want me to put it in baby terms?
 
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It seems not to have hurt Egypt, Jordan or Turkey for that matter. Or Azerbaijan. That is because the current hypocrisy of the Muslim world dictates that wealthy, successful and stable states such as the GCC (which are envied (the living standards and even the role of Islam in the society by the same anti-Israeli - as in people not preferring a political solution to the Palestinian question), if they establish some kind of relations with Israel, it is the greatest sin in the universe, while when other Muslims do it (even other Arabs), people barely take notice.

Let me even go further. When the former Emir of Qatar used to shake hands with Shimon Peres, nothing was thought about it, similarly when the Omani Sultan was shaking the hand of Netanyahu. Or when Erdogan used to shake hands with freaking Ariel Sharon.

There is not going to be a normalization as long as the Palestinian question is not solved. The ball is at the Israeli court. This has been stated time and time again.

And those of us who would prefer a political solution, who understand that almost 25% of all Israeli citizens are fellow Muslim Arabs, that 2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews (Jews from Arab countries that we share everything in common with except for a closely related religion, passport and at times political ideology = not all Jews are Zionists), that Israel is not going to disappear overnight as long as the US/West exists (even China and Russia have excellent ties with Israel, let alone India) or that 80-90 years of conflict, does not equal eternal Arab-Jewish hostility, rather the contrary, for most of recorded history Arabs and Jews had very close ties, most of all the ancient Israelite kings were half Arab (for instance the mother of King Herod the Great was a Nabatean Arab princess from Hijaz) and his father himself was an Edomite (a Semitic people originally from Hijaz as well).

Quite clearly the current status quo is not working nor the empty speeches. As is the case with Kashmir and Uyghur's in China and many others (Rohingya etc.).

But was I wrote already, this statement from Netanyahu, is a deliberate statement that must be understood in the Israeli political context and the Israeli psyche.


The guy on the right is a Yemeni Jew. (the accent alone gives it a way), such Israelis are not our enemies and never were. Nor is the average Israeli Tunisian Jew an enemy.

In fact the whole notion of "permanent enemies" is completely moronic.

Prophet Muhammad (saws) had numerous dealings with Jews in Arabia but somehow 1400+ years later, we people, in 2019, cannot attempt to solve this issue politically and peacefully for the benefit of everyone, first of all Palestinians.

It is a regressive, backward and counterproductive philosophy that has brought nothing good. Not saying that you share it but unfortunately many Arabs do as we have been taught to do so by large or have shaped such opinions due to being exposed to the injustices that the Palestinians face. This is understandable, I was that way once too. I could never imagine even talking with a Jew until I met actual Jews, Arab Jews included, and had to change my narrow viewpoints and do some critical thinking. That does not mean that I support what Israel is doing at all, on the contrary, but it makes me understand that Jewish Israelis are humans like any other, with good and bad apples, and that politics, like anywhere else, in particular in our region, is cancer mostly.

Somehow our grandparents, great-grandparents, great-great-grandparents etc. generations lived with Arab Jews peacefully side by side, but now we are supposedly deemed to kill each other until the end of times. I don't subscribe to that notion.

You are way out of it... you are thinking as a losing side.
The Israeli conflict IS NOT a Turkish one... but an Arab one... Therefore it's logical that it doesn't apply to them...
So let's stop this.
As for Working under the carpet with Israeli... it's also ok... as many countries did... like Qatar/Jordan or even Egypt... Yes it's an Hypocritical stance... Coward to be honest.

The problem is with a Gov... not the JEws... so no need to make a peace or not comparison with jews vs muslims as we ARE NOT ENEMIES...

Israel is a RED line... you know it... I know it and you GOV knows it... NOt because of Palestinians to be honest..k. since BIbi already stated that 2 state solution is out of Q... And if Palestinians aren't happy they can go in any other Muslim country around...

But normalisation with Israel will mean one thing... Arabs are officially the losers... An Entire Region lost to a tiny entity... It's to accept an Official Humiliation that will be accepted and shared among generation...

All this Palestinien thingy... is just an Excuse for Arab govs to just transfer their main "fear" into a social problem... a way to hid their reality...

Accepting Israel will change nothing... As the Arabs did back in the days with the LAtin states in the LEvant... where acceptation made the Latin stronger and bolder...
 
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You are way out of it... you are thinking as a losing side.
The Israeli conflict IS NOT a Turkish one... but an Arab one... Therefore it's logical that it doesn't apply to them...
So let's stop this.
As for Working under the carpet with Israeli... it's also ok... as many countries did... like Qatar/Jordan or even Egypt... Yes it's an Hypocritical stance... Coward to be honest.

The problem is with a Gov... not the JEws... so no need to make a peace or not comparison with jews vs muslims as we ARE NOT ENEMIES...

Israel is a RED line... you know it... I know it and you GOV knows it... NOt because of Palestinians to be honest..k. since BIbi already stated that 2 state solution is out of Q... And if Palestinians aren't happy they can go in any other Muslim country around...

But normalisation with Israel will mean one thing... Arabs are officially the losers... An Entire Region lost to a tiny entity... It's to accept an Official Humiliation that will be accepted and shared among generation...

All this Palestinien thingy... is just an Excuse for Arab govs to just transfer their main "fear" into a social problem... a way to hid their reality...

I thought that Palestine was a Muslim issue? So Palestine is an Arab issue but Kashmir, Uighur's etc. are Muslim issues? Get it. For one second I thought that Al-Quds (third most holy site in Islam) was located in Urumqi or Kashmir.

What under the carpet? Egypt and Jordan have recognized Israel ages ago. Did that stop the love of Arabs for our Egyptian brothers and sisters or Egypt (I am talking about the country not any people, politics, individuals in power)? Or millions of Arab tourists from visiting? Similar story with Jordan which has one of the best reputations among Arabs (the country and people).

Israel the state is composed of people. Without people, Israel is nothing but an illusion and a piece of land like any other.

Clearly the solution is to have a political dialogue to try to reach some kind of deal. Not to burry the head in the sand and pretend that Israel does not exist. That is not going to change the situation on the ground. We have the past as a living proof of it. Nor are large scale wars realistic. The last occurred almost 50 years ago during the Cold War. Even less so now with a nuclear armed Israel with more US backing than ever before and with greater ties with Europe than ever before and greater ties with China, Russia and India than ever before.

You don't get it, Israel is not some "tiny" entity. They are a nuclear power with the most sophisticated military in the region and with full backing of all the world powers. Nobody will ever be allowed to hurt them. Certainly not relative weak Arab neighbors as of 2019. Some of them undergoing civil war for almost the 10th year in a row (Syria).

Palestinians are not going to go anywhere either. Neither in Israel nor in Palestine. In fact their numbers are only going to grow. So Israel will be forced to reach a political solution sooner rather than later and if the Arab regimes can help speed up this process with dialogue, rather than burying their heads in the sand and let the current status quo continue, I am all for it.

That does not require a "normalization" because there never was any normalization to begin with since 1948. Talk/dialogue is needed, it is as simple as that. Has nothing to do with being weak. In theory we could gather all 550 million Arabs near the borders of Israel and flood it and Israel would take us all down with them and the entire region. However the more realistic/sane option, is to try with genuine dialogue. Something that has not existed since Rabin was assassinated by a Jewish terrorist/radical.

Blame the Nazis/Germans for the problem. They apparently killed 6 million Jews and forced the world powers (West) to grant them land in their supposed ancestral land. And the Ottoman allowing Eastern European Jewish migrants to buy up land in Palestine. That is where the problem really started. It was not the Arabs from modern-day KSA, Tunisia, Lebanon or elsewhere. Or Muslim Circassian or Muslim Filipinos. The Arabs did all they could in a time where we are our weakest point or one of them in recorded history.

Anyway what is your solution?
 
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But according to that etho-Supremacist Arab guy on this forum the entire Arab world can overwhelm Iran so easily...if that was the truth, then why form an alliance with people they shouldnt(at least for now)??

well that's a separate topic ,I don't think any country is invincible even Iran .. the modern warfare is different from old ways , Arabs got some shiny weapons and backing of some of the most powerful allies, they can defeat Iran if they want to, or to the least they would destabilize Iran to the extent that it will fall and die a slow death . but as this thread goes, I think The ME or GCC Policy over Israel is decided in Pentagon, so There is no hope from them as well .
Iran wants to bite Israel but it has no teeth ..
Arabs have teeth's but doesn't want to bite Israel ..
 
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Why are you laughing? Did tiny Armenia not humiliate your Azeri brothers? Is China not supposedly having 3 million Uyghur's in concentration camps while we speak?

Did Russians not genocide almost all Crimean Tatars while annexing Crimea recently? Did Russia/USSR not kill millions of Turks in Central Asia and successfully Russyfying them turning them into vodka-drinking Ivanovs? Or what about the Balkans? How many Turks were killed/deported?

Hell, are you Anatolian (sorry Turkish) nationalists not blaming Arab countries for killing all the Turkish-Arabs as well?

well that's a separate topic ,I don't think any country is invincible even Iran .. the modern warfare is different from old ways , Arabs got some shiny weapons and backing of some of the most powerful allies, they can defeat Iran if they want to, or to the least they would destabilize Iran to the extent that it will fall and die a slow death . but as this thread goes, I think The ME or GCC Policy over Israel is decided in Pentagon, so There is no hope from them as well .
Iran wants to bite Israel but it has no teeth ..
Arabs have teeth's but doesn't want to bite Israel ..

Arabs already conquered and ruled Iran for centuries. Changing it forever. Not more than 30-40 years ago, Arab Iraq, inflicted the most damage to Iran in the modern era killing/wounding 1 million Iranians during the Iraq-Iran war. Just 1 Arab country.

Similarly Arabs (not all Arabs of course but several neighboring Arabs states) have killed over 10.000 Israeli soldiers and waged several wars against Israel.

Maybe we should give it a break and try the diplomatic solution? I think that would be the wise thing to do but what do I know?

And no, Washington D.C. did not prevent all of the above mentioned or preventing almost all Arabs not recognizing Israel and having barely any relations. In fact the same Washington D.C. was for years waging a media crusade against specific Arab countries, including mine, for supporting "militant" Palestinian fractions and hosting "hate preachers", lol.
 
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I thought that Palestine was a Muslim issue? So Palestine is an Arab issue but Kashmir, Uighur's etc. are Muslim issues? Get it. For one second I thought that Al-Quds (third most holy site in Islam) was located in Urumqi or Kashmir.

What under the carpet? Egypt and Jordan have recognized Israel ages ago. Did that stop the love of Arabs for our Egyptian brothers and sisters or Egypt (I am talking about the country not any people, politics, individuals in power)? Or millions of Arab tourists from visiting? Similar story with Jordan which has one of the best reputations among Arabs (the country and people).

Israel the state is composed of people. Without people, Israel is nothing but an illusion and a piece of land like any other.

Clearly the solution is to have a political dialogue to try to reach some kind of deal. Not to burry the head in the sand and pretend that Israel does not exist. That is not going to change the situation on the ground. We have the past as a living proof of it. Nor are large scale wars realistic. The last occurred almost 50 years ago during the Cold War. Even less so now with a nuclear armed Israel with more US backing than ever before and with greater ties with Europe than ever before and greater ties with China, Russia and India than ever before.

You don't get it, Israel is not some "tiny" entity. They are a nuclear power with the most sophisticated military in the region and with full backing of all the world powers. Nobody will ever be allowed to hurt them. Certainly not relative weak Arab neighbors as of 2019. Some of them undergoing civil war for almost the 10th year in a row (Syria).

Palestinians are not going to go anywhere either. Neither in Israel nor in Palestine. In fact their numbers are only going to grow. So Israel will be forced to reach a political solution sooner rather than later and if the Arab regimes can help speed up this process with dialogue, rather than burying their heads in the sound and let the current status quo continue, I am all for it.

That does not require a "normalization" because there never was any normalization to begin with since 1948. Talk/dialogue is needed, it is as simple as that. Has nothing to do with being weak. In theory we could gather all 500 million Arabs near the borders of Israel and flood it and Israel would take us all down with them and the entire region.

Blame the Nazis/Germans for the problem. And the Ottoman allowing Eastern Jewish migrants to buy up land in Palestine. That is where the problem really started. It was not the Arabs. The Arabs did all they could in a time where we are our weakest point or one of them in recorded history.

For Muslims... it's a Palestinian issue not for the Govs/Nations...
We are speaking about normalisation... as for EGY and Jordan it's not like they had a choice... it's part of the peace treaty...
Political dialogue failed. and Bibi made his decision already... ONE STATE. and whoever is not happy can get out.
Israel of Yesterday during the wars isn't the ISrael of Today... Yes... they were Tiny in comparison to Arabs... YES they outsmarted us and YES they won... And to this day... No Arab Gov seems to learn from those mistakes...

Yes History is our Witness... and you should read when our Region were under similar situation... YOu should read How they lost to a TINY entity back in the days... YOu should Read how they behaved as we are behaving today... And you should read What happened when they all "JUST" accepted the Latins... for 200 years they made the region their Home... Were they played with each other against each other... Since they were part of the "Region" they had a legitimacy to behave like those around... and you should Read the Dynamic among Muslims... you will surprised that is not only similar but We are even taking the same road/making the same mistakes and so on...

Do not think we are strong, because we've got numbers... You don't win wars/influence with that... and History is and shall be our Witness...

Everyone made mistakes in this Mess... blaming one or the other would change nothing...
But At least... the most basic thing to do is AT LEAST... to not repeat the mistakes of our forefathers EVEN MORE...

So when A Turk or an Arab comes around putting salt here and there on this Israeli matter... I laugh...

Our History is a circle where each gen will have the chance to chose the way of their forefathers or not...
As the Latin get into ME because of the Turks and the TR/Arab conflict... The Israelis also get into ME by the SAME dynamic... And what is even more interesting in this Human History Drama... What started the Latin state "Reconquista" is Right now in motion...
I don't know if I have to laugh or cry... But at this rate... with the lack of "Balls" among our Leaders... I pray that each one of them REPEAT the mistakes of their forefathers... that way we can deal with them....

So in a sense... Even against my hope/will... They need to normalise With ISrael... if they can't grow balls...
Let the motion continue as it was...
 
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Arabs already conquered and ruled Iran for centuries. Changing it forever. Not more than 30-40 years ago, Arab Iraq, inflicted the most damage to Iran in the modern era killing/wounding 1 million Iranians during the Iraq-Iran war. Just 1 Arab country.

Arabs Used to be glorious Warriors, we despite not be Arabs feel proud to belong to a religion spread by the Mainland Arabia, but today Arabs are not the same as they were before . Not saying they can't beat Iran but if its just KSA vs Iran, i won't put my money on either .

Similarly Arabs (not all Arabs of course but several neighboring Arabs states) have killed over 10.000 Israeli soldiers and waged several wars against Israel.

That was in early times when Israel was a new entity in Arabia, thing is later on Israel used US and EU allies to put a leash on Arabs, start Proxies and plunge this region into chaos , when Muslims are fighting with Muslims no one will have time to fight Jews for Palestinian cause .

Maybe we should give it a break and try the diplomatic solution? I think that would be the wise thing to do but what do I know?

Well I am a firm Supporter of having diplomatic Ties with Israel, but thing is my Govt won't take that step ..

And no, Washington D.C. did not prevent all of the above mentioned or preventing almost all Arabs not recognizing Israel and having barely any relations. In fact the same Washington D.C. was for years waging a media crusade against specific Arab countries, including mine, for supporting "militant" Palestinian fractions and hosting "hate speech", lol.

Look DC has always keep a two way diplomacy with ME, but when it comes to Israel they are clear, no harm can comes to Israel, so basically no one can touch them PERIOD . As long as Uncle sam and EU stand behind them there is no victory against Israel, but US over the years made sure that the new Leadership of GCC don't see Israel as a threat or enemy, and we are now witnessing it for ourselves . I am not saying that Arabs should just march on Israel for no reason but the thing is even if Arabs have a reason to fight, they still can't/Wont .
 
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They control the holy sites, not the religion itself. And by controlling 2/3 they have a monopoly on the religion besides the facts arabianempires mentioned.

The holy sites are at the end of the day are irrelevant.

Allah's plan is unfolding.

Pick your side.
 
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