America's bid to oust Turkey from NATO

US Media Begins Calling To Expel Turkey From NATO As Finland, Sweden Seek Entry​

BY TYLER DURDEN
TUESDAY, MAY 17, 2022 - 11:05 PM

An op-ed in CNN this week has called on NATO to expel Turkey if it doesn't agree to admit new applicants Finland and Sweden into the Western military alliance. Ankara has so far appeared to slam the door on the prospect, calling the Scandinavian nations "terror supporters" over the outlawed Kurdish PKK issue.
The piece by David Andelman, a member of the influential Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), begins by lashing out at both Turkey's Recep Tayyip Erdoğan and Hungary's Viktor Orbán. "Russian President Vladimir Putin has just enough allies in just enough places to throw a wrench in the efforts of Western alliances to thwart his ambitions -- deepening the wedge between member states that suits his purposes to a tee," it begins.
Image via Reuters

Andelman argues that both these countries - with Turkey being NATO's second largest military behind the United States - threaten the West's unified front in standing up to Putin.
"With these kinds of useful friends in Orban and Erdogan, Putin may be perfectly positioned to continue on his current path in Ukraine or beyond -- with impunity," he writes, further calling them "lone strongmen" who have managed to "burrow their way deeply into democratic executions." It should be noted as an aside that we didn't see any anti-Erdogan arguments from Andelman as the Turkish strongman helped execute America's proxy war against Assad in Syria - in fact, quite the opposite.
Back to the present and US policy in Ukraine, Andelman questinos: "So, what to do about these toxic delays being forced by Hungary and Turkey? The answer is sadly simple -- play the same game Putin's been playing for years. When you can't win by traditional rules, go around them."
He argues for ignoring Erdogan and Orban until the inevitable diplomatic crisis among allies that is sure to ensue leads to their complete exit from NATO and the EU...

In this case, do carve-outs. Make Orban and Erdogan irrelevant. All 26 other EU members should simply implement the oil embargo. And NATO should simply pave the way for Sweden and Finland's accession.
What's the worst Hungary or Turkey could do -- sue? Pull out? There was a lot of thought given toward banishing Turkey from NATO anyway -- especially after Erdogan bought Russian S-400 air defense systems from Russia three years ago.

Quoting Harvard international relations professor Robert I. Rotberg, Andelman adds that "The 'unanimity' rule was foolish to begin with and now is the time to test it." Indeed all 30 NATO states would have to achieve consensus to admit a new member. But instead, Sweden and Finland seeking fast-tracked entry is more that likely going to result in tying NATO (and the EU, regarding the oil embargo question) up "in knots".
Some other prominent pundits, such as the below Toronto Sun columnist, have lately been arguing the same...

With Russia's war and aggression in Ukraine being increasingly presented to the Western public as an 'existential threat' to democracy and peace, it's likely calls for isolating Turkey especially in the context of the Finnish and Swedish membership bids will only grow.

ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

It would be hilarious if that actually happens!! First it was the F-35s for which Turkey paid in full and now this!!

 

[Luosifen]

Gain Sweden and Finland's smol militaries and lose Turkey's large military, also losing access to the Black Sea while Turkey opens up the immigration floodgates that Europe is already struggling to handle with millions of Ukrainians straining welfare systems? Not sure if that works out in NATO's advantage.

 

[PDF]

LMAO. Turkey will remain a key pillar of NATO. Rest all the noise is nonsense.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

LMAO. Turkey will remain a key pillar of NATO. Rest all the noise is nonsense.

Absolutely right, my friend.

The establishment in the US, Europe AND Ankara would never allow Turkey to exit NATO. What would be the logical outcome of this scenario? I guess, Chinese, Pakistani or Russian nuclear weapons stationed in (Western) Turkey or one might say up the White men's arse.

The US would rather intervene in Turkey politically than let us go. People don't understand this. Media journalists and large part of the public don't comprehend the underlying consequences, the far-reaching differences, the uncontrollable shifts that are bound to occur with fundamental changes in geopolitics.

They would sanction us until the last newborn dies from malnutrition before they kick us out. Not even a full-fledged war with Greece would cross this political threshold in Western capitals.

 

[Trango Towers]

Gain Sweden and Finland's smol militaries and lose Turkey's large military, also losing access to the Black Sea while Turkey opens up the immigration floodgates that Europe is already struggling to handle with millions of Ukrainians straining welfare systems? Not sure if that works out in NATO's advantage.

Turkey holds the cards now...

 

[That Guy]

Nothings gonna happen. It's just a moron who's hyped up on weapons grade copium.

No one is looking to kick turkey out of NATO.

 

[Khan vilatey]

US Media Begins Calling To Expel Turkey From NATO As Finland, Sweden Seek Entry​

BY TYLER DURDEN
TUESDAY, MAY 17, 2022 - 11:05 PM

An op-ed in CNN this week has called on NATO to expel Turkey if it doesn't agree to admit new applicants Finland and Sweden into the Western military alliance. Ankara has so far appeared to slam the door on the prospect, calling the Scandinavian nations "terror supporters" over the outlawed Kurdish PKK issue.
The piece by David Andelman, a member of the influential Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), begins by lashing out at both Turkey's Recep Tayyip Erdoğan and Hungary's Viktor Orbán. "Russian President Vladimir Putin has just enough allies in just enough places to throw a wrench in the efforts of Western alliances to thwart his ambitions -- deepening the wedge between member states that suits his purposes to a tee," it begins.
Image via Reuters

Andelman argues that both these countries - with Turkey being NATO's second largest military behind the United States - threaten the West's unified front in standing up to Putin.
"With these kinds of useful friends in Orban and Erdogan, Putin may be perfectly positioned to continue on his current path in Ukraine or beyond -- with impunity," he writes, further calling them "lone strongmen" who have managed to "burrow their way deeply into democratic executions." It should be noted as an aside that we didn't see any anti-Erdogan arguments from Andelman as the Turkish strongman helped execute America's proxy war against Assad in Syria - in fact, quite the opposite.
Back to the present and US policy in Ukraine, Andelman questinos: "So, what to do about these toxic delays being forced by Hungary and Turkey? The answer is sadly simple -- play the same game Putin's been playing for years. When you can't win by traditional rules, go around them."
He argues for ignoring Erdogan and Orban until the inevitable diplomatic crisis among allies that is sure to ensue leads to their complete exit from NATO and the EU...

Quoting Harvard international relations professor Robert I. Rotberg, Andelman adds that "The 'unanimity' rule was foolish to begin with and now is the time to test it." Indeed all 30 NATO states would have to achieve consensus to admit a new member. But instead, Sweden and Finland seeking fast-tracked entry is more that likely going to result in tying NATO (and the EU, regarding the oil embargo question) up "in knots".
Some other prominent pundits, such as the below Toronto Sun columnist, have lately been arguing the same...

With Russia's war and aggression in Ukraine being increasingly presented to the Western public as an 'existential threat' to democracy and peace, it's likely calls for isolating Turkey especially in the context of the Finnish and Swedish membership bids will only grow.

ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

It would be hilarious if that actually happens!! First it was the F-35s for which Turkey paid in full and now this!!

What a silly article. The largest military force holding the Black Sea fleet back, turkey should be removed from NATO. Greta idea!!! This is so stupid that it does not even deserve a response.

k

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Turkey has now put the ball squarely into the West's court. Now, they have to make the decision....

 

[Beast]

I thought USA is Supapowa that can do anything it want?

 

[Dalit]

The Americans are bluffing as usual.

 

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

Turkish apprehensions are understandable, however, NATO seemingly though, is seeking to chock Russia in the Baltics and likewise in the Black Sea.
All these point towards an impending hot war between Russia and NATO.
Russia most likely wants to cut off Ukrainian access to Black Sea... eventually taking the port of Odessa. But it's historic handicap still prevails in the cul-de-sacs it's ports are located in...

I'm not too sure if NATO would want it's second largest military ally to be expelled. Because, Turkiye invariably holds more weight independently than inside the alliance... which after the collapse of Soviet threat... it may seek to exploit, with no direct conflict with Russia.

Anyways, as things stand today... there is no way that Turkiye finds a balance, should a war erupts between the NATO and Russia... it will find itself firmly entrenched and fully committed to an alliance it may no longer seek to be a part off.

 

[Tamerlane]

The piece by David Andelman, a member of the influential Council on Foreign Relations (CFR)

Israel dumping Turkey.

 

[dBSPL]

If they persist in this matter and continue to focus on populist and nonsense things instead of discussing Turkey's rightful reservations, the issue will get tougher. Turks have characteristic features, the most important of which is that if you want to make the Turks firm and determined about something, you just have to speak in a arrogant and threatening language. Turks dont care how many punches they get when they get into a fight.

The mind of the policy maker in the West is to drown in such a vortex of populism that How Turkey's exit from NATO will accelerate the collapse of NATO's main strategy is ironic. For years, Russia's main strategic goal was to achieve this.

Consider the disappearance of NATO's access to the black sea (straits) and the impact this will have on countries like balkans or for outer circles.. The need to align with NATO's common interests in the Balkans, central Asia, Africa and the Middle East will no longer exist, just imagine what will happen when one of the three most active NATO countries in these regions currently, creates a basis for open security cooperation with China and Russia in these regions. Think about what is the most feared scenario in Europe that has been carefully avoided at all times throughout history.

On the other hand, NATO membership of Sweden and Finland is not geostrategically incompatible with Turkish interests. On the contrary, it is a golden opportunity to draw Russia's attention to the north. Turkey currently has conflicts of interest with Russia on three different fronts and is currently the only NATO state to face Russia at these three different points. While Turkey was fighting this struggle, the NATO's some parasitic members supported Russia, not Turkey.

So what's the point of all of these? It is the subjugation of Turkey, without giving up on policies that threaten Turkey's national security.

 

[RescueRanger]

Nothing will happen - this is just chest thumping for domestic consumption.

 

[WotTen]

I am still curious to see any popular poll results from France on whether Parisians should die to defend Helsinki or Stockholm.