America pressing Pakistan on a long ‘wish list’

[muse]

I hope it does not end up with US and Pak against each other openly.

It's already like that - and you know,...well,...all said and done, it's good - it's good for US it's good for Pakistan -- Let the US go her own way and let Asia be free of the Ferenghi -- I'm all for trade and all kinds of relations with US, but not any kind of security relationship, and never any kind of Aid, never again

 

[PoKeMon]

Pakistan doesn't want America but pakistan need America though their dependency on U.S is minimum in this hour. Pakistan will surely look for swift transition from U.S plate to Chinese but she need to be cautious, China yet has some height to climb.

 

[RazorMC]

If you notice the tone that the US has used, it is clear that they want Pakistan to take responsibility for the mess that the US created in Afghanistan. This attitude of "You're either with us or against us" hasn't worked before and won't work again.

And all these leaks are sanctioned, they don't appear by chance. Don't we know that the US can track the source of the leak and prosecute the person ? Then how does someone get the audacity to cross the line and transfer vital information. Another thing to notice is that all the leaks somehow coincide with the current US thinking about the issues reported in the leaked info.

The US mindset is to divide Pakistan's society further into smaller groups who can be easier to control and inlfuence. We have pro and anti groups for almost every issue, including:
- Military and the ISI,
- Radical Religious Beliefs,
- Conservative and Liberal thinking,
- Extreme Nationalism and Globalization.

Our society has been splintered and attention has been cleverly diverted from crucial issues like the state of our economy, health and education and a rapidly deteriorating law/order situation.

=================================

An American official engaged in Afghanistan and familiar with the developments also revealed that Washington would consider handing over of fully-equipped and lethal drone technology to Islamabad if Pakistan agreed to implement US war strategy in the region “as it is.”...

... This is a long war against terror and we have to declare clear-cut victory (in Afghanistan), which is only possible if our war-time strategic partner offers unconditional support...

If you take a look at the above excerpts from the article, you can see that they would only consider a sale of the drones. There is absolutely no assurance that they will provide the equipment we have been asking for. And also pay attention to the part about a war-time strategic partner. No long term commitments, just a one night stand in their grand strategy for the world.

The second part asks for unconditional support. But I beg to ask; has the US ever offered unconditional support to Pakistan? Have we forgotten the strings on the recent F-16 sale?

The US has backstabbed us before and is hell-bent on doing it again just so they can link another of their defeats to Pakistan.

With friends like them, who needs enemies ??

 

[RazorMC]

I'm all for trade and all kinds of relations with US, but not any kind of security relationship, and never any kind of Aid, never again

Exactly the point. Excellent relations but no one-sided alliances/love affairs.
We keep asking the world to accept us as a sovereign nation but we don't even stand for our own interests. Time to change that.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

An American official engaged in Afghanistan and familiar with the developments also revealed that Washington would consider handing over of fully-equipped and lethal drone technology to Islamabad if Pakistan agreed to implement US war strategy in the region “as it is.”

The US has delivered nothing in terms of 'strategic ties' in the ten or so years of war in Afghanistan. There is no enhanced trade access (even the extremely limited and largely unfeasible ROZ plans continue to languish), the US has openly opposed an NSG exemption for Pakistan and access to civilian nuclear trade and energy to offset her rising power shortfall, and the US has consistently denied Pakistan access to technology such as high tech armed drones to bolster Pakistani COIN capabilities, and the US has been running covert intelligence and military operations on Pakistani soil without Pakistani approval.

Even if Pakistan decides to cooperate with the US on all or parts of its wish list, this time the US needs to deliver on Pakistan's 'strategic wishlist' (formalized long term trade access, formalized access to high technology COIN equipment, formalized NSG waiver) first before we take any steps.

Pakistan has had enough of US double standards, deception and duplicity.

 

[relativiti]

I hope pakistan is not thinking itself as a genie fulfilling american wishes!!
its time pakistan asks the US to return some favour (not in anti-india activities as it is self sufficient in them) but in trade, technology, education and nation building.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

but in trade, technology, education and nation building.

Absolutely - that is what many of us have been arguing and calling for. Pakistan has been trying to get increased market access to the US since the days of Musharraf. It is the US that wants to limit the relationship to a transactional one, with limited amounts of aid doled out to Pakistan in order to keep Pakistan dependent and reliant on US handouts.

NO to aid - yes to formalized trade access, COIN cooperation and civilian nuclear cooperation.

 

[RazorMC]

^^ What about the Major non-NATO Ally status? Doesn't that grant us a bit more access to US technology?

One would assume that we should have atleast got the Predator a long time ago without the US adding more demands.

 

[Nair saab]

Let me tell U one thing here...US is More Anti Indian then what Pakistan is ...But they cant say it Openly cozz we Indians have the Most dangerous Weapon for USA that is TRADE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT...

They are as much Anti Indian as much they are Anti Chinese...they are on a undeclared war Against both countries...

Americans are not at all Anti Pakistan...they just wanna get out of Afganistan...but sadly they think that the Talibs are now operating from Pakistan...
so they think by conducting raids in certain pakistani area it will reduce the Afgan situation...they cant just move out of Afgan one day without trying there luck...So sadly Pakistan comes in way of Americans for the route of withdrawal from Afganistan...

 

[Hulk]

Exactly - the world spits at us because we are stupid enough to continue spitting at each other while the rest of the world has moved way past us --You know something strange, well if you get a chance to study the Aztec of Mexico, you will notice that their culture had a ritualized warfare - and I think that's what we have --- we love to kick each other around but notice we don't like it when others kick either the Pakistani or the Indian around, as if they have trespassed on some exclusive -- it's all strange and sick and it's got to come to an end.

Notice something - notice how difficult it is for people to see beyond the kicking each other stuff - honestly, think about it - we have a really terrible time thinking what not being at each others throat will be like - some sort of Tom and Jerry routine

Pretty much true, we are more emotional in settling issues than practical.

 

[Guest01]

The US has delivered nothing in terms of 'strategic ties' in the ten or so years of war in Afghanistan. There is no enhanced trade access (even the extremely limited and largely unfeasible ROZ plans continue to languish), the US has openly opposed an NSG exemption for Pakistan and access to civilian nuclear trade and energy to offset her rising power shortfall, and the US has consistently denied Pakistan access to technology such as high tech armed drones to bolster Pakistani COIN capabilities, and the US has been running covert intelligence and military operations on Pakistani soil without Pakistani approval.

Even if Pakistan decides to cooperate with the US on all or parts of its wish list, this time the US needs to deliver on Pakistan's 'strategic wishlist' (formalized long term trade access, formalized access to high technology COIN equipment, formalized NSG waiver) first before we take any steps.

Pakistan has had enough of US double standards, deception and duplicity.

so basically what you are trying to say that US needs to reward pakistan for eliminating haqqani who are killing afgans, LeT who are killing Indians and for closing down the terror camps and shunning the culture of terrorism. Why do you think that pakistan needs to be rewarded for eliminating the terrorism which it helped develop. Please do not get back to the lovely 1987 because after that the happy and victoriuos mujahideen were deployed on the kashmie objective which was a solle and coveted agenda of pakistan and has been askmowledged enough. Do you not think that removing this sorry way of life will alo help your own country and the political and social environment. When you are asking others to reward for exorcising your own demons, can you imagine how you sound. What great service was done by pakistan by suppoering taliban and the haqqanis and the LeTs all these years that the world should be grateful to pakistan for. I am totally at loss to imagine pakistani expectation from the world of further rewards, when its army has been given enough freebies, when the free world is anyway dedicating aid and loans and resources to pakistan to try and clean up the mess that its elitist taxless public is creating. Classic case of suicide bomber mentality clearly. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but pakistan is not doing anyone a favour by eliminating the terrorists. This narcissism thinking needs to stop.

 

[Guest01]

Yes, yes, lets not ride any high horse with each other - Pakistanis use terror organizations and I agree 100% that LeT is both terrorist and highly dangerous, and Indians use state terror to keep the population in line - we don't need to blow smoke up each other.

I Agree with you completely that terrorism (the State variety as well) can not succeed.

Sad sir that u are forgetting that our kashmir was never so densely gaurded before the arrival of ISI funded goons in 1989. If you are thinking that by now raising the matter of India defending ots territory can be equated with the lovable LeT, it shows how much the thinking in pakistan is clasping at straws. India is defending its integrity and will do so. If pakisyan finds that as an excuse for continuing to patronize LeT etc then so be it. This thinking is anyway hurting pakistan more than india. These creatures will anyway start devouring internally soon because the financial and political situation in pakistan will be ripe enough the way things are going. Also i am surprised by the way you immediately draw a line between your government and elite and military the moment hits the fan while in truth, there is no difference in yiur own thinking w.r.t terrorism which has actually brought your country to the knees as it is now. Never covet fire in thy neighbour's house sir. And that us what you are doing currently.

 

[S-2]

"Even if Pakistan decides to cooperate with the US on all or parts of its wish list, this time the US needs to deliver on Pakistan's 'strategic wishlist' (formalized long term trade access, formalized access to high technology COIN equipment, formalized NSG waiver) first before we take any steps."

That's really funny. Very, very funny.

You're a comedian.

You live in Michigan. Why don't you hop in the ol' car and take a spin to Washington. Maybe sit down and have a chat with your senator, Carl Levin. Bet he'll be all ears. Try to hide your hatred for America, though. After all, remember you're ASKING us to help you again.

Personally, I can't imagine why your all-weather friend doesn't step to the plate as you don't deserve sh!t from us.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Absolutely - that is what many of us have been arguing and calling for. Pakistan has been trying to get increased market access to the US since the days of Musharraf. It is the US that wants to limit the relationship to a transactional one, with limited amounts of aid doled out to Pakistan in order to keep Pakistan dependent and reliant on US handouts.

NO to aid - yes to formalized trade access, COIN cooperation and civilian nuclear cooperation.

+1........

---------- Post added at 02:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:52 AM ----------

Personally, I can't imagine why your all-weather friend doesn't step to the plate as you don't deserve sh!t from us.

works both ways kiddo....

 

[53fd]

Seems like the US is getting increasingly desperate with how the events in Afghanistan are transpiring.