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Aman Ka Tamasha

Honestly man, animosity is fully expected considering the hatred that has bred between our both countries as a result of consistent ultra nationalist/religious propaganda brainwashing the masses from a young age. The hospitality an Indian receives in Pakistan is more of a tradition for us regardless of who the guest might be rather than love for Indians, doesn't mean we like them.
That is certainly a point of view, and I respect it.
Foreign guests get treated in a variety of ways, ranging from astonished welcomes to someone who speaks one of our languages well, to, frankly speaking, indifference to the vast numbers who float in and out.

Your account is the first I have come across narrating outright hostility, and it was disconcerting to read them. If I were to enter into a mode of denial, I would bombard this forum with links to videos and print accounts showing foreigners, including Pakistanis, talking about their experiences in India. I will not, so no long queues of favourable accounts.
 
It ranges from the treatment you are meted out by immigration officials to being crassly refused service by everyday drivers or hoteliers because you come from Pakistan. Knew of this one guy (resided in India as his father was a diplomat) who went shopping in Delhi (pre 2008) and when he told the shopkeeper that he came from Pakistan, the lunatic pulled a pistol out and "politely" told him to leave his shop premises. This is likely the tip of the iceberg regarding such stories of Pakistanis visiting India, and it is unfortunately fully expected for someone coming from a dreaded enemy country. This is not to say that there are many stories of Pakistanis who had great experiences in India, but I fear that the negative ones are the majority which make up the soft underbelly.
I suspect these are location specific accounts. While my daughter spent three years in a very well known city outside where she had grown up, I had constant nightmares about her safety and security.

It could easily happen that taxi drivers, hoteliers and small shopkeepers behaved rudely, although it was interesting to read about the shopkeeper who pulled out a gun. Guns are not very much in evidence in India. Of course criminals get their hands on them, of course criminals might also own shops, but the circumstances are unusual.
 
Tagging some more folks that might be interested to hangout here and maybe read last few pages of replies (after the early trolling went away) and share any of their thoughts on any posts that strike their interest.

It may serve as respite from some other more dominant news stories grabbing most attention now.

@Jungibaaz (unsure if he is back)

@VCheng @_NOBODY_ @Meengla @Valar.
 
Tagging some more folks that might be interested to hangout here and maybe read last few pages of replies (after the early trolling went away) and share any of their thoughts on any posts that strike their interest.

It may serve as respite from some other more dominant news stories grabbing most attention now.

@Jungibaaz (unsure if he is back)

@VCheng @_NOBODY_ @Meengla @Valar.

I will need some time to scan this thread first.
 
I will need some time to scan this thread first.

Topic kind of petered out anyway.

BTW, saiyan posted a pretty long interesting 7 part series on op Gibraltar you should have a look at in the other place.
 
Inrealistic scenario and frankly why should india evwn care about Pakistan? A beggar banana republic is worthless to anyone, evwn Afghanistan is better than this colonial slave.
 
It's amazing how few people actually know the deep enough contours of this in that era.

There was a lot of acrimony within the tories in the 19th century as urbanisation and industrialisation happened.

The tories supported a large amount of policies that sought to stem this current and try retain as much of the agricultural population as possible....to prop up their own political power and bargaining, by essentially having as little market opportunity and scope for the worker population to seek maximum return for their labour.....and forcing them to put social constraints (and the argued "better" social order and way of things) first.

Over time they were forced to adapt to the reality and introduce more compromise and nuance in their positions but it took a really long time. i.e Conserve things that appealed to enough folks regarding politics of this newer reality (that had now been much influenced by the progressives and liberals w.r.t industrialisation, freer markets, urbanisation)....after it was realised the old situation would simply not return....and new generations had simply now been born and bred in the cities and freer labour and freer market situation.

But in that interim they always promoted and appealed to certain nativist, tribalist, ruralist sentiment (to bring old order of serfdom they could lord over) that had its bleed over into the colonial (anti humanist) and mercantile (anti free market) mindset for the foreign possessions.

i.e Social order by stagnant social stratification....dont think and reason for yourselves, we'll do that for you, we know whats best for you.

This phenomenon of the interim continues in its own way today w.r.t conservatism broadly (or in some measure depending on your perspective), it is most studied w.r.t the developed world generally though.

People actually dont study where the word conservative comes from.... I've lost track of how many people blindly say conservative = free market/capitalism (and vice versa that progressives and liberals are anti free market or marxists or whatever else) and that they are the one and the same, when these realities and compromises have much longer timescales to look at. Free markets and capitalism were at one point quite anti-conservative (new + progressive) phenomenon especially in their application, institutional contours and political heritage which all needed time to form (and for later conservatives to reference as the starting basis to then argue to conserve).

@VCheng

Nazism/ fascism stemmed form leftist ideology!

@sms please read my earlier reply I quote here, think upon it a bit and then come back to me regarding your assertion here.

@Joe Shearer can also maybe continue upon this matter here. @Krptonite might be interested participant as well.
 

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