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Akhand Bharat possible, will be good for Pakistan, says RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat

Mohenjendaro and Harrapa are in Pakistan not in india or bangladesh. Most of the Indus River is also in Pakistan. Hence the term "Indus Valley Civilization". The remnants of the civilisations found in modern day Pakistan have nothing to do with modern day india or bangladesh.
Sir, your flag has 'UK' as well. Assuming, 2 generations down the line, your grandson in London claims his history from Pakistan. Would he be wrong?
Similarly, it does not matter if the civilization is presently in Pakistan. We, Indians, you Pakistanis and Bangladeshis, all of us have deep rooted connection to the shared past. We cannot disassociate ourselves from that. We proudly claim our past and you are welcome to do so as well.
 
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We, Indians, you Pakistanis and Bangladeshis, all of us have deep rooted connection to the shared past. We cannot disassociate ourselves from that. We proudly claim our past and you are welcome to do so as well.

lol. bakwaas logic.
 
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Sir, your flag has 'UK' as well. Assuming, 2 generations down the line, your grandson in London claims his history from Pakistan. Would he be wrong?
Similarly, it does not matter if the civilization is presently in Pakistan. We, Indians, you Pakistanis and Bangladeshis, all of us have deep rooted connection to the shared past. We cannot disassociate ourselves from that. We proudly claim our past and you are welcome to do so as well.



Being ruled by the British between 1853 and 1947 does not make us the same. 40% of Pakistan's population has direct racial and genetic links to either Iran and Afghanistan. That doesn't make us Afghans or Persian just as it doesn't make us indian.
 
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Lol, the only time there was an akhanst bahrat was when muslims ruled it, does this buffoon want it to happen again..
 
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lol. bakwaas logic.
Thats your thinking. We are happy to continue to solely claim the wonderful past. Whenever you are convinced, you are welcome to join us in claiming the shared past. If you want to consider yourself central Asian, you are free to do so as well.
 
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Thats your thinking. We are happy to continue to solely claim the wonderful past. Whenever you are convinced, you are welcome to join us in claiming the shared past. If you want to consider yourself central Asian, you are free to do so as well.

pashtuns defeated the british and sikhs in many battles. i as a pakistani of bihari ethnicity take full credit for this great past. lol.

Indus valley civilisation is only Pakistani. but of course, the typical indian that you are, here to steal credit. not satisfied with stealing lands, now you are after others credit.
 
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pashtuns defeated the british and sikhs in many battles. i as a pakistani of bihari ethnicity take full credit for this great past. lol.

Indus valley civilisation is only Pakistani. but of course, the typical indian that you are, here to steal credit. not satisfied with stealing lands, now you are after others credit.
oh. So do you consider yourself as 'Pashtun' ? If not, and if you are proud of your bihari ethnicity, then how do you reconcile with 'PakistanForever' who claims that Pakistanis are racially different and superior from Indians?
Civilization is not an invention that anyone can steal. We feel pride that our ancestors belonged to that civilization. If you feel the same, then you should be proud of it too.
 
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oh. So do you consider yourself as 'Pashtun' ?

according to your bakwaas logic i am a pashtoon and i can take credit for their achievements. straight up chutyapa.

Civilization is not an invention that anyone can steal. We feel pride that our ancestors belonged to that civilization.

bhadwe, the indus valley civilisation is in present day Pakistan. not one inch of it is in India. not one inch. but of course, take the credit away from other ethnic groups. take their lands too. be the typical indian shit you were born to be. also, welcome to PDF, home to many indian trolls and you can take your rightful place among them.
 
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according to your bakwaas logic i am a pashtoon and i can take credit for their achievements. straight up chutyapa.



bhadwe, the indus valley civilisation is in present day Pakistan. not one inch of it is in India. not one inch. but of course, take the credit away from other ethnic groups. take their lands too. be the typical indian shit you were born to be. also, welcome to PDF, home to many indian trolls and you can take your rightful place among them.
You are confusing yourself. First up, do you consider yourself Pashtun or Bihari. If Pashtun, then thats some genetic engineering. wow. If Bihari, then answer my question on 'PakistanForever''s comments.

Not sure about your ethnicity, but defintely your upbringing has not been good for you to continue use profane language. I would request sensible Pakistanis to teach you their tehzeeb.
 
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Mr. Akram, you look like an educated and sane person to me. It would be my honour to converse with you. Whatever difference of opinion we have is just a result of a dice-roll. If I was born in Pakistan and you here, our opinions would be opposite. Your willingness to here arguments on merit and agree on some aspects is truly commendable.

Coming to your post. As Shakespeare said "whats in a name". It does not matter, if you call this land "India" or "Hindustan", "Bharat" or "Aryavrat". This land had a cultural unity since time immemorial. You rightly pointed out that your leaders foolishly abandoned your ancestral history and followed Arab history. Present day India, Pakistan and Bangladesh are true successors of Indus valley civilization. Its a welcome sign if you guys come back to that realization.

There is no deep state concept in India. Civilian supremacy is unchallenged. Common public does not know the name of our army chief. So currently, Modi is truly leading India and is not just a front.

So, you do agree that China advising you against some of your actions. Since you do not hear us, atleast hear your friend China and focus on economic development then. You have seen first hand how China has developed.

From what I have read about Siachen, that land was a grey zone and there was no LoC over it. As per what I have read, Indian Army came to know that Pak Army was about to occupy Siachen. So Indian Army pre-empted the move by occuping it. I would love an early settlement of the entire issue so that our soldiers need not freeze to death on those heights.

Lets hope the latest ceasefire leads to something meaningful. I would love to travel across South Asia as we can in Europe.
I'll let you in on a bit about Siachen. PK intel reports from a few years prior to Indian occupation of Siachen informed our military planners of Indian Scientific posts in Antartica where soldiers were being sent (limited numbers). PK Mil could not put this intel together in time that this was a precursor training for Siachen. In terms of Siachen, till Indian occupation that part of LOC was not monitored/manned throughout the year. PK and IND would come to their their posts in Spring and Summer. Rest of the year that part was left unmanned. This cycle happened every year till the year that when PK went to occupy their posts they found Indians far further in than in the previous years. That is how this (Siachen) began exactly like Kargil many years later.

In terms of our roles being reversed. I have thought about that. What I know I would be espousing in India (were I in your shoes) would be that the Chankia philosophy of "not friend of neighbors but neighbor's neighbors" is dumb and short termed, but I guess we live in this curse of small minded sub-continent people moonlighting as Sun Tsu or Machiavelli . That having calm borders/relationships is a precursor to national wealth or regional development. That pushing smaller countries to the limit will change and impact us more than we think in terms of changing our own national construct, and will give rise to local forces that one day can destroy us especially given our own fractures (old saying of people in glass houses). It would also give third parties the ability to come play big power politics. And now in contemporary times, give China the ability to encircle us. It is extremely short-sighted for India to think that a country like Pakistan with 225M people and a land mass almost the size of the US eastern seaboard can be brought under extra-political control.

My approach would have been that as a larger more secure country lets make Pakistan feel at ease with us, even if it means giving it more, because by dis-arming their animus over the long term we'll gain far more. But three things precluded that from happening, the generational Hindu distrust of Muslims (ala Pakistan a poster child of Islam and some correct views of poor muslim rulers in pre-colonial India), the bloody partition and the short minded zero sum mentality. All of these things entrenched our people in this cycle that is now very difficult to get out of. Also Indian's rulers took on a bad policy to start with. Which was that the Pakistani experiment will fail and its failure is a validation of India. By playing regional politics in this way they enabled their own hawks, entrenched themselves into a corner with limited rapprochement options. Perhaps it is the fate of our land, and expecting Indian's to be saints was never an option. So our land might be destined to remain blood soaked with little chance of change for our lot.

The change if it does come, will come from India more so than Pakistan. We are smaller and will always be reactionary and security oriented as we should be.
 
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You are confusing yourself. First up, do you consider yourself Pashtun or Bihari. If Pashtun, then thats some genetic engineering. wow. If Bihari, then answer my question on 'PakistanForever''s comments.

using your logic i am whatever i want to be. i take credit for achievements of all races that were under the british raj.

Not sure about your ethnicity, but defintely your upbringing has not been good for you to continue use profane language. I would request sensible Pakistanis to teach you their tehzeeb.

you can appeal to the mods to get me banned, i really dont care. if indians can get banned and return, so can i. but i will still tell you to get fucked. typical indian.
 
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I'll let you in on a bit about Siachen. PK intel reports from a few years prior to Indian occupation of Siachen informed our military planners of Indian Scientific posts in Antartica where soldiers were being sent (limited numbers). PK Mil could not put this intel together in time that this was a precursor training for Siachen. In terms of Siachen, till Indian occupation that part of LOC was not monitored/manned throughout the year. PK and IND would come to their their posts in Spring and Summer. Rest of the year that part was left unmanned. This cycle happened every year till the year that when PK went to occupy their posts they found Indians far further in than in the previous years. That is how this (Siachen) began.

In terms of our roles being reversed. I have thought about that. What I know I would be espousing in India (were I in your shoes) would be that the Chankia philosophy of "not friend of neighbors but neighbor's neighbors" is dumb and short termed, but I guess we live in this curse of small minded sub-continent people. That having calm borders/relationships is a precursor to national wealth or regional development. That pushing smaller countries to the limit will change and impact us more than we think in terms of changing our own national construct, and will give rise to local forces that one day can destroy us especially given our own fractures (old saying of people in glass houses). It would also give third parties the ability to come play big power politics. And now in contemporary times, give China the ability to encircle us. It is extremely short-sighted for India to think that a country like Pakistan with 225M people and a land mass almost the size of the US eastern seaboard can be brought under extra-political control.

My approach would have been that as a larger more secure country lets make Pakistan feel at ease with us, even if it means giving it more, because by dis-arming their animus over the long term we'll gain far more. But three things precluded that from happening, the generational Hindu distrust of Muslims (ala Pakistan a poster child of Islam and some correct views of poor muslim rulers in pre-colonial India), the bloody partition and the short minded zero sum mentality. All of these things entrenched our people in this cycle that is now very difficult to get out of. Also Indian's rulers took on a bad policy to start with. Which was that the Pakistani experiment will fail and its failure is a validation of India. By playing regional politics in this way they enabled their own hawks, entrenched themselves into a corner with limited rapprochement options. Perhaps it is the fate of our land, and expecting Indian's to be saints was never an option. So our land might be destined to remain blood soaked with little chance of change for our lot.

The change if it does come, will come from India more so than Pakistan. We are smaller and will always be reactionary and security oriented as we should be.

Regarding Siachen, I would request you to give me some credible and neutral sources before I comment. I can also dig up my claims till then.

I believe we are not able to truly think from each other's side. That would have required us to actually have been brought up in that mindset which we havent. So instead of replying to your other points, I would just lament the fact that our Pakistan was created, Jinnah did not live long. He should have either died before partition (so that it could have been avoided), or lived more years, so that Pakistan would have been more secular today. Your leaders have forgotten Jinnah's speech given at your independence. Politics aside, leaders at that time were truly friends of each other. Can we say the same about today. Modi and Imran call each other names.

We need more maturity from our leaders to solve the issues facing us.
using your logic i am whatever i want to be. i take credit for achievements of all races that were under the british raj.



you can appeal to the mods to get me banned, i really dont care. if indians can get banned and return, so can i. but i will still tell you to get fucked. typical indian.
My ego is not tiny to call the police on some miscreants. I can handle them myself. You show your upbringing by your speech. I will show mine by my way of talking.
 
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Regarding Siachen, I would request you to give me some credible and neutral sources before I comment. I can also dig up my claims till then.

I believe we are not able to truly think from each other's side. That would have required us to actually have been brought up in that mindset which we havent. So instead of replying to your other points, I would just lament the fact that our Pakistan was created, Jinnah did not live long. He should have either died before partition (so that it could have been avoided), or lived more years, so that Pakistan would have been more secular today. Your leaders have forgotten Jinnah's speech given at your independence. Politics aside, leaders at that time were truly friends of each other. Can we say the same about today. Modi and Imran call each other names.

We need more maturity from our leaders to solve the issues facing us.

My ego is not tiny to call the police on some miscreants. I can handle them myself. You show your upbringing by your speech. I will show mine by my way of talking.
Mr Magra,

I am not giving you dug up info. What I am giving you is direct experience. It cannot be more authentic. Also I am not taking a position on India's action in Siachen. What I am saying is that actions have consequences, and Siachen perpetuated a cycle of distrust that began before partition. I stated this as a counter point to your Bhagal Me Churee point regarding 1999. Can you atleast agree that PK would see your Siachen adventure within the same lens that you saw 1999 in? Can your MOD or DGMO show a single picture of Indian soldiers at the KK Pass prior to 1984? Prob not. We can on the other hand.

Also I find it interesting that the "history" you have been sold is that if we had not done so Pakistan was going to occupy this (Siachen). Any officer from those days (on both sides) would tell you that LOC within that sector was not officially demarcated, but that there was a yearly cycle both sides followed, with posts and treks in the warmer months with an established MO.

Then some enterprising officer or group decided to change it. The rest is history.
 
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You show your upbringing by your speech. I will show mine by my way of talking.

and you show your upbringing by stealing others land and calling it just. at least i am honest about my upbringing, and it was to piss on India whenever i got the chance.
 
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Mr Magra,

I am not giving you dug up info. What I am giving you is direct experience. It cannot be more authentic. Also I am not taking a position on India's action in Siachen. What I am saying is that actions have consequences, and Siachen perpetuated a cycle of distrust that began before partition. I stated this as a counter point to your Bhagal Me Churee point regarding 1999. Can you atleast agree that PK would see your Siachen adventure within the same lens that you saw 1999 in? Can your MOD or DGMO show a single picture of Indian soldiers at the KK Pass prior to 1984? Prob not. We can on the other hand.

Also I find it interesting that the "history" you have been sold is that if we had not done so Pakistan was going to occupy this (Siachen). Any officer from those days (on both sides) would tell you that LOC within that sector was not officially demarcated, but that there was a yearly cycle both sides followed, with posts and treks in the warmer months with an established MO.

Then some enterprising officer or group decided to change it. The rest is history.
Mr Akram,
By direct experience, do you mean you were in the Pak govt, intelligence or Army in 1984 ? Even if that is true, I would still request you to provide sources as otherwise its all about your word against mine.

I agree that to many Pakistanis, the 1984 Siachen operation would have felt a provocation. However, as I mentioned, the Indian military says that Pak army was about to occupy it and hence it was logical decision to pre-empt the occupation. This is similar to how India pre-empted the occupation of "Lakshadweep Islands". As you have rightly pointed out that there was no LOC demarcation on Siachen, so whoever occupied it first, it would have belonged to that party. So legally as well, there was no dagabaazi. It was just an act to save oneself.

Would you fault the Indian military when Pak military had shown willingness in the past to use any means to change status quo. Do you dispute the fact that Pak army breached the LOC and initiated 1965 war by entering Kashmir? They thought Kashmiris would support them and rise up in revolt, but that did not happen.

However, it is not as if we are very happy with this situation. We would want a quick resolution so that our soldiers need not freeze on those icy heights.
and you show your upbringing by stealing others land and calling it just. at least i am honest about my upbringing, and it was to piss on India whenever i got the chance.
My last reply to you since I dont want your bad influence affecting my way of talking. India never initiated attack on anyone. India is on India's land. We did not steal other's land. Others have taken our land on some logic (religious), which we do not agree with but have accepted the status quo.
 
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