AH-1Z Viper, 1000 Hellfire II Missiles approved for sale to Pakistan.

[munchkin]

AH-1Z is far far superior to Z-10 and any other choices on the table. It outclasses AH-64D in some key areas at less than half the price. I was just reading narratives of US veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan. Each and everyone liked AH-1W (variant from which Z is derived) over Apache. It is a dream machine for infantry support they say. It carries every capability of AH-64D, flies faster, higher and farther than its competitors except for Ka-52 which is not offered to us. It carries most advanced generation of US sensors whose quality is unmatched.

Z-10 is not suited for high mountain operation. It has very limited ceiling and mountains in Northern FATA can reach upto 18000 ft. Only AH-1Z is capable of operating at such altitudes. Not even AH-64D could do this as noted by US veterans in Afghanistan. They had to bring in cobras to replace apaches

Seems WZ-10 and AH-1Z have similar service ceilings. 6400 meters compared to 6000+ meters. Anyhow, just because of politics, Pakistan has to reject AH-1Z because or else Pakistan has to do what the US wants Pakistan to do which includes getting into costly pointless wars.

 

[Paksanity]

Seems WZ-10 and AH-1Z have similar service ceilings. 6400 meters compared to 6000+ meters. Anyhow, just because of politics, Pakistan has to reject AH-1Z because or else Pakistan has to do what the US wants Pakistan to do.

Chinese lack advance engine technologies and ceiling is direct consequence of engine performance. Z-10 might touch that altitude when barebone but what good is that? Then quality of sensor is critical in finding targets to engage them. I am afraid US is far ahead in this field. For me veterans who have seen these machines in action seem really credible.

 

[munchkin]

Chinese lack advance engine technologies and ceiling is direct consequence of engine performance. Z-10 might touch that altitude when barebone but what good is that? Then quality of sensor is critical in finding targets to engage them. I am afraid US is far ahead in this field. For me veterans who have seen these machines in action seem really credible.

I think WZ-10 is sufficient. In any case, AH-1Z will be rejected on political grounds.

 

[Neptune]

What would F-35's replace?

The RF-4E/F-4E 2020s. But as for now these aircraft are no longer operational in service of TURAF.

 

[princefaisal]

Now Pakistan should upgrade its older fleet of cobras to AH-1Z Viper standard and this should be done in Turkey, if possible.

 

[Shabi1]

Now Pakistan should upgrade its older fleet of cobras to AH-1Z Viper standard and this should be done in Turkey, if possible.

Pakistan's older fleet are AH-1F/S Cobra they cannot be upgraded to AH-1Z Viper only the AH-1W Super Cobra can be upgraded to Z standard.

The older fleet can still function with an overhaul just as Iran has done and will probably be in limited use or in reserve. The problem with the older Cobras is their running and maintenance costs are too high. Secondly with extensive use I have read that PA Cobras often return with bullet holes and have been extensively patched up, the rotors are constantly replaced because of holes. You can overhaul them but with so much patch up work done on the airframes there is a limit to the number of viable overhauls.

Pakistan has 38 Cobras and from what I've heard SOP is 15 are on the front whereas as 15 on reserve while 8 are in repairs/maintenance.

With expanding use of helicopters a mere 15 AH-1Zs will not meet the requirement despite being less maintenance intensive. Also the request for the AH-1Zs were made when the Z-10 wasnt available so whether Pakistan will accept the offer is a big question mark. The US prefers reimbursing Pakistan's war on terror funds via US equipment sales instead of handing it out. Partial offset via war on terror reimbursements is the only way I see Pakistan going for AH-1Zs. But AH-1Z deal yes or no , I have no doubt the Z-10s will definitely be inducted.

I suspect its going to be a mix of AH-1Z, Z-10 and Mi-35M along with greater use of armed drones. We need better drones with more payload to lessen the dependence on Gunships just as the US is doing to reduce A-10 and Gunship use.

 

[princefaisal]

How much minimum no. of attack helicopters are required to defend the eastern border?

 

[azam usama]

Its a great addition to pakistan army....

 

[black-hawk_101]

Then will PAA going to sell their AH-1s with US permission to Korea or Japan as they are both upgrading it and will need it for spares.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

1 Billion dollars for mere 15 these cobra helicopters ?

Considering our JF17 Thunder design and development was at 400 Million

What a great waste of money

 

[Zarvan]

1 Billion dollars for mere 15 these cobra helicopters ?

Considering our JF17 Thunder design and development was at 400 Million

What a great waste of money

Well still helicopters are great to have but we should not compromise MI-35 on these

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

I think our leaders don't understand how many Zeros are there in Billion Dollars

We are getting 15 Helicopters ? Mere 15

Its 1,000,000,000 = 9 zeros

What we could have done?

• Fenec , we could have gotten 200 Fennec for 500 Million dollars , and kept 500 Million for Navy to get 4 more frigates
• Perhaps developed a mini Missile for these helicopters from local efforts

We could have invested into

• Mi-28 cost of 16 Million for 30 Helicopters for 500 Million , and gave 500 Million dollars to Navy, get 4 new F22P frigates

Mil-Mi 35
Unit cost 12 Million

• 41 Helicopters for 500 Million , and gave 500 Million dollars to Navy get 4 new F22P frigates

Or Get 30 Z-10 Helicopters from China, brand new , unlimited upgrades and engines

 

[Zarvan]

I think our leaders don't understand how many Zeros are there in Billion Dollars

We are getting 15 Helicopters ? Mere 15

Its 1,000,000,000 = 9 zeros

What we could have done?

• Fenec , we could have gotten 200 Fennec for 500 Million dollars , and kept 500 Million for Navy to get 4 more frigates
• Perhaps developed a mini Missile for these helicopters from local efforts

We could have invested into

• Mi-28 cost of 16 Million for 30 Helicopters for 500 Million , and gave 500 Million dollars to Navy, get 4 new F22P frigates

Mil-Mi 35
Unit cost 12 Million

• 41 Helicopters for 500 Million , and gave 500 Million dollars to Navy get 4 new F22P frigates

Or Get 30 Z-10 Helicopters from China, brand new , unlimited upgrades and engines

We already have Barq

 

[Irfan Baloch]

1 Billion dollars for mere 15 these cobra helicopters ?

Considering our JF17 Thunder design and development was at 400 Million

What a great waste of money

there is a possibility of misquoting the figures but also consider this that the sub systems, armament, spares that come with these helicopters can bring the price many fold to its standard price. check out the requirements and the individual systems like sensors, targeting pods, mission computers, avionics, armor, the weapon systems the guidance it detection range etc same two machines with different packages can bump the price.

 

[HRK]

Well still helicopters are great to have but we should not compromise MI-35 on these

we are not compromising Mi-35 read statement of Rana Tanveer Minister of Defence Production in today's newspaper.

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