Again today I met an Afghani who hated Pakistan ..

[Raja.Pakistani]

Well Pakistani Agencies have meddled in Afghanistan for decades ...all in the name of strategic depth against India...so expect some retribution from that side.. so don't blame Afghans if they blame Pakistan for the kind of mess their country is in right now.

so what your agencies are doing ?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Bhai, I'm all for that as well. We have a sizable population from Nowshera and Peshawar here. It would be nice to see more from other parts of Pakistan coming here as well. All Muslims are welcome here.

You know I am secularist and I will not agree with you on many things but you have my respect for the simple reason that you are indeed a man of your convictions and principles however so I might think they are wrong. You don't just preach you also do the walk. I salute you for that.

The worse people are those who like snakes hiss one thing and then bite another. Those type of people are the lowest form of existance.

Salaam .....

 

[AnnoyingOrange]

so what your agencies are doing ?

Well, you need to speak to Afghans for that....Have you met ordinary afghans who abuse India for meddling into their country affairs. While Afghans in Paksitan are busy abusing your agencies.... this is what Afghans living in India are busy doing: Afghan youth living in India spreads message of freedom, love through music | Latest News & Updates at Daily News & Analysis

 

[syedali73]

I have utterly no respect for people like SyedAli73.

Oh my God, what I do now? Is there any chance of salvation? Can I still go to heaven? Oh my God, I am doomed.

 

[Zibago]

My point was that guy seem to think Mirpur is Azad Kashmir, when its just small part of it. There are many poor people in AJK, he don't need Afghani muhajirs to fill the gap.

Yeah like the 18000 refugees from occupied Kashmir they sure could benifit from our philanthropic nature

 

[Shamain]

Yeah like the 18000 refugees from occupied Kashmir they sure could benifit from our philanthropic nature

YES ofcourse. And unlogon ki mentally halat bhi kharab hoti hai due to indian atrocities.
Ufff have u read azad kashmiris posts. *Shaking my head

 

[HRK]

The very reason they are being refugees in pak is bcz you destroyed there motherland.. you can't destroy there houses and expect them to be loyal to you jst bcz you allow them to use your rest rooms for time being...

don't talk rubbish read before posting nonsense ..... we destroyed Afghanistan ..... ??? it was not us who asked to the mighty USSR to occupy Afghanistan those were their own people who called USSR to gain power in Afghanistan & in the region .... & India the ally of USSR was supporting the idea ....

I didnt know that

this is Karachi ....

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

Well Pakistani Agencies have meddled in Afghanistan for decades ...all in the name of strategic depth against India...so expect some retribution from that side.. so don't blame Afghans if they blame Pakistan for the kind of mess their country is in right now.

you were not meddled in internal affairs of Pakistan in 1971 ..my question was what your agencies are doing in pakistan or in others countries? Are they not working for political interests of India? or they exist for doing nothing but just to spread love across the border
you guys should stop poking nose in those topics which have nothing to do with India

 

[Valkyrie]

I appreciate from where your coming from but patience. We are larger. We will win in the long run. Don't forget we have tortured history but after all the sacrifice now is not the time to do rash things. Relax we have India to think about. In the long run we will come out on top as long as we are patient and show magnanmity. Sometimes the people you are closest is the source of most bitterness.

I liken the Afghan-Pak relationship to the British-Irish relationship. It saw centuries of British medling in Ireland. Millions of Irish migrants in UK. Decades of IRish bombing inside UK but now by and large the British and the Irish are as tight as two peas in a pod. Do please read the British-Irish troubled history and you will see my point.

The British in the last 80 years showed remarkable maturity toward the Irish and today look sat them. Not long ago in Britain they had signs like "No Irish or dogs allowed". The Irish hated the English yet millions of them lived in UK. With these things you have to have breadth of vision. This is PDF and I expect people here to have longer horizins then the last tangle with some idiot.

Despite the fact that within England 10% of the population was made up of Irish migrants who mostly lived in poor inner city areas UK never sealed their border with Republic of Ireland. Throughout the worst of terrorism the Hollyhead-Dublin ferry continued to bring 1,000s of more Irish. I often travelled back and forth. The shocking thing was there was hardly any checks. All Irish in law could move to UK and enjoy British hospitality.

While all this was offered to the Irish they kept bombing London, Birmingham etc. I give you example of how much hatred there was between Irish and British. In 1988 two British Army corporals were murdered in broad daylight by Irish crowds in full view of a British Army helicopter.

Corporals killings - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In 1979 18 British soldiers were murdered in a ambush by IRA. Despite all these provocations millions of Irish kept moving from Republic of Ireland ( please note Republic which was a separate country like Afghanistan and not Norhern Ireland which is like K-Pk in Pakistan and part of UK ) by catching a ferry from Dublin to Hollyhead in UK without any papers and could claim benefits as much as any English. Today they are the best of chums thanks to the patience that UK showed.

BTW There were claims that Gaddafi of Libya was supporting IRA with money etc.

Warrenpoint ambush - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Below is the photograph of Hyde Park bombing in London when the Queens Horse Gaurds were attacked. You can see the dead horses.

Despite all this the British stayed cool and even like I said kept their border fully open even while they shut to all other commonwealth countries like Pakistan, India, and the rest. This is beforte European Community. The British knew in the long term the Irish would get tied into UK and today is exactly the case.

Strategy means thinking long term. Great nations do that. Idiots only think about what happened yesterday at the village level. That is why in the last 2,000 years we in Pakistan have been kicked about by ever invader. It is time we thought long term and look beyond immediate rivalry or petty politics.

But then the British wisdom built empires that ruled 3/4 of earth .......

Excellent analysis!
The key here, as you so eloquently pointed out, is patience and moving forward with an aim to make them dependable on us. With time, hate and grievances fade. I'm sure if we tackle this issue smartly today, there's wont be any bad blood between the two nations within a generation's time span. We just have to be very prudent and think ahead.

 

[AnnoyingOrange]

you were not meddled in internal affairs of Pakistan in 1971 ..my question was what your agencies are doing in pakistan or in others countries? Are they not working for political interests of India? or they exist for doing nothing but just to spread love across the border
you guys should stop poking nose in those topics which have nothing to do with India

Well.. as per Pakistani history India is the enemy ....so you fight with enemy.. you should not be expecting Moti Choor Ke ladoos from India... but you claim Afghans are your brothers... and now tell me is this how you mess up our brother's house...just because you thought US will give us money and weapons that we can use against India you screwed their country... and now you blame Afghans for hating you.

 

[syedali73]

Excellent analysis!
The key here, as you so eloquently pointed out, is patience and moving forward with an aim to make them dependable on us. With time, hate and grievances fade. I'm sure if we tackle this issue smartly today, there's wont be any bad blood between the two nations within a generation's time span. We just have to be very prudent and think ahead.

Two nations? Pakistan bachey ga tab kuch ho ga naa. Iss tarah chalta raha tou Pakistan ko Afghnistan banney mein der kitni lagey gi. Aadha Afghanistan to ban hi gaya hey. From the time when Pakistan came into being, at-least 4 generations have grown and the bad blood is still there. How many more generations you are talking about?

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

Well.. as per Pakistani history India is the enemy ....so you fight with enemy.. you should not be expecting Moti Choor Ke ladoos from India... but you claim Afghans are your brothers... and now tell me is this how you mess up our brother's house...just because you thought US will give us money and weapons that we can use against India you screwed their country... and now you blame Afghans for hating you.

My point was that all agencies work for political interests of their countries and that is the whole purpose of their existence Its just habit of afghans to blame Pakistan for all the mess in Afghanistan but truth is Afghans always fought against each others and lack tolerance and acceptance. Just see how these hazara, uzbek, tajik, pashtuns afghan view each others.. They should also do some introspection. They can hate us as long as they stay in their own country and dont stay illegal in Pakistan

 

[Valkyrie]

Two nations? Pakistan bachey ga tab kuch ho ga naa. Iss tarah chalta raha tou Pakistan ko Afghnistan banney mein der kitni lagey gi. Aadha Afghanistan to ban hi gaya hey. From the time when Pakistan came into being, at-least 4 generations have grown and the bad blood is still there. How many more generations you are talking about?

I agree with you on the part where you say Afghans have turned Pakistan into Afghanistan in term of law and order. That's is true. My humble opinion, however, in this regard is that it is we who deserves the most blame. We have allowed them to roam freely, do as they like, indulge themselves in anti-state activities. What i advocate is to let these afghans assimilate in our society, teach them technical skills, improve their general state and make them a responsible part of society. That way, they'll have something to lose if they misbehave and if we're able to successfully achieve that, if we can win them over, we'll have a huge asset, a leverage when dealing with govt of Afghanistan.

And off course this is an ideal scenario, one in which may variables can go south. You could argue that given the scarcity of resources, lack of employment that we have for our own people it's not feasible to implement such a strategy and you could very well be right. but if we can somehow achieve this hypothetical scenario, we'd have gained a lot more than simply forcing them out.

 

[syedali73]

I agree with you on the part where you say Afghans have turned Pakistan into Afghanistan in term of law and order. That's is true. My humble opinion, however, in this regard is that it is we who deserves the most blame. We have allowed them to roam freely, do as they like, indulge themselves in anti-state activities. What i advocate is to let these afghans assimilate in our society, teach them technical skills, improve their general state and make them a responsible part of society. That way, they'll have something to lose if they misbehave and if we're able to successfully achieve that, if we can win them over, we'll have a huge asset, a leverage when dealing with govt of Afghanistan.

And off course this is an ideal scenario, one in which may variables can go south. You could argue that given the scarcity of resources, lack of employment that we have for our own people it's not feasible to implement such a strategy and you could very well be right. but if we can somehow achieve this hypothetical scenario, we'd have gained a lot more than simply forcing them out.

Bhai, please try to understand that we are neither US nor UK. You are talking about the model adopted for legal/illegal immigrants by the US/UK. It worked for them, albeit partially, for their economy could absorb the insult but this is not the case with Pakistan. Our resources and means are limited, actually very limited. We have over 70% Pakistanis living under the line of poverty, we are dumping great deal of resources in war on terror, we are simply no longer capable of supporting the Afghan refugees. We have hosted them for 35+ years, it is time for them to go back and build their own country. So long they remain in Pakistan, their government will remain relaxed and would do nothing to mend their difference and work for the development of their country. Assimilating Afghans in our society is a non no, for they have their own country which needs them and they must go back. Because we made a mistake by allowing them into Pakistan and roam freely does not mean we continue on with our mistake. Mistakes are always fixed, not repeated or continued on.

 

[Valkyrie]

Honestly speaking, I met this Afghan boy in Lahore during my visit. I guess he was about sixteen. I asked him where are you from? Aap kahan say ho? He replied, Kabul say. I asked him how long you have been living in Lahore. He said from past three years and now this is home. I swear, he brought the tears into my my eyes. I bought some rumaals from him and hugged him and said Allah aap ko khush rakhay. The smile on his face was priceless.

This is what i'm talking about. There's a potential for rapprochement between us, particularly with regard to the younger generation. A huge percentage of Afghan refugees in Pakistan have never actually seen Afghanistan, they were born and raised in refugee camps here. They're young and their minds malleable. We can and we should work on their minds. Let's start by educating them, teaching them skills to survive, take them in the fold. I'm sure if we can do that, there's no reason we'd not be seeing a generation of Pakistan loving Afghans in a few years.