Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Kashmir: A Grand Bargain?

[KPAP]

90% of Afghan people are poor. Now you are saying Afghans are rich. Yes, Afghan Mujahideen are rich in heart and bravery, I will give that to them, they had never been defeated by the superpower...but we all know how Afghans live and how most of Afghanistan looks like, you dont have to tell us about the 1% like you working for foreign troops and foreign intelligence agencies.

If your people have made it to Karachi, then I bet they can make a little more effort and cross into india

This is the mindset of you people ... Or phir puri duniya ko gali dete ho

 

[Rafi]

They even didn't bothered me to say that, they all returned and thanks for every Pakistani's hospitality towards them.

Don't let the door hit you - on the way out, and don't ever return. EVER Your kind are not welcome anymore.

 

[Sher Malang]

lol, idiot. It's your views that are incredibly illogical and makes you look crazy.

We Pakistani talk to Afghanistani refugees in Peshawar, Rawalpindi, and Abbottabad, and then somehow we start hearing crap about Pakistan, anti-Pakistani sentiment, pro-India, Afghanistanis studying in India, on the internet?

Why is internet life so different from talking face to face with an Afghanistani refugee in Rawalpindi?

Nevertheless you are suffering from acute stress disorder, stick to this topic and give birth to the chicks of the eggs you are sitting on!

 

[StandForInsaf]

lol, I have had enough with these "internet warriors."

StandForInsaf and Rafi, I'm calling it day.

Despite the internet warrior's media war, they can never beat the argument of why Afghanistanis go for Pakistani citizenship, and then they stay in Pakistan and call it home.

Real afghonistanis love Pakistan , hes a fake or sold one , who cares of him ..

 

[Ahmad]

Hahaha, what crap? It is the Afghanistani Puktoons who are most Pro-Pakistan.

Its Farsiwans or Panjshiris like Amrullah Saleh who are Anti-Pakistani.

I can see pashtuns are pro pakistan becaue: Pashtun governmemnts didnt recognize your independece, pashtun governemtns including the taliban never recognized the durand line and still claim that KPK is afghan soil.

Saleh was anti Pakistani because Pakistan chose to be Anti Saleh and Anti persians.

 

[StandForInsaf]

I can see pashtuns are pro pakistan becaue: Pashtun governmemnts didnt recognize your independece, pashtun governemtns including the taliban never recognized the durand line and still claim that KPK is afghan soil.

Saleh was anti Pakistani because Pakistan chose to be Anti Saleh and Anti persians.

What afghanistan has to do with Pashtons ? they dont even recognize Pashtons as Pashtons they say them afghan , Pashtons are recognized by pakistan and they are patriots , this thing you afghanis will never now ....

 

[Omar1984]

I can see pashtuns are pro pakistan becaue: Pashtun governmemnts didnt recognize your independece, pashtun governemtns including the taliban never recognized the durand line and still claim that KPK is afghan soil.

Saleh was anti Pakistani because Pakistan chose to be Anti Saleh and Anti persians.

Yes we dont accept the Durrand Line either.

InshAllah our next Pashtun leader Imran Khan will form a Pakistan-Afghanistan confederation and everyone will be happy

 

[Porus]

Guys, stop this silly discussion now....grow up and leave poor Afghan refugees alone.

 

[Ahmad]

What afghanistan has to do with Pashtons ? they dont even recognize Pashtons as Pashtons they say them afghan , Pashtons are recognized by pakistan and they are patriots , this thing you afghanis will never now ....

Brother, dont bring the Paksitani Pashtuns in the middle, they are pakistani nationals and let them be there. We here are talking about the Pashtuns of Afghanistan, they dont recognize durand line and say that KPk is afghan soil. About the bolded part, I know this, but go and talk to Pashutns in Afghanistan, they have a different idea. You think Pashtuns of Afghanistan are pro pakistan, but you are wrong.

 

[Meengla]

Thread derailed big time! Surprise surprise!
It would have been nice if we had started with a clear and final understanding that neither India nor Pakistan can grab Kashmir fully without destroying the region and without killing untold civilians on both sides. The rest of the argument would flow from that understanding. But, to quote Dawn.com's Javed Naqvi: "Indians and Pakistanis are not smart enough to make peace with each other".

But since we got distracted I'd like to say something to these Afghanis here:

You guys are one big under-achieving nation. Forget after 1979--even in your years of stability you were extremely backward and tribal. You were basically Pakistan's FATA enlarged nth times. You had killed each other in coups after coups. True, Pakistan did have some military coups but never they were so brutal, led by so selfish leaders like the Afghans did.
You are not even a 'nation'. Even the Somalis are probably better entitled to be called a 'nation' then you guys are. The schisms in your country are varied and of extreme nature: Tribal, ethnic, religious and economic. I can justifiably harp on these but I think enough said about that.

You guys blame 'ISI' for your problems. Where was the ISI before 1979? You killed each other in coups. You had some leaders who wanted to raise the Durand Line issue--a British leftover. While some wanted to settle it. One faction flirted with communism in a FATA-like Islamic society. One faction 'invited' the Soviets. Then there was a civil war. You guys colluded with Pakistan's enemies in the 80's. There were many acts of terrorism inside Pakistan where thousands died. Yes, Pakistan and a chunk of the rest of the world opposed you but what choice did you leave for Pakistan? Is it any coincidence that, while the majority of the world boycotted the Moscow Olympics of 1980 India--Pakistan's arch enemy attended that? But Pakistanis warmly accepted you to Pakistan's cities. Unlike Iranians--who confined refugees to camps--Pakistanis genuinely extended brotherhood to you. As a result you guys--tribal and primitive--brought you damn gun and drug culture to the cities of Pakistan.
And today, too, you are treacherous. I don't know about the majority of the Afghans but looks like the ethnic groups who are the beneficiaries of the NATO involvement are the anti-Pakistan ones. All Pakistan wants is to have an Afghanistan which does not make Pakistan to be encircled. Part of your society was allied with Pakistan's enemies in the 80s. And part are allied now. For power and money.
There are always beggars in all nations. But none seem to excel in that category than the Afghans do. You will remain tribal, divided and primitive if you don't unite and don't become cannon fodders for foreign powers.
And you guys hurt Pakistanis feelings who genuinely extended their love to you in the Islamic spirit of 'Ansar-Mohajiroon'. Millionsof ordinary Pakistanis genuinely hosted Afghans--regardless of their ethnic background--in the 80's. And this how you pay them back?

 

[Always Neutral]

If Kashmir issue is solved then that will be good for Afghanistan as we MIGHT see a significant reduction in Pakistan/India rivalry in Afghanistan.

I doubt Ahmed, I sincerely doubt. TTP, LET and co (Zaid Hamid) will start fooling the poor and beguiled how Gazwa Hind has started and there will be more trouble. Peace will come when Pakistan can control all its non state actors including TTP / BLA with an iron hand and the people accept that Pakistan comes before any religion.

Regards

 

[Rafi]

I doubt Ahmed, I sincerely doubt. TTP, LET and co (Zaid Hamid) will start fooling the poor and beguiled how Gazwa Hind has started and there will be more trouble. Peace will come when Pakistan can control all its non state actors including TTP / BLA with an iron hand and the people accept that Pakistan comes before any religion.

Regards

Thanks for the enlightenment mr india.

 

[Always Neutral]

Pakistan doesn't need to have an image war with anyone, we don't need western media moguls like murdoch to come and buy our tv stations and influence the beautiful image of Pakistan.

---------- Post added at 11:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 AM ----------



When did India get any morals? Illegally occupying Kashmir without the will of the Kashmiris and against the UN resolutions is morally incorrect ! ! ! Give Kashmir to the people of Kashmir, let them have a referendum to determine what they want

---------- Post added at 11:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:50 AM ----------



No body can train the people of Afghanistan, these people are natural fighters and can never be defeated. The moguls tried, the soviets tried and now NATO is trying, none have succeeded. You think India will succeed ??

All the more reason for Pakistan not to make the same folly. The day your PM can visit NW alongwith your foreign Minister, come back and remind me?

---------- Post added at 08:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:55 PM ----------

I have talked to Afghanistani family in my place. They do not claim KPK as a part of Afghanistan. I don't know who are you.
You sound like a propagandist. Don't know why you tolerated here,

Seriously defense.pk is too tolerant to idiots.

When I talked to the Afghanistani, they said yes Afghanistan and Pakistan should be one country, because they are both Muslim countries and we have the same culture.

They told me many Afghanistanis come to Pakistan, for work, education, and they even get Pakistani citizenship.

You are just trying to confuse people!

Obviously you donot remember the voting that took place there in the 1940's. The difference was less than 1% and that to when the Frontier Gandhi and his followers boycotted it. Obviously your Afghani family is fictitious.

 

[Kambojaric]

I doubt Ahmed, I sincerely doubt. TTP, LET and co (Zaid Hamid) will start fooling the poor and beguiled how Gazwa Hind has started and there will be more trouble. Peace will come when Pakistan can control all its non state actors including TTP / BLA with an iron hand and the people accept that Pakistan comes before any religion.

Regards

Actually it was Afghanistan that had an issue with Pakistan due to the Durand line.

"Afghan Pakistan relations were to reach their nadir in 1955 when diplomatic relations were severed following the ransacking of the Pakistan embassy in Kabul, and again in 1961 when the Pakistan army had to repel major Afghan incursions into Bajaur".

Pakistan: a modern history, By Ian Talbot

Pakistan never really had any major problems with its western neighbors. Its sole focus was on Kashmir. Of course today the situation has become a lot different.

 

[Always Neutral]

Thanks for the enlightenment mr india.

sure we arrested 4 guys here yesterday on terrorism charges and no guesses where they went for training?