Afghanistan losing interest in trade links with Pakistan

[BattleWolf]

indians also said that Pakistan's would cripple itself out of existenceif it ever tried to become a nuclear weapons state. indians also said that Pakistan would not exist after December 1947.

?I don't know what you are talking about , anyway Afghanistan allies won't sit idle ,I think the existence of Bangladesh speaks for itself.

Pakistan doesn't need to annex Afghanistan. They'll pretty much greatfully hand it over to us. That's why there are millions of them in Pakistan with millions more wanting to come in every year.

That's retarded , its like saying Nepal , Bhutan , Bangladesh will hand over their territory to India because millions migrate to India.

 

[Nilgiri]

Out of the $46 billion, $11 billion has been loaned by China to Pakistan for the proposed infrastructure projects along the CPEC

Hi, what route will the remaining 35 billion come in through? Is it theoretically supposed to be opex FDI or something (loan creates the greenfield base investment)?....or just more future loans?

 

[shah1398]

What were they doing for the past 2000 years? We can wait a little more!

Sure sure...Good luck with that.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

It's actually 1.6% interest as per wikki but payback schedule is 20 years. Now how much has Pakistan borrowed from China? Out of the $46 billion, $11 billion has been loaned by China to Pakistan for the proposed infrastructure projects along the CPEC that will be dispersed to Pakistan by the Exim Bank of China, China Development Bank, and the Industrial and Commercial Bank of China.

Now that means approx $600 million per year or > Rs 6000 crores PKR per year. That's a lot of dosh to pay back to China every year!

And think about the 11 coal fired plants they're transferring to Pakistan as part of the CPEC. The irony is that the Chinese are discarding these polluting power plants for renewable energy like nuclear and solar power plants but shoving the antiquated polluting coal fired plants down the throats of the Pakistanis!

And China not only wants better than market returns for the money being invested in the proposed China Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC), but also wants Islamabad to select only Chinese firms for all CPEC-related contracts.

For instance, business rivals of China are being quoted, as saying that Beijing is putting pressure on Pakistan to make sure that work related to the Gwadar Port Development Project is given only to a Chinese company selected by Beijing. They've managed now to take it over on a 40 year lease. Do Pakistanis need permits to enter the port as it is controlled by the Chinese? I haven't the faintest clue but it would be ironical that Pakistanis would need permission to enter their own port!!

Officials in Pakistan have reportedly railed against such interference, but the missive from China appears to be clear, no Chinese company means no project, and therefore, no money. So what happens to jobs for Pakistanis with some commentators saying that thousands of unemployed Pakistanis would be given jobs? 10,000 Pak troops have already been deployed for the protection of this Chinese workforce!

I wonder whatever happened to their higher than the mountains and deeper than the oceans friendship? Where it comes to business, no one can beat the Chinese at their game. In a nutshell, the Pakistanis are being taken for a jolly good ride!

Same old same old. indians like you were saying EXACTLY the same thing about Pakistan becoming a nuclear weapons state. That it was impossible for the Pakistan economy to allow it to do so. That it would bankrupt Pakistan. That the Chinese were fooling the Pakistanis and were not really being sincere or helping us. Will guess what? WE DID become a nuclear weapons state and not only that we now have an advancing and expanding nuclear weapons and missiles program. This in part is thanks to China.

If CPEC is to be a success then CHINESE companies should be the ones doing the work and having the contracts. Because they are the only people who could build world class infrastructure projects throughout Pakistan. They have the world class skills, expertise and experience. The others don't. Most Pakistanis will agree with this. There is a pertinent reason why China along with america are the ONLY 2 superpowers in the world. NO OTHER nation on earth can be compared to these 2.

Most of the people here who are being critical of CPEC belong to a nation that is light years behind and is inferior to China. They are not in a position to question CPEC.

Seems that a lot of people on PDF who belong to countries that are enemies of Pakistan are actually quite concerned and perturbed by CPEC and the success it will eventually bring to Pakistan.

 

[PurpleButcher]

Please leave us alone my dear back stabbing afghans... good luck with india

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

?I don't know what you are talking about , anyway Afghanistan allies won't sit idle ,I think the existence of Bangladesh speaks for itself.

That's retarded , its like saying Nepal , Bhutan , Bangladesh will hand over their territory to India because millions migrate to India.

ghandi, nehru , lord mounbatten and possibly winston churchill all at some point quoted that they didn't expect Pakistan to last much long after December 1947 as it has "come into existence" in the worst condition any new nation has ever done so and has "far too many weaknesses".

indirha ghandi stated in the 70s/80s that it was impossible for Pakistan to ever have nuclear weapons. This was echoed by many leading indian scientists, military experts and politicians. They said it was impossible even with or without Chinese help or assistance. Even the Federation of American Scientists doubted Pakistan's nuke capability. When india carried out nuke tests in 1998, these same indians were saying that india "should now teach Pakistan a lesson" as india could nuke Pakistan out of existence. They said india was too powerful and Pakistan did not have any nuclear weapons to protect themselves with. india got their biggest shock ever a few weeks later when Pakistan conducted it's 1st ever nuclear weapons test. This changed the fate and destiny for Pakistan forever.

Whether it happened in 1971, 1981, 1991 or 2001. The creation of bangladesh was an enevitability that no one in the world could ever stop. india simply exploited this in 1971 when Pakistan was a super weak nation. The bengladeshis could never be part of the REAL Pakistan as they are 1000s of kms away from the Pakistan mainland. Heck the bengladeshis don't even look like Pakistanis. There is nothing to bind or connect the 2. Pakistanis are from a different race, genetic origin, culture and heritage to bangladeshis. They are very alien to us. You can't form 1 nation with 2 sets of a very different peoples who find it difficult to relate to eachother.

In your last paragraph I hope you are not suggesting that india will attack Pakistan if we try to annex Afghanistan. india couldn't attack Pakistan after 2001/02 parliament attack or mumbai 26/11/2008 so I doubt india could attack Pakistan on behalf of the Afghans.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Hi,

Could you please post the source of that figure ?

Watch from 29:00:

For specific comments on the interest rates see from 35:00



@Nilgiri @knight11 @Syed.Ali.Haider @wiseone2

 

[knight11]

Watch from 29:00:

For specific comments on the interest rates see from 35:00



@Nilgiri @knight11 @Syed.Ali.Haider @wiseone2

Watch this 25.57 onwards.

CPEC Updated ground realities of Chinese Money flying.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

http://povertydata.worldbank.org/poverty/country/PAK

Pakistan $ 1.90 8.3 % of Population (2012)

http://povertydata.worldbank.org/poverty/country/IND

India 21 % of Population. (2012)

There goes your false statistics

The facts and figures about poverty in Pakistan are very questionable about at best. Some say that india has 33% of the WORLD'S severely malnourished and poor:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-third-of-worlds-poorest-says-World-Bank.html

http://qz.com/562578/indias-middle-class-is-actually-the-worlds-poor/

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/15/opinion/half-these-kids-are-stunted.html?_r=0

http://blogs.ei.columbia.edu/2011/0...rly-half-of-its-children-malnourished-part-1/


Having come back from Pakistan last year I can confirm that the infrastructure in Pakistan is way better now than it was in the 80s/90s. And that the people are far more healthy, well feed and prosperous than they were back then. This despite the WOT being imposed on us by the americans.

 

[Khan_21]

The facts and figures about poverty in Pakistan are very questionable about at best. Some say that india has 33% of the WORLD'S severely malnourished and poor:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-third-of-worlds-poorest-says-World-Bank.html

http://qz.com/562578/indias-middle-class-is-actually-the-worlds-poor/

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/15/opinion/half-these-kids-are-stunted.html?_r=0

http://blogs.ei.columbia.edu/2011/0...rly-half-of-its-children-malnourished-part-1/


Having come back from Pakistan last year I can confirm that the infrastructure in Pakistan is way better now than it was in the 80s/90s. And that the people are far more healthy, well feed and prosperous than they were back then. This despite the WOT being imposed on us by the americans.

My friend went to India last year with a couple of his friends . Delhi , Mumbai and Amritsar. He said that many of the areas wouldn't look out of place in Somalia or Chad and that the cities were extremely Dirty with litter everywhere .

Mumbai voted dirtiest city in the world
http://www.indiatimes.com/travel/mumbai-voted-worlds-dirtiest-city-50300.html

Mumbai was voted as the ‘World’s Dirtiest City’ by TripAdvisor’s Cities Survey, which included 75,000 people voting from across the globe

Delhi as the most polluted city in the world

http://indianexpress.com/article/ci...world-delhi-suffers-from-a-toxic-blend-study/

Dirtiest , Most polluted , i wouldn't want to live anywhere their cities .

Did you by any chance visit defence , bahria towns in cities? . They wouldnt look out of place in any western housing societies .

 

[salarsikander]

i do not think any of the CPEC agreements have been made public

Hi,
Then making such claim is absurd. One should first thoroughly read the information

 

[SrNair]

Same old same old. indians like you were saying EXACTLY the same thing about Pakistan becoming a nuclear weapons state. That it was impossible for the Pakistan economy to allow it to do so. That it would bankrupt Pakistan. That the Chinese were fooling the Pakistanis and were not really being sincere or helping us. Will guess what? WE DID become a nuclear weapons state and not only that we now have an advancing and expanding nuclear weapons and missiles program. This in part is thanks to China.

If CPEC is to be a success then CHINESE companies should be the ones doing the work and having the contracts. Because they are the only people who could build world class infrastructure projects throughout Pakistan. They have the world class skills, expertise and experience. The others don't. Most Pakistanis will agree with this. There is a pertinent reason why China along with america are the ONLY 2 superpowers in the world. NO OTHER nation on earth can be compared to these 2.

Most of the people here who are being critical of CPEC belong to a nation that is light years behind and is inferior to China. They are not in a position to question CPEC.

Seems that a lot of people on PDF who belong to countries that are enemies of Pakistan are actually quite concerned and perturbed by CPEC and the success it will eventually bring to Pakistan.

Absolutely wrong .
China's clout is still revolving around in their economy .
USA is far more powerful than PRC and will remain like that for at least next two decades .

It was your ego and inferiority complex that destroyed your nation like now .Think about it for a moment .If Pak leaders were smart enough to allow India in trades like India -China doing for decades ,situation would have been very different .Pakistan might been able to influence GoI through their economy .But now what ?
India already find a way through Iran and Afghanistan and you are totally depending a nation that only cares about their own interests (infact most of the nations ).Chinese are smart businessmen .CPEC is a business and in business there is no friend but only profit .Tommorrow if they find that CPEC is unfeasible they will through it like a hot potato .

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

My friend went to India last year with a couple of his friends . Delhi , Mumbai and Amritsar. He said that many of the areas wouldn't look out of place in Somalia or Chad and that the cities were extremely Dirty with litter everywhere .

Mumbai voted dirtiest city in the world
http://www.indiatimes.com/travel/mumbai-voted-worlds-dirtiest-city-50300.html

Mumbai was voted as the ‘World’s Dirtiest City’ by TripAdvisor’s Cities Survey, which included 75,000 people voting from across the globe

Delhi as the most polluted city in the world

http://indianexpress.com/article/ci...world-delhi-suffers-from-a-toxic-blend-study/

Dirtiest , Most polluted , i wouldn't want to live anywhere their cities .

Did you by any chance visit defence , bahria towns in cities? . They wouldnt look out of place in any western housing societies .

Indians need to worry about this than whether CPEC is a success or failure or what Pakistan does or doesn't do. The following should be more important to Indians than CPEC:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-third-of-worlds-poorest-says-World-Bank.html

Absolutely wrong .
China's clout is still revolving around in their economy .
USA is far more powerful than PRC and will remain like that for at least next two decades .

It was your ego and inferiority complex that destroyed your nation like now .Think about it for a moment .If Pak leaders were smart enough to allow India in trades like India -China doing for decades ,situation would have been very different .Pakistan might been able to influence GoI through their economy .But now what ?
India already find a way through Iran and Afghanistan and you are totally depending a nation that only cares about their own interests (infact most of the nations ).Chinese are smart businessmen .CPEC is a business and in business there is no friend but only profit .Tommorrow if they find that CPEC is unfeasible they will through it like a hot potato .

And China will remain way ahead of india for many decades possibly centuries to come. 20 years to become the world's most powerful nation is a relatively short time. Don't know where you got the notion that Pakistan is a destroyed nation. I came back from Pakistan last year and the country is far more developed with much better infrastructure than in the 80s and 90s. Pakistan is definitely moving in the right direction. For obvious reason, trade and full relations between Pakistan and india can never ever happen. Nor do most Indians and Pakistanis want it to.

 

[SrNair]

Indians need to worry about this than whether CPEC is a success or failure or what Pakistan does or doesn't do. The following should be more important to Indians than CPEC:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-third-of-worlds-poorest-says-World-Bank.html



And China will remain way ahead of india for many decades possibly centuries to come. 20 years to become the world's most powerful nation is a relatively short time. Don't know where you got the notion that Pakistan is a destroyed nation. I came back from Pakistan last year and the country is far more developed with much better infrastructure than in the 80s and 90s. Pakistan is definitely moving in the right direction. For obvious reason, trade and full relations between Pakistan and india can never ever happen. Nor do most Indians and Pakistanis want it to.

Doubt about that .Because gap between India and China are not that big and China still needs two decades to plug their tech gap with West .And India is already world top emerging economy .
Destroyed physically but mentally .Japan is a developed nation but US can decide their policies if they want .
Chinese inrush will destroy your local industries .Not in right direction .If you want a good direction you should have good relation with all other nations .Solely depending one nation means nothing but willfuly surrendering sovreignity .

Wrong .Earlier gen Indians did a lots for a good relation both in trade and people to people contact .Pakistan was economically comparable to India at that time .But now not anymore nor you dont have any influence like Chinese through their trade .And coincidentally but unfortunately new gen Indians dont have that soft heart of earlier gen like
Vajpayee or Singh .

 

[salarsikander]

Watch from 29:00:

For specific comments on the interest rates see from 35:00



@Nilgiri @knight11 @Syed.Ali.Haider @wiseone2

Hi,

So its not from official sources, just another absurd speculation