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Afghan refugees in Pakistan wait for reforms

My 2c on this thread:

1. I think Pakistanis should not concern themselves with "who's is bigger" issues
2. We should care about what is in our belly
3. If Afghans prosper or falter - it is none of our business.

However (and a quite a big however):
1. It is imperative for Pakistanis to understand the Afghans - especially who they are today and what that means for Pakistanis
2. Pakistanis should remember that Afghans have cast the first stones
- They have been hostile to us before the founding of Pakistan (their ancestors to ours).
- They were hostile to us before we interfered in Afghanistan (remember 1947, Daud Khan, etc.)
3. We should remember while the Pakistani people harbor familial feelings for Afghans this is a one way street.
- Pakistanis should ask themselves when was the last time the Afghan flag was burnt on the Pakistani street
- Pakistanis should ask themselves the question what does it mean when Afghans call Pakistanis "daal-khor"
- Pakistanis should ask themselves the question what does it mean when Afghans say Pakistanis are the bastard children of their invading hordes and forefathers.
This is what they teach their children - make no mistake!
I have often asked myself what is the source of this Afghan hostility - clearly it is not Pakistan's meddling in Afghanistan as Afghan hostility predates such meddling
One possible hypothesis I think may be that it is unimaginable for an Afghan that they might have found succor and help from a people they think beneath themselves [the daal-khors, the smelly dark-skinned people, ...]
It is possible that in their collective cultural psyche, the people of present day Pakistan are to be pillaged, looted and serve as serfs to the Afghans.
The amazing part is that many Afghans don't even shy away from this - even educated Afghans in private conversations will admit that such is the nature of what they view Pakistan and Pakistanis as.

I think Pakistanis must draw the conclusion that Afghans are a hostile people - the only reason we have been spared is that Afghanistan and Afghans have been in almost five decades of internal or external tumult.

To borrow Kessinger succinct phrasing: The fundamental question Pakistanis have to answer is how are they going to deal with Afghanistan's rise back to statehood and its reassertion of its hostility toward Pakistan, such as:
1. It signed its first strategic agreement with India - It should be noted that China, Turkey are countries that could easily out do India's contribution, and are not controversial but they chose India.
2. Afghanistan's reassertion of the Durand line issue
3. Afghanistan's blocking of our Rivers
4. Afghanistan's chorus of slamming Pakistan at international fora

The broad responses to the Pakistani people are the following
1. Isolation from Afghanistan - I don't know how possible this is given our porous border - perhaps some out of the box thinking can achieve this.
2. Take on the role of Cattle - which it seems Pakistan is quite suited for and continue being slaughtered.
3. Or interere without crossing the border and keep Afghanistan in tumult so they cannot pose a threat to us
 
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Russia pretty much subjected non-state actors to total destruction by use of MVD,FSB,VDV and Alpha special forces.

They've failed to destroy them, sure they crippled them, but at the cost of civilian casualties. Russian insurgencies still exist.
 
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They've failed to destroy them, sure they crippled them, but at the cost of civilian casualties. Russian insurgencies still exist.

More or less ,destroyed.And very weak compared to 1990's
 
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Again, not destroyed, just weakened. The caucuses still face moderate levels of violence.

compare to 1990's the situation in chechyna and today.The magnitude of difference is 100 to 1.
 
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Again, WRONG! Pakistan's GDP in 2011-2012 was 1,182 per capita according to the UN, comparing the same year for Afghanistan, it was 586 per capita, no comparison.

United Nations Statistics Division - National Accounts

Also, you have a very skewed idea of what a failed state is. Learn the definition and requirements in order to be qualified as a failed state.

Again, if you're going to lie, make the lie believable.



Nation states and none state actors are two different things, learn the difference.

your numbers are measured in GNI, it is a more advanced formula including living standards, although Afghanistan have been in war for 30 years, it would be unfair to do a GNI on those numbers.
The whole world says you are a failed state, with one military coup after the other, bombing and killing of president candidates etc.
 
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Again, WRONG! Pakistan's GDP in 2011-2012 was 1,182 per capita according to the UN, comparing the same year for Afghanistan, it was 586 per capita, no comparison.

United Nations Statistics Division - National Accounts

Also, you have a very skewed idea of what a failed state is. Learn the definition and requirements in order to be qualified as a failed state.

Again, if you're going to lie, make the lie believable.



Nation states and none state actors are two different things, learn the difference.

Pakistan GDP nominal $1578, Afghanistan GDP nominal $1100+.
economically pakistan should have done better, shouldn't it?
 
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Pakistan GDP nominal $1578, Afghanistan GDP nominal $1100+.
economically pakistan should have done better, shouldn't it?

Obviously it could've done much better but why are you being happy? Will it make your country better? Whatever any one says you Afghans need to know that both Pakistan & Afghanistan can prosper if they become friendly & brotherly neighbors & furthermore Afghanistan need to stop supporting enemies of Pakistan from it's soil like india who is helping TTP & BLA terrorists in Pakistan.
 
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compare to 1990's the situation in chechyna and today.The magnitude of difference is 100 to 1.

But the point still remains, you said it was destroyed, that's not the same thing as active but crippled.
 
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Obviously it could've done much better but why are you being happy? Will it make your country better? Whatever any one says you Afghans need to know that both Pakistan & Afghanistan can prosper if they become friendly & brotherly neighbors & furthermore Afghanistan need to stop supporting enemies of Pakistan from it's soil like india who is helping TTP & BLA terrorists in Pakistan.
No it doesn't make me feel better, what i am trying to do is to counter those who says that the reason for why Pakistans economy ain't moving is Afghan.
As a upcoming economist, i know how that one country can not develop if its neighbours ain't developing too.
My wishes is mutual understanding and economic cooperation, so we can move from where we are now. because $1578 and $1100 are both numbers indicating that our countries has serious problems with poverty, and that our people are suffering.
The blame game must end, or otherwise we will not move forward.
 
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But the point still remains, you said it was destroyed, that's not the same thing as active but crippled.

A difference of 100 to 1 is not crippled ,but rather demolished,destroyed. if it was 3 to 1 or 4 to 1 then it could be called crippled. Chechnya rebellion is finished .What the salafis are now trying is to instigate revolt in dagestan ,but lately church has become very active there.
 
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Afghan-India is my PDF name not my real, just like yours is American Pakistani, but why it is that way, is due to that my grandfather from my mothers side was Indian whom lived in Kabul.
Peace is the best solution for both countries and the region.
The people of Afghanistan are not ungrateful, but it is your countrymen and your idea of that Afghanistan is your little brother and you should have a political influence, that have derailed our friendship.
TO ALL MY PAKISTANI BROTHERS DONT QUOTE OR REPLY 2 THIS ILLEGAL AFGHAN IMMIGRANT HE IS A FALSE FLAGGER HINDU DISGUISING AS A MUSLIM ND AS A AFGHAN AFHANISTAN IS NOTHING BUT A NARCO STATE ALL OF AFGHANISTANS TRADE REVOLVES AROUND PAKISTAN IF PAKISTAN STOPS EXPORTING 2 AFGHANISTAN THESE ILLITERATE NARO STATE DWELLERS AFGHANS WILL DIE BC OF HUNGER THTS Y THERE R 3 MILLION AFGHAN REFUGEES ND AFGHAN MUHAJAREENS IN PAKISTAN BC THEY CANT FIND FOOD IN AFGHANISTAN AFGHANISTANS NUMBER 1 EXPORT DRUGS LOL ND THE SO CALLED AFGHAN PRESIDENT OOPS SORRY MAYOR OF KABUL KARZAI EVEN HIS SO CALLED PALACE IS BUILT FROM DRUG MONEY ND FOREIGN AMERICAN SOLDIERS GUARD AFGHAN PRESIDENTS PALACE OOPS AFGHAN MAYORS PALACE KARZAIS MAYOR OF KABULS PALACE IS GUARDED BY FOREIGN AMERICAN SOLDIERS WAT A JOKE WITHOUT PAKISTAN AFGHANISTAN CANNOT EVEN SURVIVE ITS A LANDLOCKED MOUNTAINOUS DESERT WHERE PEOPLE LIVE IN MOUNTAINS ND CAVES LOL EVEN IN THIS AGE IS THIS ENOUGH OF INSULTING AFGHANISTAN OR U WANT ME 2 INSULT ND XPOSE AFGHANISTAN MORE HAAN INDIAN FALSE FLAGGER DISGUISING AS A MUSLIM ND A AFGHAN. PAKISTAN SHOULD KICK THESE 3 MILLION AFGHAN REFUGEES FOREVER FROM PAKISTAN 2 THT NARCO STATE AFGHANISTAN AS SOON AS POSSIBLE BUNCH OF ILLEGAL AFGHAN IMMIGRANTS ND AFGHAN MUHAJAREENS DOING ORGANISED CRIME IN PAKISTAN ND SELLING DRUGS IN PAKISTAN KICK THESE 3 MILLION AFGHAN REFUGEES FOREVER FROM PAKISTAN 2 THT NARCO STATE AFGHANISTAN.
 
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TO ALL MY PAKISTANI BROTHERS DONT QUOTE OR REPLY 2 THIS ILLEGAL AFGHAN IMMIGRANT HE IS A FALSE FLAGGER HINDU DISGUISING AS A MUSLIM ND AS A AFGHAN AFHANISTAN IS NOTHING BUT A NARCO STATE ALL OF AFGHANISTANS TRADE REVOLVES AROUND PAKISTAN IF PAKISTAN STOPS EXPORTING 2 AFGHANISTAN THESE ILLITERATE NARO STATE DWELLERS AFGHANS WILL DIE BC OF HUNGER THTS Y THERE R 3 MILLION AFGHAN REFUGEES ND AFGHAN MUHAJAREENS IN PAKISTAN BC THEY CANT FIND FOOD IN AFGHANISTAN AFGHANISTANS NUMBER 1 EXPORT DRUGS LOL ND THE SO CALLED AFGHAN PRESIDENT OOPS SORRY MAYOR OF KABUL KARZAI EVEN HIS SO CALLED PALACE IS BUILT FROM DRUG MONEY ND FOREIGN AMERICAN SOLDIERS GUARD AFGHAN PRESIDENTS PALACE OOPS AFGHAN MAYORS PALACE KARZAIS MAYOR OF KABULS PALACE IS GUARDED BY FOREIGN AMERICAN SOLDIERS WAT A JOKE WITHOUT PAKISTAN AFGHANISTAN CANNOT EVEN SURVIVE ITS A LANDLOCKED MOUNTAINOUS DESERT WHERE PEOPLE LIVE IN MOUNTAINS ND CAVES LOL EVEN IN THIS AGE IS THIS ENOUGH OF INSULTING AFGHANISTAN OR U WANT ME 2 INSULT ND XPOSE AFGHANISTAN MORE HAAN INDIAN FALSE FLAGGER DISGUISING AS A MUSLIM ND A AFGHAN. PAKISTAN SHOULD KICK THESE 3 MILLION AFGHAN REFUGEES FOREVER FROM PAKISTAN 2 THT NARCO STATE AFGHANISTAN AS SOON AS POSSIBLE BUNCH OF ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS ND MUHAJAREENS DOING ORGANISED CRIME IN PAKISTAN ND SELLING DRUGS IN PAKISTAN KICK THESE 3 MILLION AFGHAN REFUGEES FOREVER FROM PAKISTAN 2 THT NARCO STATE AFGHANISTAN.

Well Sir, it is upto Mods to decide...if you have doubts you can ask Mods to run a check.
 
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Pakistan GDP nominal $1578, Afghanistan GDP nominal $1100+.
economically pakistan should have done better, shouldn't it?

I just gave you links with actual statistics. Don't make random statistics up.

Report for Selected Countries and Subjects

The World Bank DataBank - Create Widgets or Advanced Reports and Share

World bank and IMF.

In all indicators, Afghanistan is far FAR behind Pakistan.

your numbers are measured in GNI, it is a more advanced formula including living standards, although Afghanistan have been in war for 30 years, it would be unfair to do a GNI on those numbers.
The whole world says you are a failed state, with one military coup after the other, bombing and killing of president candidates etc.

GNI has nothing to do with this and you know it.

Only people like you claim Pakistan is a failed state. Again, you have no evidence so you're resorting to obfuscate that fact by making wild uninformed claims. You don't even know what a failed state is!
 
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World bank and IMF.

In all indicators, Afghanistan is far FAR behind Pakistan.



GNI has nothing to do with this and you know it.

Only people like you claim Pakistan is a failed state. Again, you have no evidence so you're resorting to obfuscate that fact by making wild uninformed claims. You don't even know what a failed state is![/QUOTE] HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA LOL ILLEGAL AFGHAN IMMIGRANT CALLING PAKISTAN A FAILED STATE WHILE 3 MILLION ILLEGAL AFGHAN IMMIGRANTS ND AFGHAN MUHAJAREENS LIVE IN PAKISTAN BC THEY CANT FIND FOOD IN THT NARO STATE AFGHANISTAN THIS AFGHAN INDIA IS A FALSE FLAGGER HINDU DISGUISING AS A MUSLIM ND A AFGHAN HIS USERNAME SUGGESTS THT HE IS NOTHING BUT A HINDU DISGUISING AS A MUSLIM ND A AFGHAN THE FACT IS FALSE FLAGGER THE MUSLIMS RULED INDIA ND MADE HINDUS SLAVES FOR MORE THEN 1000 YEARS IS IT ENOUGH HUMILIATION FOR U HAAN INDIAN FALSE FLAGGER AFGHAN INDIA OR U WANT ME 2 XPOSE INDIA MORE HAAN.
 
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