A Milestone: Per IMF 2018 GDP Data, China Per Capital GDP exceeds $10K,

[jhungary]

First of all your loyalty in the nation you swear your allegiance to when you enlist in the US army. You would be a US spy if you reside in China as a Chinese citizen to undermine the legitimate of the CPC government by your outwardly constant criticism of Chinese government. Whatever your opinions of China only serve the interest of the US nation. No one ever seriously taken your criticism of CPC without any doubt of your self motive with a hidden agenda if anyone ever critical of your background.

lol a Chinese wannabe accuse me of being a Chinese spy...…..Haha, funny

What do you know about the military? for me, it is a job, I don't feel any more American than I already do when I join (I don't enlist, I am an officer) the US Army. I love fighting and combat sport, it's natural I need to find a job that match what I like.

People who are too patriotic should NEVER join or enlist in military of a country, that is what I learn from Day 1. Because patriotic clouded your judgement, and you will still think thing will pan out for the best, which it won't and from then on, you are fighting a losing battle.

As I said, and you have proven, you are an OUTSIDER, for you, there are only all or nothing, black and white, you accept all if you are "patriot" you are a "traitor" when you voice a difference opinion. Because for you, you have no stake in this game, you aren't even a Chinese. You are an outside observer. That's the reason why you can be so naïve. Because basically, when it come down to it, it is none of your business. Whatever CPC does in China does not affect you one bit, you aren't in China, and you aren't Chinese resident.

Traitor (or spy) like me pay tax dollar and land tax to CPC (I don't think China charge me tax), I have a vote to elect local registrar in my province, who actually was my distant uncle back in the 80s and 90s, what have you done or contribute to CPC or China lately? Other than towing the line on a foreign forum?

Maybe if you get some actual contribution, you can start calling me a traitor or spy. Otherwise, it's a moot point.

 

[淼淼De微笑]

lol a Chinese wannabe accuse me of being a Chinese spy...…..Haha, funny

What do you know about the military? for me, it is a job, I don't feel any more American than I already do when I join (I don't enlist, I am an officer) the US Army. I love fighting and combat sport, it's natural I need to find a job that match what I like.

People who are too patriotic should NEVER join or enlist in military of a country, that is what I learn from Day 1. Because patriotic clouded your judgement, and you will still think thing will pan out for the best, which it won't and from then on, you are fighting a losing battle.

As I said, and you have proven, you are an OUTSIDER, for you, there are only all or nothing, black and white, you accept all if you are "patriot" you are a "traitor" when you voice a difference opinion. Because for you, you have no stake in this game, you aren't even a Chinese. You are an outside observer. That's the reason why you can be so naïve. Because basically, when it come down to it, it is none of your business. Whatever CPC does in China does not affect you one bit, you aren't in China, and you aren't Chinese resident.

Traitor (or spy) like me pay tax dollar and land tax to CPC (I don't think China charge me tax), I have a vote to elect local registrar in my province, who actually was my distant uncle back in the 80s and 90s, what have you done or contribute to CPC or China lately? Other than towing the line on a foreign forum?

Maybe if you get some actual contribution, you can start calling me a traitor or spy. Otherwise, it's a moot point.

hoho what a woderful speech

 

[jhungary]

hoho what a woderful speech

hoho !! what a paid poster

 

[淼淼De微笑]

hoho !! what a paid poster

hoho I don't mind even you call me a paid refugee

 

[jhungary]

hoho I don't mind even you call me a paid refugee

haha, good on ya.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

I never anti-China, I am anti-CPC, in fact, I am anti-Communism.

And what is the "practical" alternative to the CPC in China? The KMT?

Well, nothing lasts forever, this applies to the CPC as well. Assuming you are still young, you might even see it in your lifetime, the end of the CPC.

And be careful what you wish for, do you really want China to be a US-style multi-party democracy? Do you want China to become like the USA, in a state of constant war, endless invasions of sovereign nations, dropping a bomb on someone's head every few minutes?

China under the CPC has not had a war since the 1979 Vietnam war, that's almost 40 years ago. Almost four decades without any war, without using military force, bombs and cruise missiles, as an instrument of geopolitical power.

Now imagine China as a US-style multi-party democracy, with every party promising anything they can to win the election. They will have to do everything they can to appeal to the nationalists, which means becoming like the USA and readily using military force to solve geopolitical issues.

And what country do you think will bear the brunt of the new China-turned-USA? Most likely it will be Vietnam again, due to the territorial disputes in the SCS. Vietnam being the only ASEAN member that still openly opposes China there.

Like I said, you might even see it in your lifetime. And then you will wish for the old CPC back, but by then it will be too late. There will be another USA on the block, and another epoch of endless invasions, wars and bombings. Except this new USA will be much bigger and much more dangerous than the old one.

 

[jhungary]

And what is the "practical" alternative to the CPC in China? The KMT?

Well, nothing lasts forever, this applies to the CPC as well. Assuming you are still young, you might even see it in your lifetime, the end of the CPC.

And be careful what you wish for, do you really want China to be a US-style multi-party democracy? Do you want China to become like the USA, in a state of constant war, endless invasions of sovereign nations, dropping a bomb on someone's head every few minutes?

China under the CPC has not had a war since the 1979 Vietnam war, that's almost 40 years ago. Almost four decades without any war, without using military force, bombs and cruise missiles, as an instrument of geopolitical power.

Now imagine China as a US-style multi-party democracy, with every party promising anything they can to win the election. They will have to do everything they can to appeal to the nationalists, which means becoming like the USA and readily using military force to solve geopolitical issues.

And what country do you think will bear the brunt of the new China-turned-USA? Most likely it will be Vietnam again, due to the territorial disputes in the SCS. Vietnam being the only ASEAN member that still openly opposes China there.

Like I said, you might even see it in your lifetime. And then you will wish for the old CPC back, but by then it will be too late. There will be another USA on the block, and another epoch of endless invasions, wars and bombings. Except this new USA will be much bigger and much more dangerous than the old one.

This is your MAJOR problem, you assume if not CPC, China will be under KMT or US style "Freedom"

There are many political system in this world, some are still in use, some not, some have been tried and tested, some have passed with flying color, some failed miserably. And then some system are a mix of two or more political system.

plus, you have no idea what American Democracy contribution to the world. You want to go back to multi-polar system back to ww2 era and where there are few regional power constantly at war, be my guest. That's your business. But if you are familiar with history, you will know, whenever, there were a super power (like Roman Empire, Persian Empire, Ottoman empire) war and conflict are less than when there are Multipolar power, and that is a fact you can take in.

Be glad that American volunteer to be world policeman, so you can sit comfortably at your home, hating America.

 

[twocents]

And what is the "practical" alternative to the CPC in China? The KMT?

Well, nothing lasts forever, this applies to the CPC as well. Assuming you are still young, you might even see it in your lifetime, the end of the CPC.

And be careful what you wish for, do you really want China to be a US-style multi-party democracy? Do you want China to become like the USA, in a state of constant war, endless invasions of sovereign nations, dropping a bomb on someone's head every few minutes?

China under the CPC has not had a war since the 1979 Vietnam war, that's almost 40 years ago. Almost four decades without any war, without using military force, bombs and cruise missiles, as an instrument of geopolitical power.

Now imagine China as a US-style multi-party democracy, with every party promising anything they can to win the election. They will have to do everything they can to appeal to the nationalists, which means becoming like the USA and readily using military force to solve geopolitical issues.

And what country do you think will bear the brunt of the new China-turned-USA? Most likely it will be Vietnam again, due to the territorial disputes in the SCS. Vietnam being the only ASEAN member that still openly opposes China there.

Like I said, you might even see it in your lifetime. And then you will wish for the old CPC back, but by then it will be too late. There will be another USA on the block, and another epoch of endless invasions, wars and bombings. Except this new USA will be much bigger and much more dangerous than the old one.

你同他啰嗦就上当了，那是个冒充国人的三锅。

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

I never anti-China, I am anti-CPC, in fact, I am anti-Communism.

You know I have always held the same position, I think that Communism is stupid.

In fact one of the major reasons I support the CPC is because of their economic system (socialist market economy), which has lifted over 800 million Chinese out of poverty in three decades.

That's why I support the CPC, they have done more for ordinary Chinese people than anyone else on Earth.

This is your MAJOR problem, you assume if not CPC, China will be under KMT or US style "Freedom"

There are many political system in this world, some are still in use, some not, some have been tried and tested, some have passed with flying color, some failed miserably. And then some system are a mix of two or more political system.

plus, you have no idea what American Democracy contribution to the world. You want to go back to multi-polar system back to ww2 era and where there are few regional power constantly at war, be my guest. That's your business. But if you are familiar with history, you will know, whenever, there were a super power (like Roman Empire, Persian Empire, Ottoman empire) war and conflict are less than when there are Multipolar power, and that is a fact you can take in.

Be glad that American volunteer to be world policeman, so you can sit comfortably at your home, hating America.

On the day the CPC falls, there will likely be several conditions present. Firstly, the Chinese economy and military will be massively powerful. Secondly, China will be in a state of severe internal turmoil, in order for the CPC to fall.

Now does that sound like a recipe for the emergence of a happy mixed system that continues the CPC tradition of no external war? Or a firebrand Donald Trump style warmongering democracy that promises to make China great again, at any cost?

Do you think nationalist sentiment in China is any less than in the USA? If anything, nationalist sentiment in China is greater, and will thus shape the future of any possible Chinese "democracy". And as before, Vietnam is the country that will bear the brunt of the new China-turned-USA.

On that day, you will wish for the old CPC back, which despite its flaws at least managed to stay out of wars, invasions and bombings. But it won't come back.

 

[Mista]

You know I have always held the same position, I think that Communism is stupid.

In fact one of the major reasons I support the CPC is because of their economic system (socialist market economy), which has lifted over 800 million Chinese out of poverty in three decades.

That's why I support the CPC, they have done more for ordinary Chinese people than anyone else on Earth.



On the day the CPC falls, there will likely be several conditions present. Firstly, the Chinese economy and military will be massively powerful. Secondly, China will be in a state of severe internal turmoil, in order for the CPC to fall.

Now does that sound like a recipe for the emergence of a happy mixed system that continues the CPC tradition of no external war? Or a firebrand Donald Trump style warmongering democracy that promises to make China great again, at any cost?

Do you think nationalist sentiment in China is any less than in the USA? If anything, nationalist sentiment in China is greater, and will thus shape the future of any possible Chinese "democracy". And as before, Vietnam is the country that will bear the brunt of the new China-turned-USA.

On that day, you will wish for the old CPC back, which despite its flaws at least managed to stay out of wars, invasions and bombings. But it won't come back.

Lol, actually that's what I told to other Westerners in other forums. They think if China is democratic, it would be less aggressive in their foreign policy towards her smaller Asian neighbors. And I told them bluntly, have you seen how nationalistic the average Chinese is on their internet? What's the easiest way to win votes?

 

[jhungary]

On the day the CPC falls, there will likely be several conditions present. Firstly, the Chinese economy and military will be massively powerful. Secondly, China will be in a state of severe internal turmoil, in order for the CPC to fall.

Now does that sound like a recipe for the emergence of a happy mixed system that continues the CPC tradition of no external war? Or a firebrand Donald Trump style warmongering democracy that promises to make China great again, at any cost?

Do you think nationalist sentiment in China is any less than in the USA? If anything, nationalist sentiment in China is greater, and will thus shape the future of any possible Chinese "democracy". And as before, Vietnam is the country that will bear the brunt of the new China-turned-USA.

On that day, you will wish for the old CPC back, which despite its flaws at least managed to stay out of wars, invasions and bombings. But it won't come back.

What if it is because CPC that China fall? Have you ever thought about it?

Again, you are using the "if not CPC, there will be US Style democracy" Argument, which you would not know whether or not it is true, because it had never happened, the only TRUTH is that CPC is 69 years old, China have over 5000 years of history, that is the ultimate truth, China will still be exist whether or not CPC is just a thing in the history.

And you don't need to talk about Nationalism in China, I have seen enough.

The old CPC manage to stay out of any war by making China so undesirable, nobody wanted any part of it. CPC themselves did a pretty good job killing Chinese that we don't need any war to have more killed. And that is a fact. How many Chinese died in battle, whether or not in China or Overseas? vs How many dead directly contributed to CPC? You do the maths.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

What if it is because CPC that China fall? Have you ever thought about it?

Again, you are using the "if not CPC, there will be US Style democracy" Argument, which you would not know whether or not it is true, because it had never happened, the only TRUTH is that CPC is 69 years old, China have over 5000 years of history, that is the ultimate truth, China will still be exist whether or not CPC is just a thing in the history.

And you don't need to talk about Nationalism in China, I have seen enough.

The old CPC manage to stay out of any war by making China so undesirable, nobody wanted any part of it. CPC themselves did a pretty good job killing Chinese that we don't need any war to have more killed. And that is a fact. How many Chinese died in battle, whether or not in China or Overseas? vs How many dead directly contributed to CPC? You do the maths.

You know about nationalism in China, and how strong it is. So tell me, what will happen if China becomes a multi-party democracy? Whichever candidate makes the strongest appeal to nationalism will win.

If you want China to go down that route, you may see it within your lifetime, and at that time it will be game over for Vietnam.

As for the CPC, yes they have historically made a lot of mistakes, including the famine of the Great Leap Forward in 1959 and the Cultural revolution of 1966, being the two biggest examples. But we are talking about the CPC of today, and the modern CPC has lifted over 800 million Chinese people out of poverty, they have done more for ordinary Chinese people than anyone else in the world.

As long as Chinese economic growth and internal stability remain, the CPC will continue to rule, and they continue to be able to hold off external wars. Once they are no longer to maintain stability in China, something else will rise to take the place of the CPC, and they will inherit a China that is both massively powerful as well as massively unstable. It's a recipe for disaster, China will turn into an engine of war just like the rest of the P5 nations, but massively bigger.

China will still be exist whether or not CPC is just a thing in the history.

Of course. But will the new China be as peaceful as the current CPC-led China which has avoided war for almost 40 years? Given the circumstances which would cause the CPC to fall, that seems unlikely in the extreme.

I prefer peace, so I want the CPC to rule as long as possible, for the next few decades at the very least.

 

[jhungary]

You know about nationalism in China, and how strong it is. So tell me, what will happen if China becomes a multi-party democracy? Whichever candidate makes the strongest appeal to nationalism will win.

If you want China to go down that route, you may see it within your lifetime, and at that time it will be game over for Vietnam.

As for the CPC, yes they have historically made a lot of mistakes, including the famine of the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural revolution, being the two biggest examples. But we are talking about the CPC of today, and the modern CPC has lifted over 800 million Chinese people out of poverty, they have done more for ordinary Chinese people than anyone else in the world.

As long as Chinese economic growth and internal stability remain, the CPC will continue to rule, and they continue to be able to hold off external wars. Once they are no longer to maintain stability in China, something else will rise to take the place of the CPC, and they will inherit a China that is both massively powerful as well as massively unstable. It's a recipe for disaster, China will turn into an engine of war just like the rest of the P5 nations, but massively bigger.

Again, why you assume if CPC fail, China will developed into "Multi-party" democracy?

You keep saying this, but this does not make sense. The only way it make sense is when China being conquered and being divided, but this would NEVER happened.

Again, being an opponent of a party does not mean you hate all of the aspect, as I said, your's biggest problem is you either go one or go all, if you don't accept the flaw that goes with it and just blindly following it, that mean you are doing an injustice to the country.

Of course. But will the new China be as peaceful as the current CPC-led China which has avoided war for almost 40 years? Given the circumstances which would cause the CPC to fall, that seems unlikely in the extreme.

I prefer peace, so I want the CPC to rule as long as possible, for the next few decades at the very least.

That's because you weren't there when CPC did absolutely shit to their people. Of course you would want that to keep going, in fact, many Chinese have no political affiliation, you don't prefer CPC, you just prefer a stable China, so in a way, you and I are the same, I prefer a stable China, so I can make some money with my Business in China.

The matter of fact is, CPC is not China, I don't need to like CPC to like China. Saying otherwise is in my opinion, being egocentric and narcissistic

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Again, why you assume if CPC fail, China will developed into "Multi-party" democracy?

You keep saying this, but this does not make sense. The only way it make sense is when China being conquered and being divided, but this would NEVER happened.

Again, being an opponent of a party does not mean you hate all of the aspect, as I said, your's biggest problem is you either go one or go all, if you don't accept the flaw that goes with it and just blindly following it, that mean you are doing an injustice to the country.



That's because you weren't there when CPC did absolutely shit to their people. Of course you would want that to keep going, in fact, many Chinese have no political affiliation, you don't prefer CPC, you just prefer a stable China, so in a way, you and I are the same, I prefer a stable China, so I can make some money with my Business in China.

The matter of fact is, CPC is not China, I don't need to like CPC to like China. Saying otherwise is in my opinion, being egocentric and narcissistic

I don't mind any type of Chinese government as long as they look after the welfare of the Chinese people, and they keep China away from the wars that are going on all around the world. As far as I'm concerned, the CPC of today is achieving exactly that.

So why fix it, if it isn't broken? It's working right now, Chinese living standards are rising, we are not involved in the Syria war or any other war across the world. I am happy with this arrangement.

But it can't last forever, as everyone knows, no Government can last forever. One day it will fall and China will turn into the same war machine that the rest of the P5 are. I prefer to keep that off for as long as possible.

That's because you weren't there when CPC did absolutely shit to their people.

Like I said, I'm well aware of the CPC's huge mistakes, especially the Great Leap Forward in 1959 and the Cultural Revolution in 1966.

But today it is 2018, and the modern CPC is nothing like that at all. It hasn't been for decades. In fact the current leadership of the CPC are the same ones that were persecuted during the Cultural Revolution, they know it from a very personal standpoint.

Again, why you assume if CPC fail, China will developed into "Multi-party" democracy?

Alright then what is the alternative?

The most likely circumstance is for the CPC to reform from within, but it has already done that decades ago and you still hate it. America still hates it. If it happens again I doubt that will change at all.

Chinese nationalism is a storm, it's all the CPC can do to hold the reigns to prevent it going out of control. Whatever Government comes next won't be able to stop it.

 

[jhungary]

I don't mind any type of Chinese government as long as they look after the welfare of the Chinese people, and they keep China away from the wars that are going on all around the world. As far as I'm concerned, the CPC of today is achieving exactly that.

So why fix it, if it isn't broken? It's working right now, Chinese living standards are rising, we are not involved in the Syria war or any other war across the world. I am happy with this arrangement.

But it can't last forever, as everyone knows, no Government can last forever. One day it will fall and China will turn into the same war machine that the rest of the P5 are. I prefer to keep that off for as long as possible.

What this have anything to be between CPC = China?

CPC fall, great, CPC not fall, not a big deal, does it have anything remotely related to being China?

You are the same type of person who in the middle of a dynasty, any dynasty and purported if this dynasty fall, then the end will come to China, but history proven otherwise, as each dynasty felt, a new one rise up and take it place and China have been doing this for 5000 years.

So, I don't really care whether or not CPC fall, that does not mean I cannot be anti-CPC. And you still did not give me a reasonable explanation as to why Anti-CPC = Anti-China.

Like I said, I'm well aware of the CPC's huge mistakes, especially the Great Leap Forward in 1959 and the Cultural Revolution in 1966.

But today it is 2018, and the modern CPC is nothing like that at all. It hasn't been for decades. In fact the current leadership of the CPC are the same ones that were persecuted during the Cultural Revolution, they know it from a very personal standpoint.

So? Does that mean IT WILL NEVER EVER HAPPENS AGAIN?

Answer is, it don't.

Alright then what is the alternative?

The most likely circumstance is for the CPC to reform from within, but it has already done that decades ago and you still hate it. America still hates it. If it happens again I doubt that will change at all.

Chinese nationalism is a storm, it's all the CPC can do to hold the reigns to prevent it going out of control. Whatever Government comes next won't be able to stop it.

Do you realise why this, what you are saying in this paragraph is why people, Chinese or non-Chinese alike, hate CPC?