A 3rd Pakistan was supposed to be created

[azmax007]

I read somewhere that there was supposed to be a 3rd Pakistan. The third Pakistan was planned to be the current day Indian state of Andra Pradesh mostly around the Hyderbad city in India. Can someone confirm that?

 

[hoodhood1]

I wish. Yes! the Nawab of Hyderabad had put up this suggestion, but it was not feasible, so was the Rulers of Kathiwar and Manawadar also suggested, in this case Lord Mountbatten and his cums changed the boundry line at 0 Hrs and gave the two states to India.

 

[mujahideen]

Well originally at the time of the Partition their were some I think and I am not 100% sure 200-300 Princely States, who were independent from the British Raj. These Princely states were independent, but paid the British Tax. Now when the Partition came the British said that the Princely states could join India or Pakistan, or declare independence for themselves or combine with other Princely states and become one big State and then declare independence. Now Hyderabad was one of the bigger States and as soon as the Partition came it declared independence. One disadvantage Hyderabad had was it was landlocked but none the less it was independent and was even accepted to the U.N. Hyderabad was a Hindu majority state with the Royal Family being Muslim. Soon after it became independent it decided to become a part of Pakistan. It is interesting to note that when this decision was made India found out and threaten to attack or invade Hyderabad. Hyderabad in fact never formally joined Pakistan, it is believed they were on the verge of joining and they definitely would of. India first played the Hindu card and said Hyderabad should become a part of India because of its Hindu majority. Pakistan on the other hand called for a vote in which the people would decide which country they would join. This was a good move on the part of Pakistan because the knew that if a vote was held in Hyderabad then India would also have to hold a vote in Kashmire, but unfortunately that was not to be. India soon started to fund a Hindu separatist movement, and soon after wards invaded Hyderabad and the State was quickly conquered. Hyderabad back then was much bigger then it is today. Now Hyderabad as soon as India invaded it put a complain with the U.N, a resolution, it is interesting to note that this resolution is still in the U.N, without it ever being voted on by the members of the U.N.
Now Hyderabad wasn't the only Princely State to have or be on the verge of joining Pakistan.
Another Princely State by the name of Jundagh had actually formally joined Pakistan. The advantage Jundagh had was that it was near the water and I think about 200 miles away from Pakistani territory. Jundagh again was a Hindu Majority state with the Royal family being Muslim. Pakistan again played the voting card and said that a vote should be held as to what country the people want to join, knowing full well that a vote would also have to be held in Kashmire. But a vote was never held and India invaded. Pakistan at that time could not respond this aggression because being a new country it didn't have the military capabilities to do so and at the time all its military resources were being used up in Kashmire.
Now two other Princely states by the name of Manvadar and Kathhiwar was also suppose to join Pakistan, but I cant comment on it because I have never read about it, I have read about Hyderabad and Jundagh and I have stated above what I know about the two, Manvadar and Kathiwar are something I dont know anything about and I cant say anything on something I have no knowledge of.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

And who is the one with this theory?

At this rate n number of Pakistan was to be created!

But then, these ideas must have been imbibed with Scotland's very best!

As a Bangaldeshi, you should know better!

How come you failed to keep the first Pakistan in place?

Your statement of "third Pakistan" indicates that you did not have faith in the First Pakistan itself, so how come the third Pakistan would not follow Bangladesh and bring more discredit to the First Pakistan?

Don't embarrass people with ridiculous threads that have no background!

If you feel that Bangladesh is a mistake and your people don't agree with you, then you can always use the option taken by Raja Tridib Roy.

 

[bhangra12345]

Well originally at the time of the Partition their were some I think and I am not 100% sure 200-300 Princely States, who were independent from the British Raj. These Princely states were independent, but paid the British Tax. Now when the Partition came the British said that the Princely states could join India or Pakistan, or declare independence for themselves or combine with other Princely states and become one big State and then declare independence. Now Hyderabad was one of the bigger States and as soon as the Partition came it declared independence. One disadvantage Hyderabad had was it was landlocked but none the less it was independent and was even accepted to the U.N. Hyderabad was a Hindu majority state with the Royal Family being Muslim. Soon after it became independent it decided to become a part of Pakistan. It is interesting to note that when this decision was made India found out and threaten to attack or invade Hyderabad. Hyderabad in fact never formally joined Pakistan, it is believed they were on the verge of joining and they definitely would of. India first played the Hindu card and said Hyderabad should become a part of India because of its Hindu majority. Pakistan on the other hand called for a vote in which the people would decide which country they would join. This was a good move on the part of Pakistan because the knew that if a vote was held in Hyderabad then India would also have to hold a vote in Kashmire, but unfortunately that was not to be. India soon started to fund a Hindu separatist movement, and soon after wards invaded Hyderabad and the State was quickly conquered. Hyderabad back then was much bigger then it is today. Now Hyderabad as soon as India invaded it put a complain with the U.N, a resolution, it is interesting to note that this resolution is still in the U.N, without it ever being voted on by the members of the U.N.
Now Hyderabad wasn't the only Princely State to have or be on the verge of joining Pakistan.
Another Princely State by the name of Jundagh had actually formally joined Pakistan. The advantage Jundagh had was that it was near the water and I think about 200 miles away from Pakistani territory. Jundagh again was a Hindu Majority state with the Royal family being Muslim. Pakistan again played the voting card and said that a vote should be held as to what country the people want to join, knowing full well that a vote would also have to be held in Kashmire. But a vote was never held and India invaded. Pakistan at that time could not respond this aggression because being a new country it didn't have the military capabilities to do so and at the time all its military resources were being used up in Kashmire.
Now two other Princely states by the name of Manvadar and Kathhiwar was also suppose to join Pakistan, but I cant comment on it because I have never read about it, I have read about Hyderabad and Jundagh and I have stated above what I know about the two, Manvadar and Kathiwar are something I dont know anything about and I cant say anything on something I have no knowledge of.

Let me put it this way, your history of junagadh is wrong. Manvadar is a very very small kingdom with regions some inside junagadh and some outside.
Junagadh's nawab announced around may 47 that he will consult with the public to know their pulse and decide on which country to join, but he secretly signed the accession in mid-july for Pakistan.

Manvadar had a status of ambiguity between suzerenity between junagadh and british. Kathiawar is the name of the area in which junagadh and manvdar were located. There is no princely state going by the name kathiawar.

The states dept of India and Pakistan which was to oversee the accessions was formed only in start of july and India was in the process of accessing around 540 states, so they did not had time to consult each and every state. Though India sent telegrams to convey nawab's decision, they were unanswered and due to paucity of time, no action was taken, remember partition happened in 5 days from that.

Immediately after independence, the nawab announced the accession to Pakistan. However the hindu population started revolting, sensing trouble the nawab escaped to Pakistan. In junagadh, the law and order worsened. There was a huge shortage of food grains as the normal traders stopped trading there because of law and order problems. In this situation, the nawab authorised his minister, none other than the grand father of benazir bhutto, to do whatever is required. This bhutto signed the instrument of accession for India and it was only then India entered junagadh.

IndianExpress.com :: The Bhutto family’s Junagadh connection

Even after that India conducted the plebiscite, and only then accepted the accession and it was Pakistan who first put the spokes on this concept of plebiscite by objecting to it here and became the trendsetter.
In between sometime, manvadar also signed the instrument of accession with India.

To read the story, "story of integration of indian states - vp menon". This menon was the secretary to Patel who was the minister in India responsible for it. By the way, he is the original propagator of the pakistan's the then geographical area.

A brief synopsis can be found on the wiki.
Indian integration of Junagadh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In short India did not enter into any state, without the ruler signing the instrument of accession, except hyderabad. But hyderabad was a different case altogether. Even there, after the army entered hyderabad, the nizam was the titular head for around 6-8 months during the transition period and he had signed the instrument

Edit: I am somehow getting the feeling that the name of the state is not manavdar but mangrol, anyway i have to check, unfortunately the book is not on hand.

 

[ejaz007]

Apart from hyderabad & Junagarh there were also two districts namely Ferozpur and Gurdaspur. As per partition rules these states should have joined Pakistan because these were Muslim majority districts. However since these two districts bordered Kashmir and without them India would not have gained access to Kashmir these were given to India by the border commission formed to oversee the partition. How they managed it I am not sure but this did happened.

 

[bhangra12345]

The indian border commissions, one for west and one for east pakistan were formed, both headed by Radcliffe. Each contained initially 2 judges from india and 2 judges from Pakistan. However, the two commissions became impossible to work because of bickering. So it was decided that only Radcliffe would decide the boundary, and he drew the entire boundary in about 1 month. 1 month and 1 person was all it took to draw the lines.

How those districts came to India? The same way, lahore the then capital of sikhs and guru nanaks birthplace went to pakistan. The line was drawn and every one accepted it. Any changes would have meant only more boundary problems, which every one very cleverly and correctly accepted.

 

[salman nedian]

I read somewhere that there was supposed to be a 3rd Pakistan. The third Pakistan was planned to be the current day Indian state of Andra Pradesh mostly around the Hyderbad city in India. Can someone confirm that?

yaar yahan pehle hi 2 ho gaye tum 3rd ki baat karte ho(we have already divided our country into 2 and you are talking about 3rd one).

I beleive on 1 Pakistan.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Apart from hyderabad & Junagarh there were also two districts namely Ferozpur and Gurdaspur. As per partition rules these states should have joined Pakistan because these were Muslim majority districts. However since these two districts bordered Kashmir and without them India would not have gained access to Kashmir these were given to India by the border commission formed to oversee the partition. How they managed it I am not sure but this did happened.

Radcliffe was not an Indian.

Ask him.


Sikhs have never reconciled to Lahore being in Pakistan.


You have no sense of geography.

These would not have in anyway prevent access to Kashmir.

That is, unless you think Gudaspur and Ferozpur is the whole of Punjab!

It is most amusing that the ridiculous is stated to prove a point or to wail like in a matam!

Let us realistically discuss and not bring this forum to the level of a kintergraten!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

azmax007

Since you hear things, can you shed some light?

 

[uzi2000]

Gents. My Grandad was the First Finance Sec. of Pakistan. Yes, with Jinnah the original group to form Pakistan.

The above is all a myth. We should have not even had taken Bangladesh as East Pakistan. And if it was up to me, and I am a nationalist, hell, we should also forget Kashmir. Even though my mum's family comes from there. As they will turn out to be another Bangladesh for us in the future.

 

[mujahideen]

Gents. My Grandad was the First Finance Sec. of Pakistan. Yes, with Jinnah the original group to form Pakistan.

The above is all a myth. We should have not even had taken Bangladesh as East Pakistan. And if it was up to me, and I am a nationalist, hell, we should also forget Kashmir. Even though my mum's family comes from there. As they will turn out to be another Bangladesh for us in the future.

Can you tell me what was your grandfathers name?
Now I really dont know what myth you are talking about. If your are calling the accession of Hyderabad and Jundagh a myth then you are surely mistaken, because I must of read about 10 to 20 books on them and them trying to acceed to Pakistan.
As far a Bangladesh is concerned I have come to the conclusion that Quaid-I-Azam knew that East Pakistan would one day revolt. I have also come to the conclusion that Quaid-I-Azam had given Laiquat Ali Khan and Nazimuddin a breifing on how to prevent East Pakistan from breaking away. It must be noted the two people after Quaid-I-Azam who could of saved Pakistan were Laiquat Ali and Nazimudddin, and believe me we have never had or will have as sincere leaders as them and it is a shame what happened to them. Onee was assassinated and the other illegally removed from office. They gave their life for Pakistan. When Laiquat Ali was assassinated he had lees then 100 rupees in his bank account and when Nazimuddin was removed he didn't even have a house to live in.

 

[ejaz007]

This is what is listed at wikipedia.

Hyderabad State - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It does not say hyderabad joined India by free will but was absorbed in India by operation conducted by Indian police.

 

[ejaz007]

This is what this web site says:

Hyderabad on the Net: The Nizams

Even here there is no mention of Hyderabad joining by its own will. It was the invasion by India that led to the end of Hyderabad.

 

[MIG_ACE]

You know, it would have been easier for you to just PM the mods and get yourself banned.


Post edited to remove Quote with expletives

keyser