3000 reconverted to Hinduism in Odisha

[kingkobra]

Is this an illegal conversion ?

Did they have all the permissions and permits for such act ?

Or it is only enforced on Hindu folks trying to convert to some other eligion ?

in this case this conversion is act of repentance...those who were fooled to convert into other religions have come back to sanatan vedic dharma...

 

[Manas]

Dear friend i understand your frustration....but let me tell you one thing..i belong to that area and state of Odisha for which this thread isbeing discussed....Beleive me ....this problem is not simple as it seems to be...You can not simply blame the missionary or the poor dalit people who r getting converted..There are so many other compelling factors that force them for it...And again..those people who gets converted are by practice and faith pursue their tribal religion although they gets converted to Christianity...

Thats exactly the point.

These poor chaps convert to Christianity with zero knowledge about the religion .
They are converted in exchange of few bags of rice and few notes of rupees .

The converted isn't interested in the religion ,but goes to the church 'casue he has heard some other has received money in exchange of conversion.

The church on its part get more donation from the west only if it manages to harvest souls and keeps the new convert loyal with promise of more handouts in future.

PS: I'm from Odisha too. The tribals(Kandha) hate dalit converts(panna) as convert dalits give false certificate of being SC to secure jobs and other benefits of reservation undermining the tribal . That's the reason behind 2008 anti christian riots in the Kandhamal area of Odisha..

 

[punit]

Dalits in rural areas according to me have no choice but to convert . Preferably to Buddhism .

and then what ?.. issue will remain same. casteism in one way or other is pan Indian/subcontinental phenomenon cutting across religion lines. where else u heard terms like dalit Christians/Muslims ? solution is financial improvement. rest will change on its own.

 

[Rusty]

Who said Hinduism doesnt allow re-conversion ?

Hinduism allows everything. You can be a Hindu even without worshipping/believing any of the Gods. Yes that's right, Hinduism considers even atheism as legitimate. Atheism in Hinduism

What you do in Hinduism is between God and you. No boring mullah or pastor or rabbi to dictate anything to you.

Thank you for saying that, I have heard many Hindus say this.
So naturally the next question is, What does it matter what you call yourself?
According to many Hindus, including yourself, even a Muslim or Christian can be a Hindu.
Right?
So, when someone stops calling themselves a Hindus, they are still Hindu.
When someone starts calling themselves a different name, ie Muslim, Christian, etc they are still Hindu.
So then then why do Hindus get upset when people change the name of their religion?
Why do they need to be re-converted?
And Worse of all, why do Hindus attack their fellow Hindus just for calling themselves a different name?
do you follow the logic here?

 

[blooboy]

there is no caste in arya samaj..vedas do not promote castism...

In that case, they are still not 100% Hindus, as they wont be able to marry outside Arya Samaj. To be a 'normal' Hindu, one need to be among the 4 Varnas i.e. Brahmins(Clergy), Kshatriyas(Martial), Vaishyas(Traders), Shudras(Untouchables) and then there are countless sects under SC, ST, OBC.

If those guys re-converted under no pressure, then its their decision. We should respect them.

 

[blooboy]

Thats exactly the point.

.........
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PS: I'm from Odisha too. The tribals(Kandha) hate dalit converts(panna) as convert dalits give false certificate of being SC to secure jobs and other benefits of reservation undermining the tribal . That's the reason behind 2008 anti christian riots in the Kandhamal area of Odisha..

That is a debatable point. Does getting converted to Christianity solve all their problems? They are still among the poorest in the society. Changing religion is only a personal matter. It has no effect on a person's social standing. Non-christians were jealous when they saw that Christians were getting more access to better education, thereby resulting in them getting better jobs etc.

It would have been better if RSS and VHP etc had worked on the social upliftment of those tribals.

 

[LaBong]

In that case, they are still not 100% Hindus, as they wont be able to marry outside Arya Samaj. To be a 'normal' Hindu, one need to be among the 4 Varnas i.e. Brahmins(Clergy), Kshatriyas(Martial), Vaishyas(Traders), Shudras(Untouchables) and then there are countless sects under SC, ST, OBC.

If those guys re-converted under no pressure, then its their decision. We should respect them.

Shudras are not same as Dalits. There is no Dalit in Varna system, you are confusing between Varna system and Casteism.

 

[LaBong]

As far as I'm concerned, those tribals can convert to whatever they want to if they can get a better deal out of it. If converting to Christianity can help them to assimilate in the mainstream then so be it, if re-converting to Hinduism helps them more, then I have no problem as well.

Missionaries try to lure people to Christianity, true. But the way of stopping that would empower those downtrodden people and help them to assimilate in the mainstream, NOT burning them alive. My city had been abode of Mother Theresa and Missionaries of Charity since independence, but never witnessed any mass scale conversion from Hinduism to Christianity here.

 

[Manas]

In that case, they are still not 100% Hindus, as they wont be able to marry outside Arya Samaj. To be a 'normal' Hindu, one need to be among the 4 Varnas i.e. Brahmins(Clergy), Kshatriyas(Martial), Vaishyas(Traders), Shudras(Untouchables) and then there are countless sects under SC, ST, OBC.

If those guys re-converted under no pressure, then its their decision. We should respect them.

No they are 200% hindus and Nobody cann't deny their right of being hindus.

Caste system isn't part of the hindu sacred text of vedas or Upanishas known as the Śruti which is god's words and is unchangeable.

Caste system crept into hindu religion as part of smṛti which are texts regarding Hindu laws and are perfectly liable to change of over the period of time.

And in todays time when professions and job descriptions have gone thriugh so many changes ,the caste system of wrote as hindu laws in the Manu smṛti for the hindus thousands year back is no longer valid.

PS: when it comes to caste discrimination in the hindu society is no none is guiltless . A dalit Jatav(chamar) would treat a lower caste dalit Balmiki with the loathe attitude a Brahman would, to a Bania .

 

[blooboy]

If someone calls us Hindu, as in 'Citizens of Hindustan' with a Hindu moral and culture, we are okay with it. Only issue is that, we can not be typical idol worshiping common 'Hindu' who believes in stories of Puranas.

 

[blooboy]

To all my Hindu brothers: Get rid of Casteism. Start from your own home. Then we can all work together for the upliftment of our Country. No one would dare to mess with our nation then.

 

[kingkobra]

In that case, they are still not 100% Hindus, as they wont be able to marry outside Arya Samaj. To be a 'normal' Hindu, one need to be among the 4 Varnas i.e. Brahmins(Clergy), Kshatriyas(Martial), Vaishyas(Traders), Shudras(Untouchables) and then there are countless sects under SC, ST, OBC.

If those guys re-converted under no pressure, then its their decision. We should respect them.

varna system is totally different than caste system brother..varna is based on what you have achieved in your life..while caste system is based on your birth..varna system in vedas is universal..

 

[KS]

it is, up to the converted people to embrace or reject their faith. rightwing hindu groups are stronger than ever in India. 10 years after the organized slaughter, narindra modi is now projected by rightwingers as prime ministerial candidate. it is all for the interest of India, that a third front must arise who must stop the rightwing party bjp and minority appeasing corrrupt congress from power.

reconverting tribals and dalits is a strategy long tried by rightwing forces in India. it is not the first incident.

Blame it on the hypocrisy/double standards/appeasement our Govt/politicos exhibit like the recent Salman rushdie affair. Naturally when a Hindu see this kind of step-motherly treatment -- where threats are invented to keep out someone from attending a fair just because some loonies in a community doesn't like it -- he gets pissed off and voila you have one more right winger.

Want to stop the right wing from growing ? Deny the oxygen that they thrive on. Start practising real secularism where everyone is treated same irrespective of their faith and not the fake desi pseudo-secularism.

BTW if the conversionaries (missionaries engaged in conversion) have the "Constitutional freedom" to convert the tribals, then the Right wing groups have the same "constitutional freedom" to bring them back home. What is there to moan/***** about it ?

 

[Manas]

That is a debatable point. Does getting converted to Christianity solve all their problems? They are still among the poorest in the society. Changing religion is only a personal matter. It has no effect on a person's social standing. Non-christians were jealous when they saw that Christians were getting more access to better education, thereby resulting in them getting better jobs etc.

So you are indirectly hinting that dalits get access to better education run missionary institutions only if they choose to convert. Hmm,so much for charity.

It would have been better if RSS and VHP etc had worked on the social upliftment of those tribals.

It would have been better if you had updated your information about RSS and VHP voluntary work among the tribal.

RSS and VHP has done ample social service in the tribal areas of Odisha ,Chatisgarh and Jharkhand self evident from the BJP's electoral success in these areas.

In fact A Hindu Swamy widely acknowledged for life long social service among the tribals was killed by the Maoists backed by the missionaries in Khadamal that the triggered the khandhal riots .

 

[The SC]

So in Hinduism everything is allowed and what anyone chooses to do is between him and god.

But Hindus forget about the animalism nature of Man, this is why Indians and atheists and even Christians and Jews live in a chaotic mind frame and social behaviour. they all want to instil this idea in the brains of people.

Islam says that what you do personally has consequences on your immediate surroundings and its effects either pleases people and God or not, since religion is meant for social behaviour.

God himself doesn't need us, he encompasses everything and with a scientific look at the universe you can see how negligible earth is let alone human kind.