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1962 war tried to wake up Nehru with heavy punch: China daily

Tibet is part of China is an international consensus,not even one country ever questioned it,not even India.but Kashmir is not,that is disputed land,as for uprisings,China rarely has that problem,I guess our neigbours have more of those "problems"than us,way more actually...

International consensus, maybe. But an actual legitimacy ? I don't think so.

Its very evident when almost every country warmly welcomes the dalai and the Tibetan prime minister ( and his delegates ) in exile.

Nehru may have awoken but his Congress Party is in deep slumber even today! Jeeeez! :cheesy:

No it isn't. Our forces are modernizing as fast as they possibly can. Don't go by the media propaganda.
 
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After 1962, Indian policy changed from a pacifist one to an aggressive one and began to modernize and expand our armed forces, first with the help of USSR and now with the active help of USA. We began a nuclear power and a missile power. Bcs of 1962, China have one more nuclear power with their missiles pointed at their cities. So whatever Mao chose to achieve, he failed.

Yes we don't gloss over our defeats and shortcomings. the 1962 debacle taught our political leaders that peace can only be achieved through strength.

That lame fvuk Nehru said something preposterous... "why do we need an army when we have a well equipped police force" ROFLMAO !!

He was progressively reducing the strength of IA and it did came down from 1950 levels by early 60s..

He deserved a spank and he got one :tup:
 
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Nehru and his "forward"policy caused that trouble

qgg3v3063.jpg
 
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We learnt from our failure and created miracle in 65 and 71.

Really a miracle?

You tied in 65 and took an easy victory on 71.
How low is your confidence that you consider those two a miracle when Pakistan is 7x smaller then you?

It's like Micheal Jordan saying it was a miracle when he beat you in basketball.
 
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1962 war tried to wake up Nehru with heavy punch: China daily
PTI | Jun 29, 2012, 06.19AM IST


Truly insightful, if it is truthful. Could be the reason why Indian documents pertaining to the war are still sealed. Does anyone know of the geopolitical ground realities at that time period?
 
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Really a miracle?

You tied in 65 and took an easy victory on 71.
How low is your confidence that you consider those two a miracle when Pakistan is 7x smaller then you?

It's like Micheal Jordan saying it was a miracle when he beat you in basketball.

Pakistan had better equipped army in 65 by grace US weapons although your general declared fake victory after the failure of Operation Gibraltar. 71 was a miracle indeed because China, United States, Arab League all were against India but couldn't do anything to help Pakistan.
 
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Really a miracle?

You tied in 65 and took an easy victory on 71.
How low is your confidence that you consider those two a miracle when Pakistan is 7x smaller then you?

It's like Micheal Jordan saying it was a miracle when he beat you in basketball.

65 was a victory...........

Neutral assessments

There have been several neutral assessments of the losses incurred by both India and Pakistan during the war. Most of these assessments agree that India had a upper hand over Pakistan when ceasefire was declared. Some of the neutral assessments are mentioned below —

According to the Library of Congress Country Studies conducted by the Federal Research Division of the United States[76] –

The war was militarily inconclusive; each side held prisoners and some territory belonging to the other. Losses were relatively heavy—on the Pakistani side, twenty aircraft, 200 tanks, and 3,800 troops. Pakistan's army had been able to withstand Indian pressure, but a continuation of the fighting would only have led to further losses and ultimate defeat for Pakistan. Most Pakistanis, schooled in the belief of their own martial prowess, refused to accept the possibility of their country's military defeat by "Hindu India" and were, instead, quick to blame their failure to attain their military aims on what they considered to be the ineptitude of Ayub Khan and his government.

TIME magazine reported that India held 690 mi2 of Pakistan territory while Pakistan held 250 mi2 of Indian territory in Kashmir and Rajasthan. Additionally, Pakistan had lost almost half its armour temporarily.[77] The article further elaborates,

Severely mauled by the larger Indian armed forces, Pakistan could continue the fight only by teaming up with Red China and turning its back on the U.N.

Devin T. Hagerty wrote in his book "South Asia in world politics"[78] –

The invading Indian forces outfought their Pakistani counterparts and halted their attack on the outskirts of Lahore, Pakistan's second-largest city. By the time United Nations intervened on September 22, Pakistan had suffered a clear defeat.

In his book "National identity and geopolitical visions",[79] Gertjan Dijkink writes –

The superior Indian forces, however, won a decisive victory and the army could have even marched on into Pakistani territory had external pressure not forced both combatants to cease their war efforts.

An excerpt from Stanley Wolpert's India,[80] summarizing the Indo-Pakistani War of 1965,

In three weeks the second Indo-Pak War ended in what appeared to be a draw when the embargo placed by Washington on U.S. ammunition and replacements for both armies forced cessation of conflict before either side won a clear victory. India, however, was in a position to inflict grave damage to, if not capture, Pakistan's capital of the Punjab when the cease-fire was called, and controlled Kashmir's strategic Uri-Poonch bulge, much to Ayub's chagrin.

In his book titled The greater game: India's race with destiny and China, David Van Praagh wrote[7] –

India won the war. It gained 1,840 km2 (710 sq mi) of Pakistani territory: 640 km2 (250 sq mi) in Azad Kashmir, Pakistan's portion of the state; 460 km2 (180 sq mi) of the Sailkot sector; 380 km2 (150 sq mi) far to the south of Sindh; and most critical, 360 km2 (140 sq mi) on the Lahore front. Pakistan took 540 km2 (210 sq mi) of Indian territory: 490 km2 (190 sq mi) in the Chhamb sector and 50 km2 (19 sq mi) around Khem Karan.

Dennis Kux's "India and the United States estranged democracies" also provides a summary of the war,[81]

Although both sides lost heavily in men and material, and neither gained a decisive military advantage, India had the better of the war. New Delhi achieved its basic goal of thwarting Pakistan's attempt to seize Kashmir by force. Pakistan gained nothing from a conflict which it had instigated.

BBC reported that the war served game changer in Pakistani politics,[82]

The defeat in the 1965 war led to the army's invincibility being challenged by an increasingly vocal opposition. This became a surge after his protege, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto, deserted him and established the Pakistan People's Party.

"A region in turmoil: South Asian conflicts since 1947" by Robert Johnson mentions[8] –

India's strategic aims were modest – it aimed to deny Pakistani Army victory, although it ended up in possession of 720 square miles (1,900 km2) of Pakistani territory for the loss of just 220 square miles (570 km2) of its own.

An excerpt from William M. Carpenter and David G. Wiencek's "Asian security handbook: terrorism and the new security environment"[83] –

A brief but furious 1965 war with India began with a covert Pakistani thrust across the Kashmiri cease-fire line and ended up with the city of Lahore threatened with encirclement by Indian Army. Another UN-sponsored cease-fire left borders unchanged, but Pakistan's vulnerability had again been exposed.

English historian John Keay's "India: A History" provides a summary of the 1965 war[84] –

The 1965 Indo-Pak war lasted barely a month. Pakistan made gains in the Rajasthan desert but its main push against India's Jammu-Srinagar road link was repulsed and Indian tanks advanced to within a sight of Lahore. Both sides claimed victory but India had most to celebrate.

Uk Heo and Shale Asher Horowitz write in their book "Conflict in Asia: Korea, China-Taiwan, and India-Pakistan"[85] –

Again India appeared, logistically at least, to be in a superior position but neither side was able to mobilize enough strength to gain a decisive victory.


Newsweek magazine, however, praised the Pakistani military's ability to hold of the much larger Indian Army.[86]

By just the end of the week, in fact, it was clear that the Pakistanis were more than holding their own.
 
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Thimayya was also concerned about the antiquity of the arms his men carried. Our army men were still relying on the old .303 enfield rifle, a first world war gun, and a classic junk in the 60's.

Thimayya suggested that India must start to manufacture a Belgian automatic rifle under license ( I Don't remember what type , Sorry guys ). Krishna Menon rejected it and said that he was not going to have NATO arms in the country.

Weapons was not major factor in 1962 war.

The grave concern was about troops.

Out of the 12,000 dispatched only 800 were suitable to fight in mountains, not surprising lot many of them succumbed to pulmonary edema and high altitude sickness.
 
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Really a miracle?

You tied in 65 and took an easy victory on 71.
How low is your confidence that you consider those two a miracle when Pakistan is 7x smaller then you?

It's like Micheal Jordan saying it was a miracle when he beat you in basketball.

Pakistan became 7x smaller than India after 1971.
 
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Truly insightful, if it is truthful. Could be the reason why Indian documents pertaining to the war are still sealed. Does anyone know of the geopolitical ground realities at that time period?

a. The forward policy of Nehru was downright retarded. It involved setting up forward posts in territory claimed by both India and China.

b. China did the same - so there were Indian posts in China and Chinese posts in India - bizarrely encircling each other.

c. In the late 1950s Nehru stormed out of weapons presentation in UK by an Arms company in UK chiding them for making such destructive weapons. The presentation was to sell weapons to India.

d. Soviet Union whose support India counted on did not support India saying "India is a friend; China is a brother."

e. Kennedy saved India. SU and USA were involved in Cuban Missile Crisis - Kennedy sent military aid to India and that scared the Chinese into trudging back home.
 
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That lame fvuk Nehru said something preposterous... "why do we need an army when we have a well equipped police force" ROFLMAO !!

He was progressively reducing the strength of IA and it did came down from 1950 levels by early 60s..

He deserved a spank and he got one :tup:

Yes, according to him UN would have been enough to solve all the world's problems. So yes, he deserved that spanking for his delusions and got one and was heartbroken, which speeded up his demise. He never got over the deaths of the jawans on the Himalayan mountains . When Lata Mangeshkar sang "O mere watan ke lokon", Nehru who was in the audience wept.
 
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Really a miracle?

You tied in 65 and took an easy victory on 71.
How low is your confidence that you consider those two a miracle when Pakistan is 7x smaller then you?

It's like Micheal Jordan saying it was a miracle when he beat you in basketball.

1965 was indeed a great victory for India when Pakistan's operation Gibraltar in Kashmir failed and Pakistan had to end up defending its mainland instead and retreat from Kashmir .
 
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