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1600 women killed in 2013 in Pakistan

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we also have sense.. clearly knows your true intentions.. reality is an indian posted the article and you countered it..
You know my intentions? Really? Are you GOD? because as for us Muslims it is clear Only God knows our intentions...

Secondly had an Indian poster put that up you would have thanked him...for being unbiased and showing a neutral post!

unlike new india, in your country majority of crimes against women are not reprted because of your social envionment.
Do you want me to counter this with articles? Nice bait! I am sorry you literally choke on unbiased articles! Even if an Indian wrote it! :tup:
so the comparison is not possible btw india and pak... for example read about the great your HUDOOD ordanance which was the rape law upto 2006... barbarian law in 21st century.. still the social conditions are same in your islamic country... so dont compare with us..
I dont expect you to understand Islam and what people do...so believe what you want!

Under hadd, "at least four Muslim adult male
witnesses, about whom the court is satisfied,
having regard to the requirements of tazkiyah al-
shuhood
, that they are truthful persons and
abstain from major sins (kabair), give evidence as
eye-witnesses of the act of penetration necessary
to the offence."
I am not sure if you have managed to read what you copied and pasted....Do you think people rape in open daylight and watch for the act of penetration to become witness? And do you think once they have watched this "evil" and not stopped it they dont get punishment...Nothing is very wrong with this law except how it was implicated!
Meaning this was/ is the law of how to prove an accused woman of adultery and also fornication not rape...hence the implication of the said law is wrong...But out Mullah like you ...who claim to know the universe but dont know the basics got this jargon in their heads...But I dont expect mr know it all to understand it..so spew out your hatred and walk away!

No case could be proven under hadd due to the
above stringent stipulation.
Punishments until now were awarded under the
Tazir provision of the Hudood Ordinance.
Ok now that you have spewed your crap and insulted yourself let me show you what that Hudood Ordinance really was:

The Offence of Zina (Enforcement of Hudood) Ordinance (VII of 1979)[edit]
The Offence of Zina (Enforcement of Hudood) Ordinance 1979 described the offences of Zina(fornication and adultery) and zina bil jabbar (rape). They were defined separately in the Ordinance. Prior to the Women Protection (Criminal Laws Amendment) Act 2006, the Hudood Ordinance provided for two kinds of punishments: punishments under hadd under its section 8 or under Tazir under section 10.

Under hadd, "at least four Muslim adult male witnesses, about whom the court is satisfied, having regard to the requirements of tazkiyah al-shuhood, that they are truthful persons and abstain from major sins (kabair), give evidence as eye-witnesses of the act of penetration necessary to the offence."

No case could be proven under hadd due to the above stringent stipulation.

Punishments until now were awarded under the Tazir provision of the Hudood Ordinance.

The 2006 Act has now totally deleted zina bil jabbar from the Hudood Ordinance and inserted sections 375 and 376 for Rape and Punishment respectively in the PPC to replace it

The Offence of Qazf (Enforcement of Hudood) Ordinance (VIII of 1979)[edit]
The Offence of Qazf (Enforcement of Hudood) Ordinance of 1979 described the offence of false accusation of Zina (fornication and adultery).

Why did you hide the original? Where the word Zina is written and the bit that in 2006 the whole law on rape was totally deleted so rape victims need not provide 4 witness...but you claiming to know everything should have known this, right? Maybe the 5 people who thanked you are the same as you twisting facts and hiding the truth! No wonder you were offended by what I posted!

that is A woman alleging rape is required
to provide four adult male eyewitnesses. In
principal, the failure to find such proof of the rape
does not place the woman herself at risk of
prosecution. According to a report by the National Commission
on Status of Women(NCSW) "an estimated 80% of
women" in jail in 2003 were there as because
"they had failed to prove rape charges and were
consequently convicted of adultery."
According to the National Commission for the
Status of Women (NCSW) and Amnesty
International in Asia and the Pacific, 88% of the
female prisoners are in jail as a direct
consequence of the Hudood Ordinance on adultery
(including both those awaiting trial and those
convicted). According to According to the National Commission for the
Status of Women (NCSW) and Amnesty
International in Asia and the Pacific, 88% of the
female prisoners are in jail as a direct
consequence of the Hudood Ordinance on adultery
(including both those awaiting trial and those
convicted).. according to statistics compiled
by the Society for Advancement of Community
Health Education and Training (SACHET) and
Lawyers for Human Rights and Legal Aid (LHRLA)
Team for Karachi Women Prison, in 2003-2004,
7000 women and children are languishing in 75
jails in extremely poor conditions. compiled
by the Society for Advancement of Community
Health Education and Training (SACHET) and
Lawyers for Human Rights and Legal Aid (LHRLA)
Team for Karachi Women Prison, in 2003-2004,
7000 women and children are languishing in 75
jails in extremely poor conditions.
I already answered this

1) implementation of the Islamic law was wrong due to Mullahs like you who know nothing but scream the loudest!

2) that in 2006 the rape law was dropped off...


Now please go bury your face for being a liar!

You said that You have discussed, how come I'll find that?
Because unlike PDF Indians I dont keep tab of what I discuss to be used in another thread! Thats your specialty! :coffee: I discuss and let the topic die on the same thread...I dont drag it around...
 
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Surprisingly you didnt post your side of the story:

OP-ED: Honour Killings – India’s Crying Shame
By Nupur Basu

Nupur Basu is a senior journalist, media educator and award-winning documentary film-maker. Her five independent documentaries include "No Country for Young Girls".

DOHA, Nov 30 2013 (IPS) - According to statistics from the United Nations, one in five cases a year of honour killings internationally comes from India. Of the 5000 cases reported internationally, 1000 are from India. Non-governmental organisations put the number at four times this figure. They claim it is around 20,000 cases globally every year.

While traditionally occurring in villages and smaller towns in India, honour killings have been on the rise and are reported sporadically in the media. The double murder of a 14-year-old school girl and a 50-year-old domestic in a New Delhi suburb with its honour killing subtext has received unprecedented attention, and is perhaps urban India’s most hyped alleged honour killing.

Although the Talwars, the parents of the girl, were charged with the murders of their daughter Aarushi and their domestic help Hemraj, the ‘motive’ for the murders was attributed to honour killing. Special Central Bureau Judge Shyam Lal, while convicting the parents earlier this week, said the dentist couple had found their daughter and the help in an “objectionable position”.

The judgement, based on circumstantial evidence, has however left many unconvinced. But irrespective of what the truth is, the Aarushi case has shone the spotlight on honour killings.

“The social moorings of this case and its ramifications on India’s middle class could not have been lost on anyone,” observed Anubha Bhonsle, an anchor for CNN-IBN, in one of her programmes.

However, if the judiciary, through this verdict, is trying to drive home the message that there will be zero tolerance for honour killings regardless of how powerful the perpetrators are, the question that will come up is whether the courts will apply the same rigour in some of the most gruesome cases of honour killings taking place in rural India, far from the gaze of television cameras.

Cases piling up

Some grisly cases that have been reported in the media in recent times from different regions in the country include that of 23-year-old Dharmender Barak and 18-year-old Nidhi Barak, who paid a heavy price for defying their families and falling in love.
The couple, from a village in Rohtak district in the northern state of Haryana, were tortured, mutilated and killed in public view by the girl’s father and their relatives when they tried to elope. A friend the couple had confided in leaked their plans to the girl’s parents, who lured them back with assurances, only to allegedly kill them in the cruelest manner. The police are treating the double murder as an honour crime.

In September 2013, the Haryana police arrested a police sub-inspector in connection with the killing of a 19-year-old girl from Panipat. Meenakshi had eloped with her boyfriend and the cop had tracked her down and handed her over to her family, who then allegedly murdered her.

On Oct. 24, 2013, in another case from Haryana, a 15-year-old Muslim girl from Muzaffarnagar was banished to her uncle’s house to prevent her from seeing the boy she was in love with. Her uncle allegedly murdered her and buried her in Panchkula District.

While cases of honour killings continue to pile up, convictions are few and far between.

In July 2013, Arun Bandu Irkal from Yerwada in the western state of Maharashtra was served with a life sentence. In 2002, the accused had reportedly stabbed his 17-year-old daughter Yashodha 48 times with a pair of scissors for having an affair with a boy from another caste. She did not survive the attack.

The accused surrendered, then skipped bail and was finally re-arrested in 2011. The court convicted him this year for murdering his daughter. The court said “honour” was the motive behind the murder.

On Nov. 1, 2013, in Bhopal in the central state of Madhya Pradesh, a lower court announced a life term for 10 men in a case of honour killing. The men were accused of killing Amar Singh, the elder brother of Sawar Singh, who had allegedly eloped with Hema, the wife of Balbir Singh, one of the accused men.

The men went to Amar Singh’s house, questioned him about the couple’s whereabouts and then poured kerosene on him and set him on fire. He died of the burns.

New discourse

All these cases have led to a new discourse on legislation. Does India acutely need separate legislation on honour killings? A proposal to that effect has been made by a study carried out for the U.N. Population Fund (UNFPA) on gender laws.

Voices have also been raised to rein in the ‘khap panchayats’ or self-elected village councils made up of male village elders who perpetuate values that, in turn, covertly endorse these killings in the name of saving “the family’s honour”.

Like the Taliban in Pakistan and Afghanistan, the khaps have attained notoriety by issuing diktats on dress code for women and demanding a ban on the use of cell phones by young girls and women.

In both rural and middle-class urban India, the onus for upholding family morality falls on the women in the family – the daughter, daughter-in-law, wife and mother. By daring to choose a life partner other than the one selected for her by her family, or by committing adultery, she violates the family’s honour. Both she and her lover can face death as a consequence.

Recently, a group of khap panchayats filed a document before the country’s highest court saying they had been wrongly charged for encouraging honour killings in rural India. Earlier, a women’s rights group, Shakti Vahini, had petitioned the Supreme Court to instruct the government to be more proactive when honour killings are carried out.

They blamed the khap panchayats for endorsing patriarchy, which they said reinforced the subjugation of women in society and the resultant honour killings.

Retribution for bringing shame

The court summoned 67 representatives of the khap panchayats to explain their role in honour killings. The representatives submitted a written reply, saying the responsibility for such killings did not lie with them but with the families who failed to prevent their daughters and sisters and wives from interacting with men, which resulted in shame and ostracism by the community.

They argued that women who feared their male relatives never committed such acts and therefore never had to face such consequences. In short, the khap panchayat representatives overtly defended honour killings.

But the problem of honour killings goes well beyond the shores of rural and urban India. They are common in Pakistan and Afghanistan, and Bangladesh also has honour killings or assaults in the form of ‘acid attacks’.

Acid attacks, torture, abductions and mutilations all come under this category of crime.

The problem is that in most countries, there is confusion about the definition of what constitutes an honour killing. This confusion often results in the victim failing to get justice. Many families report these killings as suicides and escape punishment under the law, according to international human rights and women’s groups.

According to U.N. statistics, the United Kingdom has 12 cases of honour killings every year, the majority of them among the Asian diaspora. Will countries abroad also have to legislate on honour killings if South Asian and West Asian men carry their patriarchy to foreign shores and murder women who break so-called “cultural norms”?

This year’s Emmy award for best documentary went to a film on honour killings in the UK. Banaz: A Love Story, directed by Deeyah Khan, is about the honour killing in south London of 20-year-old Banaz Mahmod who was murdered by her family in 2006.

‘Cancer of patriachy’

Mahmod’s Iraqi Kurd father and relatives felt she had brought shame to her family and community by leaving her husband, who was abusive and an alleged rapist. Mahmod had fallen in love with another man and ended up paying with her life. She was raped, strangled to death and her body was put in a suitcase.

Her father and uncle now face life sentences in UK jails. Two other men, who had to be extradited from Iraq by Scotland Yard, are also serving prison terms, for 20 years. By making these arrests and convictions test cases, the judiciary and law enforcement authorities hope they can deter families from such criminal acts against their female family members.

A case was recently reported where, after a long battle with the Australian immigration and refugee authorities, a couple, a Sikh and a backward caste Hindu who had married secretly in India in 2007, were granted asylum in the country. The couple had said their lives would be in danger if they had to return to India as they feared honour killing for having defied the caste system.

Even as the dust settles on the verdict for the Talwars in Delhi, it will be a while before Indian society really begins to digest the cancer of patriarchy manifested through honour killings. Like all social evils, unless society shuns these practices, the police and judiciary alone cannot save women who want to break free from arranged and abusive marriages.

The views expressed in this article are the author’s own and do not necessarily reflect the editorial policy of Al Jazeera or IPS.

Published under an agreement with Al Jazeera.

OP-ED: Honour Killings - India's Crying Shame - Inter Press Service


@Oscar, how come warnings about not bringing in India into threads about Pakistan are mostly missing. unlike your recent threats about bans without warnings in the Muslims under Modi thread ?

Is this a one way street? Isn't that the definition of being biased what you normally accuse others of? :)
 
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@Oscar, how come warnings about not bringing in India into threads about Pakistan are mostly missing. unlike your recent threats about bans without warnings in the Muslims under Modi thread ?

Is this a one way street? Isn't that the definition of being biased what you normally accuse others of? :)
Cry foul mate....wonder who drags in Pakistan or more to the point Dacca in irrelevant threads and discussions.
@ topic, don't know what the OP is desperate to prove here, the menace of honour killing is not exactly exclusive to Pakistan, at one point India was leading in making such headlines and i doubt situation is any better now.

Religion and Child Abuse News: Honour killings in India estimated to be among the highest per capita in the world
 
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Cry foul mate....wonder who drags in Pakistan or more to the point Dacca in irrelevant threads and discussions.
@ topic, don't know what the OP is desperate to prove here, the menace of honour killing is not exactly exclusive to Pakistan, at one point India was leading in making such headlines and i doubt situation is any better now.

Religion and Child Abuse News: Honour killings in India estimated to be among the highest per capita in the world

My comment was on the bias shown by Oscar and not on this thread or the response there of ...And Dhaka was in response to Aksai Chin which you brought into the mix in your years old continued tradition of random unrelated posts with dated links and sometimes forged pictures, attempted at derailing the topic
 
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My comment was on the bias shown by Oscar and not on this thread or the response there of ...And Dhaka was in response to Aksai Chin..
So now you telling Admins/ Mods. how to run the show.
And i still wonder why Indians don't have a worthy forum to compete with something like Def.pk :coffee:
 
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So now you telling Admins/ Mods. how to run the show.
No.. just demonstrating that Admins are humans too.. Big deal..

And i still wonder why Indians don't have a worthy forum to compete with something like Def.pk :coffee:
Indians have a film industry that has a budget bigger than your army. Or an export industry bigger than your whole economy..What's your point ?
 
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No.. just demonstrating that Admins are humans too.. Big deal..
Not complaining.... Change of heart.;)
Indians have a film industry that has a budget bigger than your army. Or an export industry bigger than your whole economy..What's your point ?
Here we go the usual irrelevant banter and chest thumping......what next, 1971.... please carry on.:)
 
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Not complaining.... Change of heart.;)
Not at all.. Complaining makes sense when there are any chances of correction. Else, such demonstrating the flaw is enough

Here we go the usual irrelevant banter and chest thumping......what next, 1971.... please carry on.:)
Is it as irrelevant and boastful as boasting about the size of a Pakistani defense forum in a thread about honor killings in Pakistan ? Eh?
 
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Not at all.. Complaining makes sense when there are any chances of correction. Else, such demonstrating the flaw is enough
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Is it as irrelevant and boastful as boasting about the size of a Pakistani defense forum in a thread about honor killings in Pakistan ? Eh?

THE HOST. !!!
 
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no one care how many men killed see world is racist :cheesy:
 
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@Oscar, how come warnings about not bringing in India into threads about Pakistan are mostly missing. unlike your recent threats about bans without warnings in the Muslims under Modi thread ?

Is this a one way street? Isn't that the definition of being biased what you normally accuse others of? :)
Because like all Indians on PDF you didnt read the post...It has both India and the rest of the area and a little para about the rest of the world....Hence, a neutral post...So please go cry someplace else! Or learn to read so you wont insult yourself!
 
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Because unlike PDF Indians I dont keep tab of what I discuss to be used in another thread! Thats your specialty! :coffee: I discuss and let the topic die on the same thread...I dont drag it around...
Then you shouldn't tell me to find it, when you yourself don't have a clue about it. And if you do discuss and let die the topic, then what made you bring the post which is long discussed again here?:coffee:
 
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Enjoy democracy and reinstated judiciary!
 
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Then you shouldn't tell me to find it, when you yourself don't have a clue about it. And if you do discuss and let die the topic, then what made you bring the post which is long discussed again here?:coffee:
I never said I discussed the post...I have discussed the topic...Quit confusing yourself! And stop quoting me troll!
 
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