10 captives, Over 20 soldiers, including Commanding Officer killed at Galwan border clash with China

[Pakistani Fighter]

 

[xeuss]

@xeuss Can this be trusted?

I am out of touch of this now...

Here is how it breaks up:

1. MEA - We never crossed LAC into China. China crossed LAC into India.
2. Modi - We never crossed LAC into China. China never crossed LAC into India
3. MOD - We crossed LAC into China. China never crossed LAC into India.

 

[lonelyman]

Three separate brawls divided by time and space. Chinese troops who aren't normally deployed at Patrol Point 14. And, a young Indian Army team that took a decision to cross the Line of Actual Control (LAC) to square things up with the Chinese Army. The contours of the June 15 bloodletting have become cleared.

Plenty has been written so far about the clash between Indian and Chinese troops in Ladakh's Galwan Valley. But contradictory claims, and gaps in the narrative have so far left the story bereft of cohesiveness. Several questions have remained unanswered, with individual aspects lending themselves to speculation and guesswork. Now with a series of conversations with Army personnel in the Galwan Valley, Thangtse and Leh, India Today TV pieces together the most detailed account so far of how things played out.

The context is well known. Ten days prior, Lieutenant General-level talks had taken place and disengagement between both sides had begun at Patrol Point 14, since both had mobilised very close to the Line of Actual Control.

A Chinese observation post, which had been set up at the vertex of the bend in the Galwan River was proven, during talks, to be on the Indian side of the LAC, and an agreement had been reached to remove it. A few days after talks the post was dismantled by the Chinese. Commanding Officer of the 16 Bihar infantry battalion controlling the area Colonel B Santosh Babu even held talks with a counterpart Chinese officer on the day after the Chinese dismantled the camp.


But on June 14, the camp unexpectedly re-emerged overnight.

At around 5pm on June 15, while the sun was still very much up, Colonel Babu decided to personally lead a team to the camp. Having spoken just a few days prior with the other side, the Commanding Officer is said to have wondered whether there had been a mistake. While young officers and jawans were raring to remove the Chinese post themselves, Colonel Babu, known to be a highly sober, cool-headed officer who had in a previous stint also served as a company commander in the area, decided to personally go.

In normal course, a Company Commander (Major rank) would probably have been sent to check. But Colonel Babu decided not to leave it to 'youngsters' in the unit. It is important to remember here that tempers were not up.

The young officers and jawans were simply motivated by the prospect of a task in a narrow river valley that has seen nearly no tactical disputes of any kind -- and where troops on either side have actually been quite friendly.

Col Santosh Babu, Commanding Officer of the 16 Bihar infantry battalion. (File photo)
At 7pm, Colonel Babu along with a team of about 35 men, including two Majors, proceeded on foot to the post. The mood in the team was not one of belligerence, but rather of inquiry. When they reached the Chinese camp, the first thing the Indian team noticed was that the Chinese troops didn't seem familiar -- they weren't the PLA troops normally deployed in the area.

The men of 16 Bihar had built familiarity with the Chinese unit, and had expected to run into troops and officers they already knew. The fresh faces was the first surprise. It has been assessed during a debrief that the 'new' Chinese troops at the offending post were from a pool freshly diverted from a PLA exercise in Tibet in the second half of May.

The men of 16 Bihar had received word at the time about the arrival of the 'new' PLA troops, but it was clear they were restricted to the 'depth' areas deep on their side of the LAC.

These 'new' Chinese troops were immediately belligerent once the Indian team arrived. When Colonel Babu opened the conversation, asking why the post had been re-erected, a Chinese soldier stepped up and pushed the Indian Colonel backwards hard, with expletives in the Chinese language.

In an Army unit, as several voices have since articulated, seeing your Commanding Officer disrespected and assaulted thus is equivalent to seeing your parents physically abused. The reaction was instant. The Indian team pounced on the Chinese. The fight strictly was a proper fist-fight with no melee weapons of any kind. This was the first brawl and ended about 30 minutes later with injuries on both sides, but the Indian team prevailing.

They rounded off the sparring by smashing and then burning the Chinese post to ashes. The pushing of their Commanding Officer had already crossed a very dangerous red line.


Once this was done, Colonel Babu, earlier an instructor at the National Defence Academy, is said to have figured that the presence of these 'new' Chinese troops and the totally unexpected 'first punch' by a young Chinese soldier pointed to something bigger possibly afoot. Therefore, he sent the injured men back to the Indian post and asked them to send back more men. Tempers were understandably high at this time, but Colonel Babu is said to have still calmed his men.

The 'new' Chinese troops who had been overpowered, were forcibly taken by Colonel Babu back across the LAC. The Indian team not only wanted to deposit the encroachers back on their side, but also inspect whether there was more coming.

The events of the previous few hours had set tactical alarm bells ringing and didn't seem like a stray occurrence. It is also possible that they witnessed some movement on the Chinese side. Either way, the crossing of the Indian team into the Chinese side would spark the second phase of the fight a full hour later.

It was in this second brawl that most of the casualties would be inflicted.

"The boys were angry and aggressive. You can imagine how much they wanted to teach a lesson to the aggressors," an Army officer deployed near the Shyok-Galwan confluence a few kilometres from the brawl point told India Today TV.

It was dark by this time, and visibility had plummeted. What Colonel Babu suspected was correct. More Chinese troops, of the 'new' kind, were waiting in positions both on the banks of the Galwan as well as in positions up on a ridge to the right. Almost as soon as they arrived, large stones began to land.

At about 9pm, Colonel Babu was struck on the head by a large stone, and he fell into the Galwan River. The assessment is that it may not have been a targeted attack on the Colonel, but in the flurry, he was struck.

This second brawl lasted nearly 45 minutes, and it is during this fearsome exchange that the bodies piled up. A crucial aspect of brawl No. 2 is that the fighting spread into several different pockets across the LAC. While some have imagined it to be one big crowd of men fighting each other like a mob, the brawl actually separated into different groups, with nearly 300 men fighting each other. When the fighting stopped, several bodies of both Indian and Chinese troops were in the river, including the Indian Commanding Officer.

With energy fully spent by nearly an hour of vicious hand-to-hand fighting, including the use of metal spiked clubs by the Chinese and barbed-wire wrapped rods, the two sides disengaged and things fell quiet. Things quietened down for an hour till about 11pm giving troops on both sides time to recover bodies.


Colonel Babu's body and those of some of the other jawans were carried back to the Indian side, while the rest of the Indian team remained on the Chinese side taking stock of the situation. It had been brutally established that their Commanding Officer's suspicions had been proven correct. And with him killed in front of them, things were at an emotional peak.

During the recovery of bodies, and amidst the groan of injured personnel in the darkness, the Indian side heard the unmistakable hum of a quadcopter drone, something infantrymen are very attuned to in today's battlefield. This was an immediate trigger for what would lead to the third brawl. The drone was slowly moving through the valley, possibly using night vision or infrared cameras to map the damage and mount another assault on survivors.

Backup requested arrived in large numbers, including Ghatak platoons from both the 16 Bihar as well as 3 Punjab Regiment. Every infantry battalion has Ghatak platoons that lead attacks and function as 'shock troops'.
As suspected, the Chinese side had done the same. While the Indian reinforcements arrived, the Indian team stepped deeper into the Chinese side, wanting to ensure they didn't let large numbers of aggressive Chinese troops get close to the LAC.

The third phase of the brawl began shortly after 11pm and would continue with sporadic intensity till well past midnight fully on the Chinese side. Troop groups would continue fighting along the ridgelines moving up towards the right, with the intensity of the fisticuffs leading to many men on both sides plunging into the narrow Galwan river, some injuring themselves on rocks while falling. Earthworks by the Chinese on the banks of the Galwan and adjoining flanks of earth is said to have played a part in this.

With energy completely spent after five hours of fighting since the incident began, things finally fell silent. Indian and Chinese combat medics arrived to move their dead and injured. The remains of soldiers on both sides were exchanged in the darkness. The physical separation of the fighting groups finally led to 10 Indian men -- 2 Majors, 2 Captains and 6 jawans -- being held back the Chinese side even after the disengagement. And it is here that the sequence begins to blur.

Former Army chief and current minister General VK Singh has come in record in media interviews to suggest that the Chinese casualties were more than double the 20 that the Indian Army suffered. India Today TV has learnt that the tactical debrief on the ground -- a kind of First Information Report on the incident -- records 16 Chinese Army bodies handed back to the Chinese side after brawl No.3, including 5 officers. The debrief report does not specify if the Chinese Commanding Officer of the unit was among these five.

The 16 were Chinese Army men confirmed dead on the battlefield. It is speculated that many more of the injured Chinese -- as with the 17 Indian men who perished the following day -- may have died of their injuries later, though there remains no categorical confirmation of this, nor is there likely to be.

General Singh has also hinted at an exchange of men after the incident. This too has been borne out from ground reports, with top Army sources clarifying to India Today TV that it wasn't a 'prisoner exchange'.

In the chaotic melee that was brawl No.3, the disengagement in the darkness led to several injured men from both sides remaining with the other.

By dawn on June 16, the Indian troops withdrew back across the LAC, after judging that many were still missing. Men on the ground say this wasn't a 'captivity' or 'prisoner' situation, since these were all injured men. When the sun rose, the situation was handed over to Major Generals on both sides, and talks hinged on the modalities of the exchange.

It is testament to the shock of the incident still sinking in that it would take a further three days for the troops on both sides to be sent back to their respective sides.
"It was not a captivity situation. We were providing medical treatment to their men. And they were treating our men," a top Army official tells India Today TV.

The tactical debrief report also records the 16 Bihar's assessment that the Chinese troops involved in the brawl were not the regular unit deployed on the frontlines of the LAC and involved in multiple rounds of talks previously. The assessment is that this was by design, possibly a use of more 'aggressive', less situationally acclimatised troops to spearhead an aggressive action at the Galwan Valley, with a possible larger intent to capture Indian crossover points, culverts and bridges on the Galwan on the track leading up to the Shyok River to the west.

16 Bihar has been no stranger to the Chinese. During the 2017 Doklam standoff, the unit was in reserve in depth areas, even conducing reconnaissance operations for forward deployed troops.

In the Galwan Valley, the unit had been fully acclimatised for a couple of years and had developed a well-rounded rapport with men on the Chinese side. The shock of the Chinese aggression and sequence of events therefore went beyond the immediate tactical comprehension of troops on the ground.

The loss of Colonel Babu was a blow to the unit. A unit officer cleared for promotion previously has now taken over as Commanding Officer of 16 Bihar. The situation is markedly calmer now at Patrol Poing 14, with the disengagement process at Galwan hopefully expected to make progress.

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/sto...utal-june-15-galwan-battle-1691185-2020-06-21

every day, India media came up with a new version

PLA dead 5 ->34 -> 43 -> 102 -> 20 -> 16

I am sure they will not settle on 16

 

[Armchair]

India has finally outdone itself.

 

[GamoAccu]

Which Indian media is telling the story?
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...-14-in-galwan-valley/articleshow/76492594.cms

Serious question: What is the most credible news media in India?

 

[siegecrossbow]

5 -> 34 -> 43 -> 102 -> 20

what did I say? everyday you will have a new version of what happened.

https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/news/post-galwan-battle-chinese-soldiers-
state-panic#.Xu9tzdPd0ZV.twitter

New Delhi: The psychological evaluation and other related tests done on Indian Army officers and jawans who were in the custody of China’s People’s Liberation Army (PLA) for at least 60 hours, if not more, have given significant insights into the minds of Chinese soldiers who were a part of the action in the Galwan Valley that took place on 15 June.

These 10 men, who include two Majors and two Captains, were in “surprisingly” high spirits and upbeat even after spending more than two days in the custody of China’s People’s Liberation Army.

Inputs accessed by The Sunday Guardian post the debriefing of these 10 men, revealed that the outnumbered and “unarmed” (as the rules required them to be) Indian troops, rather than retreating in view of the huge number of Chinese soldiers, grabbed the improvised clubs and rods that the Chinese were using to batter Indian soldiers, and used the same to kill “at least” 20 Chinese soldiers and officers at patrol point 14.

“This was one reason for the high morale of our troops who came back to us on Thursday. Our men were captured after they chased the Chinese into their area of domination, with the intention to kill them after hearing of the loss of their CO, Colonel Santosh Babu. The Chinese soldiers, seeing the unexpected attack from our men, started fleeing and running back to their area and were followed by our men, who were then captured”, the official stated.

The debriefing of the 10 men has also revealed that the Chinese soldiers were in a state of shock and fear after the Indian soldiers replied with “sheer fighting force” to the treacherous attack by the Chinese. During the next 60 plus hours, the Chinese soldiers were highly anxious about a possible retribution from the Indian side and were in “panic-mode”. “They (Chinese soldiers) were very scared during the time our men were in their captivity. They had witnessed raw fighting spirit just hours before, as executed by a few of our men and the Chinese soldiers were anticipating the same treatment from a much larger number of our men in the next few hours”, said an official source, who is aware of the findings of the debriefing.

According to intelligence agency sources, there was a lot of resentment on Chinese social media platforms such as Weibo over what happened to the PLA men who lost their lives on the night of 15 June. “People are sharing pictures of the funeral procession of Indian soldiers and their cremation which was done with full state honours, and are asking what happened to their own men. Not a single information has been released identifying the names and ranks of the PLA men who died on 15 and 16 June. This is causing a lot of discussions on local social media platforms”, the official added.

These revelations have confirmed the much talked about military hypothesis that the Chinese army, which has not been engaged in any real military operation that involves real opponents—and not just simulated war games which China does “loudly” for the entire world to notice—is more than likely to falter in real battlefields because they do not have any experience of what happens during a real war. “They, for the first time, on the night of 15 June, came across the real face of the Indian Army, which despite being outnumbered, inflicted fatalities on their opponents. The Chinese soldiers were horrified by what they saw”, said the official quoting a portion of the debriefing session. Troops in India and the United States, on the contrary, have been engaged in real wars and battles for decades now.

Schrodinger’s casualties.

 

[GamoAccu]

Schrodinger’s casualties.

 

[Flight of falcon]

Indians have fired all their journalists and have hired Bollywood scrip writers to tell the REAL story .....

Very soon you will hear about the item dance number in their story too...

 

[HalfMoon]

Which Indian media is telling the story?
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...-14-in-galwan-valley/articleshow/76492594.cms

Serious question: What is the most credible news media in India?

None

 

[H. Dawary]

Indian generals are probably freaking out right now with latest developments, but India I believe has the advantage since they are on the defensive. The aggressors must continually continue his aggression otherwise he will lose momentum, the defender simply needs to bide his time and wait for a counterattack.

Note I am just an arm chair general, but the principles of defence is to wait for the enemy to exert its resources and then counter attack, although with a state like China there resources are immense, so lets see how India will respond in coming months.

 

[GamoAccu]

Latest Indians claim:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1274116214495854592

 

[siegecrossbow]

View attachment 643555

You’d think that their media would write separate articles on events as momentous as handing back Chinese bodies or releasing Chinese prisoners. Where are those? Are they trying to help the CcP save face ?

 

[GamoAccu]

You’d think that their media would write separate articles on events as momentous as handing back Chinese bodies or releasing Chinese prisoners. Where are those? Are they trying to help the CcP save face ?

I think they are trying to fool people that they are a British or Foreign news media

 

[siegecrossbow]

Latest Indians claim:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1274116214495854592

Why are Indian troops wearing white t-shirts?

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Why are Indian troops wearing white t-shirts?

Easy to make surrender flags rather than take a bat on the face & become batman.. or batman (servant).