Why is Saudi Arabia looking to China to buy weapons after years of arms deals with the US?

[dani191]

Explainer |
Why is Saudi Arabia looking to China to buy weapons after years of arms deals with the US?​

• Chinese media reported Saudi Arabia bought US$4 billion weapons after the Zhuhai Air Show in November, a much bigger sale than previous deals
• The Yemen war, journalist Jamal Khashoggi’s murder and the Opec+ decision to cut oil output by 2 million barrels a day have affected US-Saudi defence deals

Kawala Xie
+ myNEWS
Published: 12:00pm, 8 Dec, 2022


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China’s CH-4 drone was reportedly the most sold item to Saudi Arabia during the Zhuhai Air Show, although neither party has confirmed a deal. They have been used in major battlefields in the Yemen war. Photo: Simon Song
As the world’s largest defence spender, Saudi Arabia has sourced weapons from a variety of countries and in the past has imported mostly from the US.
But amid increased tension with Washington in recent years following the death of journalist Jamal Khashoggi in 2018 and in light of the recent Opec+ oil dispute, Riyadh is actively looking to diversify its weapon sources, with China now considered a top alternative.
Chinese media recently reported that Saudi Arabia bought US$4 billion worth of weapons after the Zhuhai Air Show in November, a sale much larger than their previous arms deal, according to observers.

02:13
Chinese drones among new military aircraft highlighted at Zhuhai Airshow

Chinese drones among new military aircraft highlighted at Zhuhai Airshow​

The arms trade between China and Saudi Arabia dates back to the late 1980s, after the two countries held their first official meetings in 1985. They officially established ties in 1990.


The number of arms deals on the public record is not significant, and they were mostly drones, a category for which China has gained an international reputation for great performance at a fair price.
Here, we explain the types of weapons that Saudi Arabia has bought from both China and the US in the past, their uses, and Riyadh’s potential future interest in Chinese weapons.

What weapons does Saudi Arabia buy from China?​

According to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute, Saudi Arabia’s first known arms deal with China, and so far the only public missile purchase, was the DF-3 medium-range nuclear missiles it bought in 1986. Saudi Arabia bought 50 DF-3 missiles with conventional warheads.

Riyadh since bought 54 PLZ-45 self-propelled guns in 2007, five CH-4B drones in 2014 and more than 30 Wing Loong-1 and 2 armed unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) in 2014 and 2017.
The CH-4 armed reconnaissance drones have been used in major battlefields in the Yemen war and also recently by the Pakistani forces to fight militants in Balochistan. It was reportedly the most sold item – up to 300 – to Saudi Arabia during the Zhuhai Air Show, although the deal has not been confirmed by Riyadh or Beijing.
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The Wing Loong UAV, a medium-attitude, long-endurance drone that can also be armed with missiles. Its third generation, an intercontinental drone that can fly 10,000km, made its debut at the Zhuhai show this year.

Is Xi Jinping’s trip to Saudi Arabia another step in SCO’s expansion?
5 Dec 2022
​

The reported order at the Zhuhai Air Show also included a production line of TB001 UAVs, also a medium-altitude, long-endurance combat drone that the PLA started to use on patrols near Taiwan this year; YJ-21 anti-ship ballistic missiles, a carrier-based hypersonic missile with combat range of over 2,000km (1,200 miles); and the “Silent Hunter” anti-drone laser-based systems.

Besides sales on the public record, China reportedly secretly sold DF-21 missiles to Riyadh in 2007, with the CIA’s approval after finding the missiles were not nuclear-capable. Some observers say that compared with the DF-3, the DF-21 is much more accurate and is sometimes called a “carrier killer”.

US intelligence revealed last year that China had been helping Riyadh develop its own ballistic missiles at a site west of Riyadh.

What weapons does Saudi Arabia buy from the US?​

The US has been the biggest provider of arms to Saudi Arabia for years, and the weapons it provides include offensive and defensive weapons, and heavy weapons such as combat helicopters, missiles, frigates and guided bombs.

Despite tensions with the US after Joe Biden vowed to make Saudi Arabia a “pariah nation” following the death of Khashoggi and an awkward encounter between the US President and Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, Biden approved a US$3 billion deal to sell Patriot missiles to Riyadh in August.
Some 280 air-to-air missiles with a value of US$650 million were also sold to Riyadh in 2021.

How has the US restricted arm sales to Saudi Arabia?​

The US has continued sales of defensive weapons to Riyadh but has suspended sales of offensive weapons because of the Saudis’ actions in the Yemen war fought against Houthi forces since 2015. Former US president Barack Obama issued a similar suspension in 2016 after the war claimed massive civilian casualties.

The recent dispute over the Saudi-led Opec+ decision to cut oil output by 2 million barrels per day has frustrated the US due to the ripples it may cause in the US economy. Biden warned of “consequences” for Saudi Arabia following the decision, with calls from Congress to suspend arms sales to Riyadh for one year.

China unveils new combat drone described as a rival to US Army Grey Eagle​

What weapons might Saudi Arabia seek from China?​

Zhou Chenming, a military analyst at the Beijing-based Yuan Wang military science and technology think tank said China would be cautious for fear of triggering a “regional arms race”.

He said Saudi Arabia could be interested in land-based equipment from China – such as tanks, armoured vehicles and artillery – which had proven capabilities according to Pakistani soldiers reporting in Saudi Arabia. Long-range rocket artillery could be an option too, according to Zhou.
Referring to the rumoured sale of China’s J-10 fighter jets to Saudi Arabia, Zhou said it would be unlikely for at least the next few years while the Saudi Air Force was equipped with the US-made F-15 and F-16. He said the US might intervene to prevent such sales.

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18 Nov 2022
​

China was also reportedly looking to sell its twin-engined FC-31 stealth fighter jets to Saudi Arabia. The fifth-generation jets are often compared with US F-35 planes.
Tuvia Gering, a researcher at the Israel-China Policy Centre at the Institute for National Security Studies said Riyadh might be hesitant to buy “big ticket weapons” – combat helicopters, fighter jets, and air defence systems – however it might be interested in future weapon systems, such as underwater drones, AI tech, autonomous systems, swarm drones, surveillance, satellites, advanced lasers, supersonics and hypersonics.

Why is Saudi Arabia looking to China to buy weapons?

Riyadh looks elsewhere to buy arms after the Yemen war, journalist Jamal Khashoggi’s murder and the Opec+ decision to cut oil output by 2 million barrels a day affect US-Saudi defence deals.

www.scmp.com

 

[Horse_Rider]

Explainer |​

Why is Saudi Arabia looking to China to buy weapons after years of arms deals with the US?​

• Chinese media reported Saudi Arabia bought US$4 billion weapons after the Zhuhai Air Show in November, a much bigger sale than previous deals
• The Yemen war, journalist Jamal Khashoggi’s murder and the Opec+ decision to cut oil output by 2 million barrels a day have affected US-Saudi defence deals

Kawala Xie
+ myNEWS
Published: 12:00pm, 8 Dec, 2022


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157

6

China’s CH-4 drone was reportedly the most sold item to Saudi Arabia during the Zhuhai Air Show, although neither party has confirmed a deal. They have been used in major battlefields in the Yemen war. Photo: Simon Song
As the world’s largest defence spender, Saudi Arabia has sourced weapons from a variety of countries and in the past has imported mostly from the US.
But amid increased tension with Washington in recent years following the death of journalist Jamal Khashoggi in 2018 and in light of the recent Opec+ oil dispute, Riyadh is actively looking to diversify its weapon sources, with China now considered a top alternative.
Chinese media recently reported that Saudi Arabia bought US$4 billion worth of weapons after the Zhuhai Air Show in November, a sale much larger than their previous arms deal, according to observers.

02:13
Chinese drones among new military aircraft highlighted at Zhuhai Airshow

Chinese drones among new military aircraft highlighted at Zhuhai Airshow​

The arms trade between China and Saudi Arabia dates back to the late 1980s, after the two countries held their first official meetings in 1985. They officially established ties in 1990.


The number of arms deals on the public record is not significant, and they were mostly drones, a category for which China has gained an international reputation for great performance at a fair price.
Here, we explain the types of weapons that Saudi Arabia has bought from both China and the US in the past, their uses, and Riyadh’s potential future interest in Chinese weapons.

What weapons does Saudi Arabia buy from China?​

According to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute, Saudi Arabia’s first known arms deal with China, and so far the only public missile purchase, was the DF-3 medium-range nuclear missiles it bought in 1986. Saudi Arabia bought 50 DF-3 missiles with conventional warheads.

Riyadh since bought 54 PLZ-45 self-propelled guns in 2007, five CH-4B drones in 2014 and more than 30 Wing Loong-1 and 2 armed unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) in 2014 and 2017.
The CH-4 armed reconnaissance drones have been used in major battlefields in the Yemen war and also recently by the Pakistani forces to fight militants in Balochistan. It was reportedly the most sold item – up to 300 – to Saudi Arabia during the Zhuhai Air Show, although the deal has not been confirmed by Riyadh or Beijing.
EVERY SATURDAY

A weekly curated round-up of social, political and economic stories from China and how they impact the world.
GET THE NEWSLETTER
By registering, you agree to our T&C and Privacy Policy
The Wing Loong UAV, a medium-attitude, long-endurance drone that can also be armed with missiles. Its third generation, an intercontinental drone that can fly 10,000km, made its debut at the Zhuhai show this year.

Is Xi Jinping’s trip to Saudi Arabia another step in SCO’s expansion?​

5 Dec 2022​

​

The reported order at the Zhuhai Air Show also included a production line of TB001 UAVs, also a medium-altitude, long-endurance combat drone that the PLA started to use on patrols near Taiwan this year; YJ-21 anti-ship ballistic missiles, a carrier-based hypersonic missile with combat range of over 2,000km (1,200 miles); and the “Silent Hunter” anti-drone laser-based systems.

Besides sales on the public record, China reportedly secretly sold DF-21 missiles to Riyadh in 2007, with the CIA’s approval after finding the missiles were not nuclear-capable. Some observers say that compared with the DF-3, the DF-21 is much more accurate and is sometimes called a “carrier killer”.

US intelligence revealed last year that China had been helping Riyadh develop its own ballistic missiles at a site west of Riyadh.

What weapons does Saudi Arabia buy from the US?​

The US has been the biggest provider of arms to Saudi Arabia for years, and the weapons it provides include offensive and defensive weapons, and heavy weapons such as combat helicopters, missiles, frigates and guided bombs.

Despite tensions with the US after Joe Biden vowed to make Saudi Arabia a “pariah nation” following the death of Khashoggi and an awkward encounter between the US President and Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, Biden approved a US$3 billion deal to sell Patriot missiles to Riyadh in August.
Some 280 air-to-air missiles with a value of US$650 million were also sold to Riyadh in 2021.

How has the US restricted arm sales to Saudi Arabia?​

The US has continued sales of defensive weapons to Riyadh but has suspended sales of offensive weapons because of the Saudis’ actions in the Yemen war fought against Houthi forces since 2015. Former US president Barack Obama issued a similar suspension in 2016 after the war claimed massive civilian casualties.

The recent dispute over the Saudi-led Opec+ decision to cut oil output by 2 million barrels per day has frustrated the US due to the ripples it may cause in the US economy. Biden warned of “consequences” for Saudi Arabia following the decision, with calls from Congress to suspend arms sales to Riyadh for one year.

China unveils new combat drone described as a rival to US Army Grey Eagle​

What weapons might Saudi Arabia seek from China?​

Zhou Chenming, a military analyst at the Beijing-based Yuan Wang military science and technology think tank said China would be cautious for fear of triggering a “regional arms race”.

He said Saudi Arabia could be interested in land-based equipment from China – such as tanks, armoured vehicles and artillery – which had proven capabilities according to Pakistani soldiers reporting in Saudi Arabia. Long-range rocket artillery could be an option too, according to Zhou.
Referring to the rumoured sale of China’s J-10 fighter jets to Saudi Arabia, Zhou said it would be unlikely for at least the next few years while the Saudi Air Force was equipped with the US-made F-15 and F-16. He said the US might intervene to prevent such sales.

US protects Saudi prince from lawsuit over journalist Khashoggi murder​

18 Nov 2022​

​

China was also reportedly looking to sell its twin-engined FC-31 stealth fighter jets to Saudi Arabia. The fifth-generation jets are often compared with US F-35 planes.
Tuvia Gering, a researcher at the Israel-China Policy Centre at the Institute for National Security Studies said Riyadh might be hesitant to buy “big ticket weapons” – combat helicopters, fighter jets, and air defence systems – however it might be interested in future weapon systems, such as underwater drones, AI tech, autonomous systems, swarm drones, surveillance, satellites, advanced lasers, supersonics and hypersonics.

Why is Saudi Arabia looking to China to buy weapons?

Riyadh looks elsewhere to buy arms after the Yemen war, journalist Jamal Khashoggi’s murder and the Opec+ decision to cut oil output by 2 million barrels a day affect US-Saudi defence deals.

www.scmp.com

I didn't need to go through such a long article. I've listed out KSa's interests before Xi's visit on here in a few threads:

- KSA wants to build a local manufacturing capability of military Robotics, starting from drones. They would buy one of the assembly lines with ToT from China to start a local industry.
- Hypersonic Missiles, AD systems and BVR munitions with ToT. No explanation needed.
- Stealth platforms since (J-31 with ToT / or local assembly) KSA won't get F-35 more than likely and in the future, their sustainment capabilities might be reduced around their F-15's also. So a Chinese (Stealth) and EFT from UK will form the next hi-lo. With F-15's coming in the center tier or for offensive operations as fit.
- KSA wants to leapfrog it's Satellite and Space program by launching it's own satellites in next Ten years

 

[retaxis]

I didn't need to go through such a long article. I've listed out KSa's interests before Xi's visit on here in a few threads:

- KSA wants to build a local manufacturing capability of military Robotics, starting from drones. They would buy one of the assembly lines with ToT from China to start a local industry.
- Hypersonic Missiles, AD systems and BVR munitions with ToT. No explanation needed.
- Stealth platforms since (J-31 with ToT / or local assembly) KSA won't get F-35 more than likely and in the future, their sustainment capabilities might be reduced around their F-15's also. So a Chinese (Stealth) and EFT from UK will form the next hi-lo. With F-15's coming in the center tier or for offensive operations as fit.
- KSA wants to leapfrog it's Satellite and Space program by launching it's own satellites in next Ten years

yeah no one is selling TOT for stealth platforms or hypersonic missiles etc. Maybe a few low tech ballistic missiles decades old...sure. But new tech is out of the question. China, Like Russia and US don't even give their closest allies their best stuff e.g. F-22 let alone randoms from otherside of the world who are closer to their enemies.

 

[Horse_Rider]

yeah no one is selling TOT for stealth platforms or hypersonic missiles etc. Maybe a few low tech ballistic missiles decades old...sure. But new tech is out of the question.

Thank you Sir. MBS, anything else from Saudia? I mean Australia? This is when I know the user had a sh*it fit than knowing the reality. Why don't you wait just about two years and see? By the way, the "ToT for stealth jets is already been given to Egypt and contract has already been signed or is soon to be signed!!! They will locally assemble these J-31 jets in Egypt. My take is that KSA is behind it and they will buy it from Egypt to cut off the Chinese involved so they can integrate the Western weapons with it too. The West won't give them weapons to integrate if the Chinese were directly involved.

On Hypersonic missiles, it's not some jumbo mumbo deal that's going to remain in hidden secrets, it's essentially high performance engines capable of producing Mach 8-10+. All future missiles will automatically be Hypersonic as the current AD systems have become so advanced that they can take out 70% or more of conventional missiles. In Israel's case, over 80% success ratio. So now Hypersonic comes into play to evade AD's based on speed and agility.

These are serious topics, if you don't know the inside stories, try to verify it with other sources instead of flat our rejecting the details.

 

[retaxis]

Thank you Sir. MBS, anything else from Saudia? I mean Australia? This is when I know the user had a sh*it fit than knowing the reality. Why don't you wait just about two years and see? By the way, the "ToT for stealth jets is already been given to Egypt and contract has already been signed or is soon to be signed!!! They will locally assemble these J-31 jets in Egypt. My take is that KSA is behind it and they will buy it from Egypt to cut off the Chinese involved so they can integrate the Western weapons with it too. The West won't give them weapons to integrate if the Chinese were directly involved.

On Hypersonic missiles, it's not some jumbo mumbo deal that's going to remain in hidden secrets, it's essentially high performance engines capable of producing Mach 8-10+. All future missiles will automatically be Hypersonic as the current AD systems have become so advanced that they can take out 70% or more of conventional missiles. In Israel's case, over 80% success ratio. So now Hypersonic comes into play to evade AD's based on speed and agility.

These are serious topics, if you don't know the inside stories, try to verify it with other sources instead of flat our rejecting the details.

Keep dreaming little new baby user. If Saudi can throw money at this they would have had jet fighter production 30years ago. Funny how money doesn't solve all issues in the world isn't it?

US wouldn't sell F-22 to Israel or AUS or any nation for decades and neither will China or Russia sell their best stuff. Anyway keep living in delusions its not going to increase IQ. Cya.

 

[Horse_Rider]

Keep dreaming little new baby user. If Saudi can throw money at this they would have had jet fighter production 30years ago. Funny how money doesn't solve all issues in the world isn't it?

US wouldn't sell F-22 to Israel or AUS or any nation for decades and neither will China or Russia sell their best stuff. Anyway keep living in delusions its not going to increase IQ. Cya.

little baby user , when people run out of logic, they start to get personal. Just a sign of low IQ and lowER knowledge. But write today's date and this post, better take a screenshot as I don't think you can comprehend well. Hang that screenshot print on a wall by a bedroom. Two years from now, come back here and apologize to daddy! C'a!

Oh lastly, the J-31 is NOT China's best and NGAD with B-21 would be the best the US has in it's arsenal. F-22 is unmatched by the world but it was produced around the 90's. We are in 2022. I'll let you comprehend what i stated if you can!

 

[hussain0216]

The Arabs were idiots for decades spending top dollar for limited or downgraded weapons to ensure Israelis were ahead of them

Even now congress will give limited approval for top line weapons due to jew control

So Arabs are taking baby steps out


So it's partly why the Abraham accord's were so important and why the US pushed them so aggressively and why the Arabs if they weren't puppets should have rejected them

 

[dani191]

The Arabs were idiots for decades spending top dollar for limited or downgraded weapons to ensure Israelis were ahead of them

Even now congress will give limited approval for top line weapons due to jew control

So Arabs are taking baby steps out


So it's partly why the Abraham accord's were so important and why the US pushed them so aggressively and why the Arabs if they weren't puppets should have rejected them

what usa can give them that europe or china cant give them?

 

[hussain0216]

what usa can give them that europe or china cant give them?

It's political backing for dictatorships, it's why Jews are hated on a basic population level but governments like the Moroccan or UAE are partaking in the Abraham accord's even with a right wing apartheid government in Israel

But countries within Arab and Muslim world are beginning to find their feet and that's the basis for some more sensible planning and thinking

 

[BHAN85]

Advanced hi tech military hardware is like smartphones.

No matter how much you pay, the real owner is always the manufacturer, who can hack you remotely when they want.

We have little information about that KSA really think about their American pals, because KSA doesnt need to make public that information.

But I guess they must not to be happy with things like 2015 Iran Deal or 2012 Hormuz Strait tensions.

 

[retaxis]

Advanced hi tech military hardware is like smartphones.

No matter how much you pay, the real owner is always the manufacturer, who can hack you remotely when they want.

We have little information about that KSA really think about their American pals, because KSA doesnt need to make public that information.

But I guess they must not to be happy with things like 2015 Iran Deal or 2012 Hormuz Strait tensions.

US supports freedom and democracy as they say and KSA is basically north korea with oil wealth. If KSA loses its value, US will support democratic freedom fighters to take over the gulf and pump out oil at bargain bin prices to the West. US already has the justification written down how they will bring democracy and human rights and equality for woman when they invade and set the whole region on fire.

 

[BHAN85]

US supports freedom and democracy as they say and KSA is basically north korea with oil wealth. If KSA loses its value, US will support democratic freedom fighters to take over the gulf and pump out oil at bargain bin prices to the West. US already has the justification written down how they will bring democracy and human rights and equality for woman when they invade and set the whole region on fire.

I think that could happen when KSA will start to run out of cheap oil.
You know, American new paradigm of ruling is: Destroy a oil exporting country, and keep it in a endless failed state, this way they will decrease internal oil consumption and liberate it for exports.

Technology, electronic espionage and drones make possible rule a country in the middle of chaos, that it was impossible decades ago.

In that aspect, the first targets will be oil rich countries with large amount of people (like Iraq), the next in line will be KSA.

It's nothing personal or a ideology issue. USA is a cold beast.

But KSA have something more than oil: Very sacred places to 1.9 bn Muslim people, dangerous scenario.

Although modern twisted USA loves that kind of scenario, they take advantage of it.
If you act cold and rational, and your enemy acts emotionally, you wil win. And religion makes people act emotionally.

I think American unstabilization of Syria had some of it, of self fulfilled religious prophecies to handle people.