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Why hasn't Pakistan been able to have a sustained GDP growth rate?

India as a country has been allotted at least two large Industrial export zones in Bangladesh.

Bangladeshi companies are also trying to invest in India.

However Indian industrialists so far see this in protectionist light and your govt. at their behest has so far not been open about this.

I hope mood will change in the future.
Bangladesh is like any other country. If you feel there is protectionism in India, then that same protectionism is applied to companies from South Korea, Japan, China etc. It is not Bangladesh specific.

If Bangladesh companies are trying to enter the Indian market and are not quite successful then, the reason may be, the products are not attractive for the market, local supplements available, no competitive advantage given there may be so many players.

And what industries are trying to enter the Indian market again? The only company I know, just because it gets mentioned quite a lot, is Walton. Although I am yet to see a Walton product anywhere in the online-offline market.
 
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Because unlike export led growth model of Bangladesh, India and Asian Tigers (Taiwan, Korea, Vietnam, Singapore, Hong Kong, China) Pakistan follows import led growth model. Import substitution policies have devastated Pakistani economy for decades and pushed the country to IMF with begging bowl 22 times already.
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@ziaulislam @Joe Shearer @beijingwalker @Viet @Homo Sapiens @Bilal9 @Black_cats


Don't worry.

Our own home-grown 'Hard work is better than Harvard' genius is doing his best to ensure that we compete as equals with Pakistan.
 
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what Islam does Pakistan practice/enforce actually???
Saudi and the UAE actually enforce stricter version of Islam, they're on top of the world.

It's a red herring, used by liberals, elitists and people who share their ideology to hide from the real problems.
  • No religious party has ever formed national government in Pakistan. The best they ever did was form a provincial government for 1 term post 911 in the KPK province bordering Afghanistan. This was also at a time where the main political parties had their leaders hiding in exile and the country was run by a military dictator.
  • There is no central religious authority in Pakistan.
  • There is no state level religious authority in Pakistan.
The only impact religious political parties have had in Pakistan has been to influence courts and wider society to abuse legislation and repress Ahmadi minorities. These people form less than 1% of our population; so it's not like it has a massive impact.

The other impact you could loosely associate with religion is the policy of the Pakistani state during the 80's and 90's to train and arm jihadi groups to fight the wars they didn't want to fight. This was done by the Pakistani army, ISI and the two main political parties (both non religious parties). Religion was used as a rallying tool to make this army of useful zombies.

You name any problem Pakistan has and I can assure you it's down to mismanagement by the ruling elite of our country. It doesn't matter if they are in political parties, in judges gowns, in newspaper offices, in armed forces uniforms or fuedal lords sat in Palaces - these people and their greed are the root cause behind every single failing of our country.
 
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It's a red herring, used by liberals, elitists and people who share their ideology to hide from the real problems.
  • No religious party has ever formed national government in Pakistan. The best they ever did was form a provincial government for 1 term post 911 in the KPK province bordering Afghanistan. This was also at a time where the main political parties had their leaders hiding in exile and the country was run by a military dictator.
  • There is no central religious authority in Pakistan.
  • There is no state level religious authority in Pakistan.
The only impact religious political parties have had in Pakistan has been to influence courts and wider society to abuse legislation and repress Ahmadi minorities. These people form less than 1% of our population; so it's not like it has a massive impact.

The other impact you could loosely associate with religion is the policy of the Pakistani state during the 80's and 90's to train and arm jihadi groups to fight the wars they didn't want to fight. This was done by the Pakistani army, ISI and the two main political parties (both non religious parties). Religion was used as a rallying tool to make this army of useful zombies.

You name any problem Pakistan has and I can assure you it's down to mismanagement by the ruling elite of our country. It doesn't matter if they are in political parties, in judges gowns, in newspaper offices, in armed forces uniforms or fuedal lords sat in Palaces - these people and their greed are the root cause behind every single failing of our country.
your country need a restructuring, no country succeed when everything is controlled by the military. Civilian led government is a must and the military answer to the Civilians (govt) not vice versa.

if you look closely even "authoritarian" China and Saudi are led by Civilians.
 
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what Islam does Pakistan practice/enforce actually???
Saudi and the UAE actually enforce stricter version of Islam, they're on top of the world.

Tribalism.

The innate paranoia of some of the xenophobic tribes inhabiting the country for the Arab religion.

Growth is defined as how smooth the urbanization process is in the rural areas. The tribal people practice caste system which does not allow for families born in lower strata to own land or resource or be seen as equals.

Much of the country's conservative values emanating from culture and tradition are repackaged as Islam and sold as tool of subjugation.

The concept of Martial race also dons the religious cloak in polity.

Rest of the rants by people here are insecurity driven paranoia.
 
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hard to be stable when you’re surrounded by destabilizing powers
 
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My reasons why Pakistan hasn't been able to sustain GDP Growth

1. Game of thrones. Not the TV show, but Pakistani politics. Each governing party is only interested in policies that will win it the next election. Each opposition party is only interested in bringing down the government. Our military is far too interested in holding power for itself, or influencing those in power. Being in government is infintely more important than actual governance. This leads to short term thinking and horse trading against national interest, in exchange for self interest.

2. Why is being in government is infintely more important than actual governance? The opportunity to make money; ie corruption. People are so desperate to get into power and hold onto power because of the billions there are to be earnt through corruption. Even the traffic bribe you pay has a small cut going into the pockets at the very top. The money goes upwards in a mafia type structure, and the protection from consequences flows donwards.If I want to commit a crime i'll bribe the police first, they'll kick some money up to a political patron. This will buy me protection from criminal prosecution and influence of judges if something does go wrong. I just have to commit a crime big enough to pay for it all. This leads to a wider break down in law and order.

3. Break down in law and order. Being able to bribe judges, police and buy political patrionage creates and environment where there are little to no consequences for a wide variety of crimes, from murder, fraud, smuggling, drugs, even peadophillia. As long as the right people are getting a big enough cut, you can get away with whatever you want. Not only does this create a dangerous and hostile environment, it encourages scams and frauds and scares away investment.

4. Lack of investment. The backbone of any economy is the SME's. In Pakistan there has been an environment where these have been discouraged. People with hard earned money are afraid to invest, not knowing if projects are legitimate, or if they won't face being forced to pay bribes or protection money to remain open. Karachi - the economic hub of Pakistan was held at gunpoint by protection rackets backed by the secular MQM party for 30+ years. A man from the UK setup a wedding hall in a town near my village. He can't get AC fitted in his hall as the electricity infrastructure to support such a large setup isn't in place. He's asked the electric company to rectify this for years but they won't because a rival wedding hall belonging to a family with political affiliations has asked them not to. Then you have it at the very top level. BMW wanted to setup in Pakistan in the 90's and pulled out after Zardari wanted 10%,

5. Feudal lords. The feudals prevent the establishment of anything that might benefit the common people in lands that are theirs are or near them. These people rely on the the masses being illiterate and helpless. They then use these people as slaves effectively, giving them jobs on their lands in exchange for food and shelter. If these people get an education or a job - the feudal lord loses a slave.

6. Poor education system. This is somewhat linked to feudal lords and somewhat due to misgovernance. The education system is out of date, not fit for purpose and in some cases missing altogether. There are tens of thousands of "ghost schools", schools on paper alone where salaries and funds go, but nobody teaches anyone, I know a guy in the UK who recieved a salary from one of these schools in Punjab for decades, even though he was in the UK. He just bribed someone to keep him on the payroll of his old job.

7. No vocational education. The state doesn't teach you a trade. People who don't do well at school don't have a chance to learn skills to make them economically useful. We don't invest in our human resources. The guys who go to Middle East as labourers, could go as trained professionals and earn 4-5 times as much money.

Add to all this an environment where government doesn't encourage or enable businesses and investment and this is what you get. The PTI government has bought in flickers of change but it'll take a decade to have a big impact.
 
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religion as practiced by Pakistanis is not conducive to economic growth
Whatever is practiced in Pakistan [call it Islam etc] has extremely toxic effect on society. To begin with it displaces secular education for religious education for large segments of people. Then it relegates and militates against female literacy and emancipation ppreventing 50% of the population being a viable labour force. The gross effect of religion on Pakistani society is also it acts as a barrier to integrating with the global economy. Finally rel;igion also supports the status quo and prevents the evolution of society.
 
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What is amazing the Chinese members on PDF can see the reasons why Pakistan lags. Bearing in mind they come from a country that has actually done miracles in 30 years their advice should be regarded heavily particularly when you know they are well wishers of Pakistan. Most Chinese will point to religion as reason numero uno. I find Chinese as people to be very coy about saying things but when they do "think aloud" Pakistani';s should listen to them. They can see from outside and get a better picture. Problem is Pakistani society has become so brainwashed with religion that they cannot possibly think objectively even when the truth smacks them on the head.

What a tragedy for 220 million. A few more generations will have to suffer before change comes along. In the meantime suffer thy children.

Ps. Ask the Chinese how they are fixing Xinkiang province which is not only geographically the closest to Pakistan but culturally, religiously and even in development more similiar to Pakistan then rest of China. Interestingly education, female emancipation and curtailing religion are top on the list of CCP's policies to lift Xinkiang.
 
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What is amazing the Chinese members on PDF can see the reasons why Pakistan lags. Bearing in mind they come from a country that has actually done miracles in 30 years their advice should be regarded heavily particularly when you know they are well wishers of Pakistan. Most Chinese will point to religion as reason numero uno. I find Chinese as people to be very coy about saying things but when they do "think aloud" Pakistani';s should listen to them. They can see from outside and get a better picture. Problem is Pakistani society has become so brainwashed with religion that they cannot possibly think objectively even when the truth smacks them on the head.

What a tragedy for 220 million. A few more generations will have to suffer before change comes along. In the meantime suffer thy children.

Ps. Ask the Chinese how they are fixing Xinkiang province which is not only geographically the closest to Pakistan but culturally, religiously and even in development more similiar to Pakistan then rest of China. Interestingly education, female emancipation and curtailing religion are top on the list of CCP's policies to lift Xinkiang.
From Hu Jintao's "Great western development" strategy. Beijing invests heavily in Xinjiang's education, health care, infrastructure, manufacturing and so on every year. only in 2018, Beijing invested 280 billion yuan in Xinjiang's manufacturing industry.

Today, Xinjiang alone produces high-speed rail, subway, TBM (tunnel boring machine), light aircraft... Wind turbines made in Xinjiang are exported to the whole world. and Xinjiang has the largest polysilicon production base in China (no country in South Asia can produce polysilicon). BTW, Xinjiang UHV technology is the world's top level.

Please free Google.
 
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Then its not religion its the attitude of people. Remove religion they will adopt something else.

Sorry I did not mean to offend anyone. religion is a proxy for attitudes/culture etc
the closest contrast are Sikhs who are ethnically the same stock as Pakistani Punjabi Muslims but a lot more successful
 
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Religion can be misinterpreted as well, I think @Indus Pakistan refer the religious person from backward education level, but many religious people who have reached high education level have very modern thinking. Erdogan for instant is a highly religious person and the last 20 years of Turkish rapid technology and economic development comes from his administration period.

In Indonesia also the same, the architect of Indonesia state owned strategic industry and research development is Habibie, a hard core Islamist that build ICMI in the start of 1990, it is also despite lack of funding from Soeharto until current regime in R&D spending. If Indonesia is lead by Habibie not just for 2 years, Indonesia will be very different IMO and many knowledgeable Indonesian are also agree.

Indonesia Anti Corruption Body (KPK) is also filled with religious people. It can be seen from one of the main leader in KPK who is Novel Baswedan who get acid attack when he just left from Fajr prayer in the Mosque. I would say, without KPK it is difficult for Indonesia to combat corruption culture in here.

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Bacharuddin Jusuf Habibie (Indonesian: [baxaˈrudːin ˈjusuf haˈbibi] (About this soundlisten); 25 June 1936 – 11 September 2019) was an Indonesian engineer and politician who was the third president of Indonesia from 1998 to 1999. Less than three months after his inauguration as the seventh vice president in March 1998, he succeeded Suharto who resigned after 31 years in office. His presidency is seen as a landmark and transition to the Reformation era. Upon becoming president, he liberalized Indonesia's press and political party laws, and held an early democratic election three years sooner than scheduled, which resulted in the end of his presidency. His 517-day presidency and 71-day vice presidency are the shortest in the country's history.

Studies and career in Europe
Habibie went to Delft, the Netherlands, to study aviation and aerospace at the Technische Hogeschool Delft (Delft University of Technology), but for political reasons (the West New Guinea dispute between the Netherlands and Indonesia), he had to continue his study at the Technische Hochschule Aachen (RWTH Aachen University) in Aachen, Germany.[8] In 1960, Habibie received an engineer's degree in Germany with the title Diplom-Ingenieur. He remained in Germany as a research assistant under Hans Ebner at the Lehrstuhl und Institut für Leichtbau, RWTH Aachen to conduct research for his doctoral degree.[9]

In 1962, Habibie returned to Indonesia for three months on sick leave. During this time, he was reacquainted with Hasri Ainun, the daughter of R. Mohamad Besari. Habibie had known Hasri Ainun in childhood, junior high school and in senior high school at SMA Kristen Dago (Dago Christian Senior High School), Bandung. The two married on 12 May 1962, returning to Germany shortly afterwards.[10] Habibie and his wife settled in Aachen for a short period before moving to Oberforstbach. In May 1963 they had a son, Ilham Akbar Habibie.[11]

Habibie later found employment with the railway stock firm Waggonfabrik Talbot, where he became an advisor in designing train wagons.[12] Due to his work with Makosh, the head of train construction offered his position to Habibie upon retirement three years later, but Habibie refused the position.[13][12]

In 1965, Habibie delivered his dissertation in aerospace engineering and received the grade of "very good," giving him the title Doktoringenieur (Dr.-Ing.). The same year, he accepted Hans Ebner's offer to continue his research on Thermoelastisitas and work toward his Habilitation, but he declined the offer to join RWTH as a professor. His thesis about light construction for supersonic or hypersonic states also attracted offers of employment from companies such as Boeing and Airbus, which Habibie again declined.[14]

Habibie did accept a position with Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm in Hamburg. There, he developed theories on thermodynamics, construction, and aerodynamics known as the Habibie Factor, Habibie Theorem, and Habibie Method, respectively. He worked for Messerschmitt on the development of the Airbus A-300B aircraft. In 1974, he was promoted to vice president of the company.[15]

Career in Indonesia

In 1974, Suharto recruited Habibie to return to Indonesia as part of his drive to industrialize and develop the country. Habibie initially served as a special assistant to Ibnu Sutowo, chief executive officer of the state oil company Pertamina and Chair of Agency for the Assessment and Application of Technology (Indonesian: Badan Pengkajian dan Penerapan Teknologi, BPPT). Two years later, Habibie was made CEO of the new state-owned enterprise Industri Pesawat Terbang Nurtanio (IPTN; Nurtanio Aircraft Industry),[15] which in 1985 changed its name to Industri Pesawat Terbang Nusantara (Nusantara Aircraft Industry; also abbreviated as IPTN) and is known as Indonesian Aerospace (PT. Dirgantara Indonesia) since 2000). In 1978, he was appointed as State Minister of Research and Technology (Indonesian: Menteri Negara Riset dan Teknologi, Menristek). He continued to play an important role in IPTN other "strategic" industries in this post.[15] By the 1980s, IPTN had grown considerably, specializing in the manufacture of helicopters and small passenger planes. Under Habibie's leadership, IPTN became a manufacturer of aircraft including Puma helicopters and CASA planes. It pioneered a small passenger airplane, the N-250 Gatotkaca, in 1995, but the project was a commercial failure.[16] In developing Indonesia's aviation industry, he adopted an approach called "Begin at the End and End at the Beginning".[17] In this method, elements such as basic research became the last things upon which to focus, whilst actual manufacturing of the planes was placed as the first objective.


By 1991, Habibie oversaw ten state-owned industries including ship- and train-building, steel, arms, communications, and energy.[15] A 1993 estimate determined that the estimates used nearly $2 billion a year in state funding, although the government's opaque accounting practices meant that the size of the industries was not completely known.[18]

As minister, Habibie created the OFP (Overseas Fellowship Program), STMDP (Science Technology and Manpower Development Program) and STAID (Science and Technology for Industrial Development). These three programs provided scholarships to thousands of high school graduates to earn their bachelor's degrees in the STEM fields and for other technical professionals to continue their study for master's and doctorate program in the United States, Europe, Japan, and other countries.[19]

Habibie was, continuously, a member of six Indonesian cabinets for over 20 years. After his initial appointment in 1978, he served in another five cabinets (including the Development Reform Cabinet which, as president he formed after the resignation of Suharto in May 1998):



In Suharto's regime, as was expected of senior government executives, Habibie became a member of the Golkar organisation. Suharto appointed him as deputy daily coordinator for the chairman of the executive board in 1992, and the following year he became the daily coordinator.[20]

While serving in cabinet, Habibie was also elected as the first Chair of the Indonesian Association of Muslim Intellectuals (ICMI) in 1990. This modernist Muslim organization provided him with a political base, linked to but independent of the Suharto administration.[21]

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We also can see the difference between countries in America continent where majority is Christian protestan follower with independent free thinking (USA) compared it with Westerners lead countries with Chatolic followers like in Argentina/Brazil, etc.


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This second biggest Muslim organization in Indonesia also has such free thinking culture and doesnt create fanatical follower like many traditional Muslim follower in Indonesia. FPI organization with fanatic followe for instant belongs to traditional Islam follower.


Muhammadiyah (Arabic: محمدية‎, followers of Muhammad; full name: Persyarikatan Muhammadiyah) is a major Islamic non-governmental organization in Indonesia.[1] The organization was founded in 1912 by Ahmad Dahlan in the city of Yogyakarta as a reformist socioreligious movement, advocating ijtihad - individual interpretation of Qur'an and sunnah, as opposed to taqlid - the acceptance of the traditional interpretations propounded by the ulama.[2] Since its establishment, Muhammadiyah has adopted a reformist platform mixing religious and secular education,[3] primarily as a way to promote the upward mobility of Muslims toward a 'modern' community and to purify Indonesian Islam of local syncretic practices.[3] It continues to support local culture and promote religious tolerance in Indonesia, while a few of its higher education institutions are attended mostly by non-Muslims, especially in East Nusa Tenggara and Papua provinces. The group also runs a large chain of charity hospitals,[1] and operated 128 universities as of the late 1990s.[4]

In 2008, Muhammadiyah was considered the second largest Islamic organization in Indonesia with 29 million members.[2] Although Muhammadiyah leaders and members are often actively involved in shaping the politics in Indonesia, Muhammadiyah is not a political party. It has devoted itself to social and educational activitie

 
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