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Why Bangladesh overtook Pakistan

What a Logic. BS has $32 B you have $8B , and are almost Bankrupt.
Isn't Pakistan BEGGING from KSA , China and UAE ?
during cold war era:
upload_2019-2-9_5-2-30.png



India top recipient of US economic aid - Times of India



https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com › World News › US News

you are also largest recipient of world bank loans so what's the difference? you beg in front of US too.
 
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Very balanced article from a Pakistani source.
Hope Imran Khan is listening and sends a team to BD to see what can be applied to Pakistan.
 
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during cold war era:
View attachment 538021


India top recipient of US economic aid - Times of India



https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com › World News › US News

you are also largest recipient of world bank loans so what's the difference? you beg in front of US too.

Given from 1945 to 53
When India was not even independent and dirt poor....
Wake up your country is 71 year old

Very balaced article from a Pakistani source.
Hope Imran Khan is listening and sends a team to BD to see what can be applied to Pakistan.
Common sense..
 
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For Pakistan, these are lessons to be pondered over. CPEC or no CPEC, it’s impossible to match India tank for tank or missile by missile. Surely it is time to get realistic. Shouting ‘Pakistan zindabad’ from the rooftops while obsequiously taking dictation from the Americans, Chinese, and Saudis has taken us nowhere. Announcing that we have become targets of a fifth-generation hi-tech secret subversion inflames national paranoia but is otherwise pointless. Instead, to move forward, Pakistan must transform its war economy into ultimately becoming a peace economy.

Good points by Dr. Hoodbhoy, but he ignores one basic difference: Bangladesh has a real danger of being India's vassal, while Pakistan has the umbrella of nuclear deterrence and therefore can afford to be independent. And if the present government can resuscitate the economy, then it will leap forward. All is not well in Pakistan, but it is not all bad either.
 
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Good points by Dr. Hoodbhoy, but he ignores one basic difference: Bangladesh has a real danger of being India's vassal, while Pakistan has the umbrella of nuclear deterrence and therefore can afford to be independent. And if the present government can resuscitate the economy, then it will leap forward. All is not well in Pakistan, but it is not all bad either.

I'm afraid it's not going to be that simple though.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1461907/sp-downgrades-pakistans-long-term-credit-rating
The S&P said the GDP growth rate would fall to four per cent this year (2019) from 5.8pc last year (2018) and then stay 3.5pc for the next two years (2020 and 2021) and fall further to 3.3pc by 2022.

@Nilgiri @anant_s @Vibrio Check OP.
 
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I'm afraid it's not going to be that simple though.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1461907/sp-downgrades-pakistans-long-term-credit-rating
The S&P said the GDP growth rate would fall to four per cent this year (2019) from 5.8pc last year (2018) and then stay 3.5pc for the next two years (2020 and 2021) and fall further to 3.3pc by 2022.

@Nilgiri @anant_s @Vibrio Check OP.

Correct, it will not be simple. Or easy. But it is certainly doable. The remainder of the term of the present government will show that, whichever way it goes.
 
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Bhai , What numbers are you talking about ?
Is Bangladesh running to several countries for a few Billions ?

And it seems "number manipulation" suite better for Pakistan who could not see their own economic disaster.
meanwhile World Bank says exact Opposite for BD.

https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/p...nomic-reforms-can-make-bangladesh-grow-faster

main-qimg-c0ced4605ae9e915030d552399605b61
World bank are the source of all wars an economic disasters. Ratings agencies like moody were called out during the last crisis and their ratings mean nothing. They admitted to lying.

Tbh quality of life does seem better in Pakistan - you have a lot more space (less population density), your land is also very good for building on and you have an ample supply of building materials locally. You are all blessed with beautiful Highlands too.

But the economy part is 100% true, there is no doubt that BD is more productive than Pakistan today. Sadly even with that, to achieve quality of life on par will take a while.
I do not begrudge BD in the slightest and wish them well but having been there the reality is very different.
 
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Bangladesh has a real danger of being India's vassal
You guys need to define what is a vassal state. Is Canada, America's vassal state?

And Pakistan have more possibilities to become a vassal state of China than BD to become India's. Most of the countries are under influence of some other country these days.
 
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You guys need to define what is a vassal state. Is Canada, America's vassal state?

And Pakistan have more possibilities to become a vassal state of China than BD to become India's. Most of the countries are under influence of some other country these days.

Your point is fair, but India has a special role in the region due to its status as the mother country of the subcontinent. Pakistan has the audacity to stand up to it as a visceral reaction, but Bangladesh does not. I am not saying which one is correct, but only noting the situation.
 
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https://www.dawn.com/news/1462757/why-bangladesh-overtook-pakistan
Pervez Hoodbhoy

BANGLADESH is not some Scandinavian heaven. It is poor and overpopulated, undereducated and corrupt, frequented by natural catastrophes, experiences occasional terrorism, and the farcical nature of its democracy was exposed in the December 2018 elections. But the earlier caricature of a country on life support disappeared years ago. Today, some economists say it shall be the next Asian tiger. Its growth rate last year (7.8 per cent) put it at par with India (8.0pc) and well above Pakistan (5.8pc). The debt per capita for Bangladesh ($434) is less than half that for Pakistan ($974), and its foreign exchange reserves ($32 billion) are four times Pakistan’s ($8bn).

Take a look: Why we lag behind

Much of this growth owes to exports which zoomed from zero in 1971 to $35.8bn in 2018 (Pakistan’s is $24.8bn). Bangladesh produces no cotton but, to the chagrin of Pakistan’s pampered textile industry, it has eaten savagely into its market share. The IMF calculates Bangladesh’s economy growing from $180bn presently to $322bn by 2021. This means that the average Bangladeshi today is almost as wealthy as the average Pakistani and, if the rupee depreciates further, will be technically wealthier by 2020.

Other indicators are equally stunning. East Pakistan’s population in the 1951 census was 42 million, while West Pakistan’s was 33.7m. But today Bangladesh has far fewer people than Pakistan — 165m versus 200m. A sustained population planning campaign helped reduce fertility in Bangladesh. No such campaign — or even its beginnings — is visible today in Pakistan.

Eschewing militarism in favour of human development, Bangladesh set its initial priorities correctly.

The health sector is no less impressive — far fewer babies die at birth in Bangladesh than in Pakistan. Immunisation is common and no one gets shot dead for administering polio drops. Life expectancy (72.5 years) is higher than Pakistan’s (66.5 years). According to the ILO, females are well ahead in employment (33.2pc) as compared to Pakistan (25.1pc).

How did West Pakistan’s poor cousin manage to upstage its richer relative by so much so fast? It’s all the more puzzling because Bangladesh has no geostrategic assets saleable to America, China, or Saudi Arabia. It also has no nuclear weapons, no army of significance, no wise men in uniform running the country from the shadows, and no large pool of competent professionals. At birth, East Pakistan had, in fact, no trained bureaucracy; it received just one member of the former Indian Civil Service.

Special report: The Breakup of Pakistan 1969-1971

None should be more surprised at these new developments than those West Pakistanis — like me — who went to school during the 1950s and 1960s and grew up surrounded by unconcealed racism. Short and dark Bengalis were reputedly good only for growing jute and rice and catching fish. They were Muslims and Pakistanis, of course, but as children we were made to imagine that all good Muslims and real Pakistanis are tall, fair, and speak chaste Urdu. We’d laugh madly at the strange-sounding Bengali news broadcasts from Radio Pakistan. In our foolish macho world, they sounded terribly feminine.

The mega surrender of 1971 made West Pakistanis eat humble pie. But, even as the two-nation theory went out of the window, the overwhelming majority was loath to change its thinking. The west wing renamed itself Pakistan, many assuming this was temporary. They said Bangladesh could never survive economically and would humbly ask to be taken back.

Others optimistically imagined that the disaster had taught Pakistan a profound lesson making change inevitable. Responding enthusiastically to the popular roti, kapra, makaan slogan, they believed Pakistan would shift from pampering its hyper-privileged ones towards providing welfare for all. Equally, it was hoped that the rights of Pakistan’s culturally diverse regions would be respected. None of this happened. Instead, we simply got more of what had been earlier.

Thirsting for vengeance, Pakistan’s establishment could think of nothing beyond wounded honour and ways to settle scores with India. Zulfikar Ali Bhutto’s secret call for the nuclear bomb led to the famed Multan meeting just six weeks after the surrender. That centralisation of authority breeds local resentment remained an unlearned lesson. In 1973, Bhutto dismissed the NAP government in Balochistan and ordered military action, starting a series of local rebellions that has never gone away. In doing so, he re-empowered those who ultimately hanged him.

In a nutshell, Bangladesh and Pakistan are different countries today because they perceive their national interest very differently. Bangladesh sees its future in human development and economic growth. Goal posts are set at increasing exports, reducing unemployment, improving health, reducing dependence upon loans and aid, and further extending micro credit. Water and boundary disputes with India are serious and Bangladesh suffers bullying by its bigger neighbour on matters of illegal immigration, drugs, etc. But its basic priorities have not wavered.

For Pakistan, human development comes a distant second. The bulk of national energies remain focused upon check-mating India. Relations with Afghanistan and Iran are therefore troubled; Pakistan accuses both of being excessively close to India. But the most expensive consequence of the security state mindset was the nurturing of extra state actors in the 1990s. Ultimately they had to be crushed after the APS massacre of Dec 16, 2014. This, coincidentally, was the day Dhaka had fallen 43 years earlier.

Bangladesh is conflicted by internal rifts. Still, being more multicultural and liberal, its civil society and activist intelligentsia have stopped armed groups from grabbing the reins of power. Although elected or quasi-elected Bangladeshi leaders are often horribly corrupt and incompetent, they don’t simply endorse decisions — they actually make them. Ultimately responsible to their electorate, they are forced to invest in people instead of weapons or a massive military establishment.

For Pakistan, these are lessons to be pondered over. CPEC or no CPEC, it’s impossible to match India tank for tank or missile by missile. Surely it is time to get realistic. Shouting ‘Pakistan zindabad’ from the rooftops while obsequiously taking dictation from the Americans, Chinese, and Saudis has taken us nowhere. Announcing that we have become targets of a fifth-generation hi-tech secret subversion inflames national paranoia but is otherwise pointless. Instead, to move forward, Pakistan must transform its war economy into ultimately becoming a peace economy.

Dr sb is free to express his opinions and I do not see any harm is learning from others. However, calling BD ahead will not solve our problems. His job as an academic is to supervise and produce high quality research in HIS DOMAIN. I understand he has an enviable credentials and has served Pakistan a lot but when he speaks/writes on domains as diverse as GDP, Population, History, Anthropology etc than my mind fails to accept his analyses with an objective sight.

Maybe an input from economists, political scientists, public policy makers etc can shed more light on why or why not Pakistan is different on some scales with other countries and than perhaps suggest some way forward.

As far as Dr sb is concerned, I would really like him to lead academia again. With his stature he could surely get more funding than most others.
 
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Your point is fair, but India has a special role in the region due to its status as the mother country of the subcontinent. Pakistan has the audacity to stand up to it as a visceral reaction, but Bangladesh does not. I am not saying which one is correct, but only noting the situation.
If Pakistan stands up to India it will need someone's backing. Earlier it was USA's backing because India was a Soviet ally. Now it is China as it is battling India's influence in subcontinent region. So Pakistan will likely end up as someone else's vassal.
 
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economy is the only thing where bangladesh is ahead.bangladesh don't face border issue like pakistan.bangladesh lags behind when it comes to missile technology.bangladesh can't even defend itself from myanmar.bangladesh is also not in strategic place like pakistan.bangladesh foreign policy is dictated by india.pakistani foreign policy is different from bangladesh.we don't accept indian role in sub continent neither we fear india.bangladesh fears india.now bangladesh have chinese submarines to monitor indian activities.i don't want to talk about poverty.go to dhaka.see the heartbreaking scenes with your own naked eyes.the relation of india and bangladesh is like master and his slave.
 
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Because Pakistan opposes the largest regional power, whereas Bangladesh has de facto accepted Indian dominance. Bangladesh's acceptance of this power order has been beneficial to it and allowed it to focus purely on its economic growth. However this economic growth is fundamentally dependent on Indian benevolence. So long as Bangladesh tows the line, continues its anti-Pakistan rhetoric and takes a measured approach towards China, this Indian benevolence will continue. Should an ideological individual take the reigns of power in Dhaka though, then the fissures can have serious consequences on Bangladeshi stability.

Pakistan opposing the largest regional power has meanwhile resulted in instability, armed conflict (terrorism, Kashmir etc), and economic barriers, all of them impacting growth negatively. However the Pakistani approach is rooted more in ideology and less in realism. Ideology dictates sovereignty and independence even at the cost of economic stagnation. Both sides can judge each other and state the other is wrong.
 
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https://www.dawn.com/news/1462757/why-bangladesh-overtook-pakistan
Pervez Hoodbhoy

BANGLADESH is not some Scandinavian heaven. It is poor and overpopulated, undereducated and corrupt, frequented by natural catastrophes, experiences occasional terrorism, and the farcical nature of its democracy was exposed in the December 2018 elections. But the earlier caricature of a country on life support disappeared years ago. Today, some economists say it shall be the next Asian tiger. Its growth rate last year (7.8 per cent) put it at par with India (8.0pc) and well above Pakistan (5.8pc). The debt per capita for Bangladesh ($434) is less than half that for Pakistan ($974), and its foreign exchange reserves ($32 billion) are four times Pakistan’s ($8bn).

Take a look: Why we lag behind

Much of this growth owes to exports which zoomed from zero in 1971 to $35.8bn in 2018 (Pakistan’s is $24.8bn). Bangladesh produces no cotton but, to the chagrin of Pakistan’s pampered textile industry, it has eaten savagely into its market share. The IMF calculates Bangladesh’s economy growing from $180bn presently to $322bn by 2021. This means that the average Bangladeshi today is almost as wealthy as the average Pakistani and, if the rupee depreciates further, will be technically wealthier by 2020.

Other indicators are equally stunning. East Pakistan’s population in the 1951 census was 42 million, while West Pakistan’s was 33.7m. But today Bangladesh has far fewer people than Pakistan — 165m versus 200m. A sustained population planning campaign helped reduce fertility in Bangladesh. No such campaign — or even its beginnings — is visible today in Pakistan.

Eschewing militarism in favour of human development, Bangladesh set its initial priorities correctly.

The health sector is no less impressive — far fewer babies die at birth in Bangladesh than in Pakistan. Immunisation is common and no one gets shot dead for administering polio drops. Life expectancy (72.5 years) is higher than Pakistan’s (66.5 years). According to the ILO, females are well ahead in employment (33.2pc) as compared to Pakistan (25.1pc).

How did West Pakistan’s poor cousin manage to upstage its richer relative by so much so fast? It’s all the more puzzling because Bangladesh has no geostrategic assets saleable to America, China, or Saudi Arabia. It also has no nuclear weapons, no army of significance, no wise men in uniform running the country from the shadows, and no large pool of competent professionals. At birth, East Pakistan had, in fact, no trained bureaucracy; it received just one member of the former Indian Civil Service.

Special report: The Breakup of Pakistan 1969-1971

None should be more surprised at these new developments than those West Pakistanis — like me — who went to school during the 1950s and 1960s and grew up surrounded by unconcealed racism. Short and dark Bengalis were reputedly good only for growing jute and rice and catching fish. They were Muslims and Pakistanis, of course, but as children we were made to imagine that all good Muslims and real Pakistanis are tall, fair, and speak chaste Urdu. We’d laugh madly at the strange-sounding Bengali news broadcasts from Radio Pakistan. In our foolish macho world, they sounded terribly feminine.

The mega surrender of 1971 made West Pakistanis eat humble pie. But, even as the two-nation theory went out of the window, the overwhelming majority was loath to change its thinking. The west wing renamed itself Pakistan, many assuming this was temporary. They said Bangladesh could never survive economically and would humbly ask to be taken back.

Others optimistically imagined that the disaster had taught Pakistan a profound lesson making change inevitable. Responding enthusiastically to the popular roti, kapra, makaan slogan, they believed Pakistan would shift from pampering its hyper-privileged ones towards providing welfare for all. Equally, it was hoped that the rights of Pakistan’s culturally diverse regions would be respected. None of this happened. Instead, we simply got more of what had been earlier.

Thirsting for vengeance, Pakistan’s establishment could think of nothing beyond wounded honour and ways to settle scores with India. Zulfikar Ali Bhutto’s secret call for the nuclear bomb led to the famed Multan meeting just six weeks after the surrender. That centralisation of authority breeds local resentment remained an unlearned lesson. In 1973, Bhutto dismissed the NAP government in Balochistan and ordered military action, starting a series of local rebellions that has never gone away. In doing so, he re-empowered those who ultimately hanged him.

In a nutshell, Bangladesh and Pakistan are different countries today because they perceive their national interest very differently. Bangladesh sees its future in human development and economic growth. Goal posts are set at increasing exports, reducing unemployment, improving health, reducing dependence upon loans and aid, and further extending micro credit. Water and boundary disputes with India are serious and Bangladesh suffers bullying by its bigger neighbour on matters of illegal immigration, drugs, etc. But its basic priorities have not wavered.

For Pakistan, human development comes a distant second. The bulk of national energies remain focused upon check-mating India. Relations with Afghanistan and Iran are therefore troubled; Pakistan accuses both of being excessively close to India. But the most expensive consequence of the security state mindset was the nurturing of extra state actors in the 1990s. Ultimately they had to be crushed after the APS massacre of Dec 16, 2014. This, coincidentally, was the day Dhaka had fallen 43 years earlier.

Bangladesh is conflicted by internal rifts. Still, being more multicultural and liberal, its civil society and activist intelligentsia have stopped armed groups from grabbing the reins of power. Although elected or quasi-elected Bangladeshi leaders are often horribly corrupt and incompetent, they don’t simply endorse decisions — they actually make them. Ultimately responsible to their electorate, they are forced to invest in people instead of weapons or a massive military establishment.

For Pakistan, these are lessons to be pondered over. CPEC or no CPEC, it’s impossible to match India tank for tank or missile by missile. Surely it is time to get realistic. Shouting ‘Pakistan zindabad’ from the rooftops while obsequiously taking dictation from the Americans, Chinese, and Saudis has taken us nowhere. Announcing that we have become targets of a fifth-generation hi-tech secret subversion inflames national paranoia but is otherwise pointless. Instead, to move forward, Pakistan must transform its war economy into ultimately becoming a peace economy.
indeed, Bangladesh has done a great job..

Congratz Bangla..
 
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There are multiple reasons that has an impact on political and economic situation of Pakistan.
  • Pakistan nuclear weapon, and due to Nuclear weapons, many countries and agencies are trying their best to destabilize Pakistan
  • Active border on both east and west side
  • Multiple wars and law and order situation.
  • 3 million refugees afghan refugees
  • Corruption: Pakistani corrupt politicians taken IMF loans for development but they lauder development money to offshore accounts.
  • Corruption in like a poison which has destroyed every government institution, Judicial system, police and agencies are also not free from it.
From 2008-2018 was our worst period where we had one corrupt regime (Zardari) after the other (Sharifs). It was all made possible by behind the scene intervention by USA to bailing out corrupt Sharif's through Saudi led first NRO and second was British led for (PPP).
When you give criminals the power to rule, you will be what Pakistan is like today.
 
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