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Why Aurangzeb and Mahmud Ghazni are heroes in Pakistan but villains in India

ashoka did the force conver of approximately whole india into buddhism . but he is still a hero in india :) .
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what maratha did with the local Muslims of india ?
Ashoka was a Buddhist, he had forgone violence but his Kingdom wasn't a Buddhist nation. There was capital punishments, any rebellion in the kingdom was crushed with brute force. In effect his conversion had little effect on his kingdom.

You mean Maratha did to Bengal, it was the Capital of Mughals. They killed everyone, not picking people based on religion.
 
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For all our collective apathy towards history, the constant spotlight on the subject in Pakistan and India is mind-boggling. I say “collective apathy” because compared to the more commercially viable education degrees such as engineering, business, medicine and computer science, history as a formal discipline is rarely the top choice for students.

In the Pakistani context at least, the popular perspective is that those who study history do so to improve their chances in the civil services examination. While history books remain one of the most popular genres sold at bookstores, their limited sales in both countries has been much discussed over the years. The State too contributes to this apathy by allowing numerous historical monuments to gradually fade away due to the lack of interest or funds. Acts of vandalism by tourists in the form of names or numbers inscribed on protected monuments can also be seen everywhere.

However, despite this indifference towards our history, the subject is invoked in political discussions so very often. Many a time the same students who pass over history in university for more commercial courses end up forming rigid dogmas about each country’s historical past, which end up shaping the political discourse in both countries.

Partition in Pakistan
In Pakistan, Partition remains one of those subjects which everyone has an opinion about but not many understand. I remember once listening to Ayesha Jalal, a prominent historian and an expert on Partition of British-India, at the Lahore Literary Festival, when one of the audience members rejected her thesis on Partition outright as it challenged the conventional understanding of the creation of Pakistan. Similar comments can be found on social media in response to Jalal’s articles or interviews. Often these comments are personalised attacks as opposed to being counter-arguments.

With these fixed yet imaginary notions of Partition colouring the perspective of people in Pakistan, the country’s Hindu past is also imagined. In order to somehow justify the event, the country’s Hindu history was slowly filtered and whatever survived was maintained to fit into a particular framework. Thus Muslim rulers, particularly those who destroyed temples or defeated Hindu kings, became glorified heroes and the precursors of the Pakistan movement. These heroes include Muhammad Bin Qasim, Mahmud Ghazni, Muhammad of Ghor, Babur, Aurangzeb, Nadir Shah and Ahmad Shah Abdali. A simplistic narrative of their history, stripped of the social, political, and cultural ethos of the time, is broadcast. It made perfect sense therefore for Pakistan to name its missiles after these heroes.

If some historical figures were celebrated for one reason, others were criticised, even demonised. For instance, Raja Dahir, believed to be the last Hindu ruler of Sindh, was defeated by the iconic Muhammad Bin Qasim. In Pakistan today, Dahir symbolises a tyrant and politicians occasionally invoke him to refer to their opponents.


A lens of antagonism
For students, bureaucrats, politicians, journalists, and others who grew up with this overarching framework of history, the Hindu heritage in their midst – in their cities, villages, towns and mohallas – came to be seen through a lens of perennial conflict and antagonism. In a country that was now their own, which they had fought for and forcefully extracted from a Hindu India, how could they continue to live in localities called Krishan Nagar or Ram Bagh? Thus Krishan Nagar in Lahore, a suburban residential locality founded in the 1930s, became Islampura after Partition, while Ram Bagh in Karachi, a historical ground that once used to host the Ramlila and other Hindu religious celebrations, became Aram Bagh. These are just two of the prominent examples of renaming out of a myriad others, reflecting the changing political circumstances in the country.

In this framework of history who was the hero and who the villain remained contested, what was not challenged were the generalisations and the assumptions of this structure. To Hindu nationalists in India, the heroes of the Muslim nationalist perspectives became villains for the same reason they were celebrated in Pakistan.

In India, for instance, Mahmud Ghazni, became the reviled Muslim king who destroyed the Hindu temple of Somnath in present-day Gujarat, while Babur is seen as the ruler who laid the foundation of the oppressive Mughal Empire over the ruins of a highly refined Hindu civilisation. Both of these perspectives have internalised the categorisation of history into forced classifications of Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim and Sikh periods, bequeathed to them by a colonial state whose very survival was contingent upon the creation and the formalisation of these distinctions.

In this context, the recent renaming of Allahabad to Prayagraj, by the Uttar Pradesh government led by Adityanath, comes as no surprise. It reflects the ideology of Hindu nationalists. To them, the name change reflects a correction of historical injustices that the Hindu population was subjected to by Muslim rulers. The re-naming of Delhi’s Aurangzeb Road in 2015 to APJ Abdul Kalam Road was part of the same thought process.


Not a new phenomenon
Many people see this as a new phenomenon unleashed by the Hindu nationalist government ruling India. But there have been traces of this right from the start. A few years after India gained independence, the Somnath temple was reconstructed by the efforts of the Congress leader Vallabhbhai Patel. Due to its central position in this antagonistic framework between the two nationalist groups, the temple acquired a particular significance. Its reconstruction soon after 1947 was therefore an important political statement, representing what was viewed as the “revival” of the Hindu civilisation that had been “oppressed” by the long rule of Muslims.

No other historical ruler is at the heart of this contested history as Mahmud Ghazni and Aurangzeb. Both of them hold special positions in these nationalist interpretations. While one side views them as devoted Muslims bent upon spreading the true message of Islam in a pagan India, the other imagines them to be reviled characters who brutally oppressed the majority of the population due to their fanaticism.

Both of these narratives are highly problematic as are the inherent assumptions of this problematic framework that are a legacy of colonial rule. For as long as this framework continues to exist, these historical battles will continue to be fought not in our classrooms but in the streets, lanes and cities of India and Pakistan – as they are named and renamed over and over again, while history classrooms remain empty and history books gather dust.

-Haroon Khalid
https://scroll.in/article/900557/fi...-are-heroes-in-pakistan-but-villains-in-india

cuz of 2 nation theory.. Hindus and Muslims are two different nation.
why Rawan is hero in SL and villan in india?
 
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There is no point in arguing with Hindutva scum like this guy above.

If they can't be convinced to not rape their own Hindu women, what chance do we have to convince them of actual history?

Let them be, India is burning because of them right now.
They will be the end of that unnatural state.
 
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Ashoka was a Buddhist, he had forgone violence but his Kingdom wasn't a Buddhist nation. There was capital punishments, any rebellion in the kingdom was crushed with brute force. In effect his conversion had little effect on his kingdom.

You mean Maratha did to Bengal, it was the Capital of Mughals. They killed everyone, not picking people based on religion.
Ashoka should have united India into one ethnicity like China. Imagine how India would be if it was uniform like China
 
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Ashoka should have united India into one ethnicity like China. Imagine how India would be if it was uniform like China
There was no one ethnicity in India when Ashoka was ruling. People were mixed, it was more like a Europe, although Indians may appear similar, they have quite a lot of difference culturally that's connected to the geography. Unlike China where the territory is even and isolated from the rest of the world.
 
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There was no one ethnicity in India when Ashoka was ruling. People were mixed, it was more like a Europe, although Indians may appear similar, they have quite a lot of difference culturally that's connected to the geography. Unlike China where the territory is even and isolated from the rest of the world.
China also had many different ethnicities and languages but they were all crushed and united into one. india should have done the same.
 
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China also had many different ethnicities and languages but they were all crushed and united into one. india should have done the same.
China doesn't. They have around 90+% Han who speak same language.

India has hundreds of ethnicity and languages.
 
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China doesn't. They have around 90+% Han who speak same language.

India has hundreds of ethnicity and languages.
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China used to have so many different ethnicities and tribes before han dynasty but they were united into one han ethnic group.
 
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Ashoka was a Buddhist, he had forgone violence but his Kingdom wasn't a Buddhist nation. There was capital punishments, any rebellion in the kingdom was crushed with brute force. In effect his conversion had little effect on his kingdom.

You mean Maratha did to Bengal, it was the Capital of Mughals. They killed everyone, not picking people based on religion.
so in ashoka's era it was rebellion but in mughals era it was freedom fighter marathas :) .
what they did with nizam ?
 
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They both indeed used to be regarded as heroes in Hindustan. All changed after the British had taken over and started framing history as they wished. The first attack was on the cultural front by systematically diminishing Farsi as the lingua franca.
 
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so in ashoka's era it was rebellion but in mughals era it was freedom fighter marathas :) .
what they did with nizam ?
Eh! What are you on about here? If you don't know the history please don't deflect. Just now you claimed, Ashoka forcibly converted entire India into Buddhism, now you deflected onto rebellion? Whaa?
 
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Eh! What are you on about here? If you don't know the history please don't deflect. Just now you claimed, Ashoka forcibly converted entire India into Buddhism, now you deflected onto rebellion? Whaa?
lol you said ashoka used to crush "rebillion" .
my simple question do you consider maratha's rebillion a rebillion ?
 
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Why are there no weapons attributed to Aurangzeb Alamgir?

Ghanzi gets a missile.

Why did Aurangzeb not get anything?

I see a great conspiracy in this
 
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You can white wash Aurangzeb as much as you want, but he was a religious nutjob at heart. Sikhs rebelled only after Guru Tegh Bahadur was beheaded for refusing to convert to Islam. The next guru declared Mugals as their enemies and took an oath. Repeating illogical comments is not going to do any good, read something will you?

No one is whitewashing Aurangzeb, I am telling you that you cannot judge people based on today's standard. The Mughals were like any other ruler of India. They did what they did to defend their own kingdoms and you cannot blame religion for that. Aurangzeb was responsible for giving you your Indian heritage today. If he was not alive he would have not united India under one banner and made it the richest country on the planet at that time. I did read but it seems like you are trying to give me a lesson in your hindu history.

Nah you're just diverting because it's hard to justify a religious bigot considering there is ample evidence, records to prove my claim and your claims are just feelz. Sikhs have no saints, there are only 10 Sikh Gurus (teachers) not 11. 90% of the Sikhs live in India without any issues. Guess the scale would shift in India's direction any day with or without canadian Sikhs.

Sikhs only fought after their religious figure was executed by Aurangazeb, and he didn't put any revolt that lead to his incarceration and subsequent execution. Sikhs were like Buddhists, preached peace until they pushed the violence out of them. Nothing surprising there even Buddhists are going bonkers.

The analogy stands for itself. The fact is that Gandhi Drove her tanks into the golden temple and that radicalized the Sikhs at that time.

Hey genius, I know what Zakat is, I don't have to have deep understanding of Sharia to read historic records. Use your sources, which you rarely do, rather than making blanket statements like no man can do it. Well, he did it. Congrats.

That's my point to go read about Zakat. A Muslim ruler cannot abolish the zakat and that is a fact. Just for your information. An eligible person must pay Zakat and it is a religious obligation. You should read and then discuss these matters. Jizya was 2.5 percent at that time during Aurgenzeb's rule. Same as zakat. How much tax do you pay in india now? you don't know what you are talking about..


That's convenient, bigots whose sole aim was destroying idols as their religious purpose to Hindu kings, who considered those idols brought wealth and power to their kingdoms.

Again these people did things just like any other rulers at that time. They looted temples because that was the norm. If temples had wealth they looted it just like other Hindus or Muslims Ruler. Don't spew your bjp bullshit here.

Yeah, proves my point. Aurangzeb was a religious nutjob and executed countless peaceful people for simply refusing to convert to Islam. Such barbarisms maybe okay for you, it's not easily forgotten in here at least. And white washed it as rebellion and the king doing what's necessary.

So it is countless now..? The barbarism was normal for the times. He executed people that were threating his kingdom just like any government does. Just like you guys are doing in Kashmir and Assam. We don't need your Hindu morality here. He knew very well how peaceful Hindus can be. A lot of Hindus were in his nobility but you won't talk about that. He had many hindu administrators. if he was such a bigot then why would he hire them? Don't sensationalize history and romanticize people just because they believe the same things you do. You are the religious bigot.

Keep wishing for it, it's more likely you go through another 1971 again.

Good Bollywood line. Now you can change your clothes and dance in the fields..

lol you said ashoka used to crush "rebillion" .
my simple question do you consider maratha's rebillion a rebillion ?

No, he doesn't because they were Hindu rebels.
 
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