Where PAC is Lacking...

[-angRyPlayeR]

With Growing Needs of Air Forces strong bases of Industry is Required.

Specially When we see No.1 ranked Air Force in the world United States Air Force.

Whats make is strong is its Private sector. Boeing, General Electronics and Loockheed Martin are biggest cats in game to be mentioned. All of these companies belongs to private sector and registered in stock market.These companies work on contract for United States to fullfill its requirements.

Lockheed Martin is one of the largest companies in the aerospace, defense, security, and technologies industry and is largest defense contractor. It creates lots of defense products like robotics, aircrafts , radars. Its also manufacturer of F-35

General Electric (GE) is an American multinational conglomerate corporation incorporated in New York[5] and headquartered in Boston, Massachusetts.[2] As of 2016, the company operates through the following segments: Aviation, Current, Digital, Energy Connections, Global Research, Healthcare, Lighting, Oil and Gas, Power, Renewable Energy, Transportation, and Capital which cater to the needs of Financial services, Medical devices, Life Sciences, Pharmaceutical, Automotive, Software Development and Engineering industries.

Boeing is also another Big Fish in this game. I produces transport aircraft for US Air Force along with many other products.

Now looking at PAC,

PAC is only aircraft manufacture facility which is build by Air Force and works under Government. PAC is supported by little to none private in sectors in many facilities.
PAC is working at its most potential.

But looking to future challenges, Its not enough. Without the support for private sector PAF cann't grow as fast to meet future requirements.

 

[Imran Khan]

they are working fine they did not lack and private firms working but pakistani market is not that much big . only defense sector is not for invest

 

[CriticalThought]

In order for private sector to get involved, you first need enlightened AND rich people who have the foresight to invest in technology. Some of the richest people in Pakistan are Nawaz Sharif and Asif Ali Zardari. Close this thread now! (just kiddin')

 

[Rank]

So many factors, one of "Payment issues" second "In-house officiers and people on the stop obsession with the foreign equipment" third "baray baray khaanchay not possible locally" forth "WE ARE SERIOUSLY way toooooooo behind" and fifth "Zero R&D, knowledge, understanding of modern equipment, extremely less experince as compare to int military complex"

 

[CriticalThought]

So many factors, one of "Payment issues" second "In-house officiers and people on the stop obsession with the foreign equipment" third "baray baray khaanchay not possible locally" forth "WE ARE SERIOUSLY way toooooooo behind" and fifth "Zero R&D, knowledge, understanding of modern equipment, extremely less experince as compare to int military complex"

I think PAF personnel understand the threats very well, but they remain extremely tight lipped. People at the levels of Air Marshal, Air Vice Marshal could probably give us a very good lesson in modern air combat. Unfortunately, their focus on War on Terror has taken them into COIN types of information. A campaign against a modern airforce is going to be very different from COIN. We need to evolve the strategy and the capability for it.

 

[-angRyPlayeR]

Without the involvement of private sector the gap will keep increasing.
We still don't manufacture major components like jet, radar.

 

[!eon]

PAC, HIT, Karachi Steel mills or any other govt industry doesn't work in the way an industrial unit should work.
Their are living in their own world of officer shahi and chay pani.
They should learn from some highly industrialized country, how industries and industrial units work and leave their officer shahi, chay pani culture.

 

[-angRyPlayeR]

PAC, HIT, Karachi Steel mills or any other govt industry doesn't work in the way an industrial unit should work.
Their are living in their own world of officer shahi and chay pani.
They should learn from some highly industrialized country, how industries and industrial units work and leave their officer shahi, chay pani culture.

I agree with you.
There is difference between organization structure between private and government industry.
Private sector tends to be more creative and productive as result matters to its owner where in govt. industry there is no check and balance and non-productive staff remains in the team irrespective of their work.

Someone has to step up and create an example to follow

 

[Raider 21]

Lacks proper R&D, only military personnel (DG Kamra for example) are allowed to be senior engineers and test pilots (most aren't even qualified to be test pilots, thanks to their lack of engineering degrees), and way too flashy in their presentations. Those are observations from a recent visit. It has its plus points, but here are some of the minus points, and there is no harm in criticism to see improvement.

 

[CriticalThought]

Lacks proper R&D, only military personnel (DG Kamra for example) are allowed to be senior engineers and test pilots (most aren't even qualified to be test pilots, thanks to their lack of engineering degrees), and way too flashy in their presentations. Those are observations from a recent visit. It has its plus points, but here are some of the minus points, and there is no harm in criticism to see improvement.

I thought the Aviation Design Institute (AvDI) has already started work on design concepts for 5th gen? This would require very advanced R&D efforts, it seems?

 

[Raider 21]

I thought the Aviation Design Institute (AvDI) has already started work on design concepts for 5th gen? This would require very advanced R&D efforts, it seems?

They can design all they want, until they have the metallurgy to build something coupled with the machinery and manpower.....it will just stay as blueprints in a department.

 

[CriticalThought]

They can design all they want, until they have the metallurgy to build something coupled with the machinery and manpower.....it will just stay as blueprints in a department.

Well, after paper design and before actual manufacturing, there is still computer simulations and wind tunnel testing. I was hoping they would be getting a modest super-computing facility and a proper wind tunnel to validate their design?

So far, my understanding is that advanced metallic alloys only help in reducing weight. If they are being constrained by metallurgy, I would keep my ambitions on a light fighter but keep the momentum going. It is essential to acquire the experience of going through this design and development phase and come out with a finalized design that is ready for production and testing.

 

[Raider 21]

Well, after paper design and before actual manufacturing, there is still computer simulations and wind tunnel testing. I was hoping they would be getting a modest super-computing facility and a proper wind tunnel to validate their design?

So far, my understanding is that advanced metallic alloys only help in reducing weight. If they are being constrained by metallurgy, I would keep my ambitions on a light fighter but keep the momentum going. It is essential to acquire the experience of going through this design and development phase and come out with a finalized design that is ready for production and testing.

And raw materials....

 

[CriticalThought]

And raw materials....

If only national resources were not being squandered, paying penalties of Reko Diq and IPPs...

I am amazed how the forces can let this happen to themselves. With visible and irrefutable proof of treason, they should just do the needful...

 

[bafxet]

Induction of private sector is absolutely vital for the self reliance and future growth of PAF. It would enhance production, bring innovation and make products competitive.

Even in public sector improved coordination is need. Like in order to manufacture engines at home, steel of specific grade is needed. For this metallurgical requirement Pakistan Steel must be prepared to cater the future need of PAC.