What an irony! Mainland China beats US to be India's biggest trade partner in H1FY21

[masterchief_mirza]

Morover india's trade with china/HK is probable as real trade as it gets. Whereas with US etc there is probably a great deal of under invoicing/over invoicing because of indian elites present in both places. Look at the decline in trade from switzerland which has the swiss banks


Yea but where are the results on the ground, Your imports collapsed well over 40 percent with largest trading partner but held well with china.

Sad truth is Modi is addicted to China. He neeeeeeds China. He gets withdrawal symptoms when he doesn't get China.....and then he withdraws his army when he gets too much China.

@rott

 

[xyxmt]

Imports from China will continue to reduce as the consumer in India has now started replacing Chinese products with Indian or alternatives , companies are planning to stop buying Lenovo laptops also now ...this trends will increase as it’s on top agenda of bjp and RSS

this is biggest non-sense we hear about trade wars, consumer don't give crap about local or foreign products but the best match of quality and price. Lets open Indian market to Pakistani products and see it for yourself.

 

[PakPrinciples]

Even if India breaks off trade with China, it will have little impact on China

Net Exports is a component of GDP and based on China's trade figures with India from 2018 it only accounted for for less than 0.5% of China's GDP whereas 4.5% of India's GDP is dependent on it's trade with China.

The nonsense the Indian government engages in or the propaganda it pushes regarding the impact they will have on China is for show. It helps distract its people from the truth while diverting their anger and energy into meaningless pursuits and away from criticism and hostility towards the Indian government.

But you can’t boycott it simply because whatever we sell you can’t be boycotted. We sell things who’s substitute will require diversifying your supply chain, India is your one stop destination for metals like steel and etc boycotting which will cause you to import the same from a lot of countries.

Not really, you need to look at what India exports to the Chinese.

Iron Ore accounts for approximately 6% of India's exports to China and though Australia was a much larger supplier for the Chinese (65.4% of its ore imports vs 1.63% from India) it has a lot of other options:

• Simandou in Guinea houses the worlds largest undeveloped Iron ore deposit and is a very likely contender to replace Australia particularly considering the ore is of better quality.
• Brazil has increasing iron ore production which is already challenging Australia and they're seeking export markets.
• Pakistan's Kalabagh will need to be invested in and developed in particular for Pakistan considering our housing shortage is probably the worst in Asia just shy of Afghanistan while there are a host of other infrastructure investments that need to be made which will require an immense amount of steel. That level of production would make the ore and associated steel produced highly competitive globally and could be exported onwards into China.

India's largest export to China is probably refined petroleum which accounts for 17.3% of India's exports to the Chinese. In terms of refined petroleum not only can it be produced in a nation like Pakistan it also happens to be one of our fastest growing exports to China and it just makes a lot of sense to develop it in Pakistan to begin with:

• Iran's vast oil and gas fields lie next door and it's clear that Pakistan is seeking to interconnect our North South pipeline system with a future Iran-Pakistan pipeline system the Iranians have already built up to the border while developing a pipeline infrastructure that stretches from the West to the East of their own country. Based on what I've observed it appears that Pakistan is seeking to refine the fuel in the country to use locally and export via pipelines into China that could be extended further to supply oil and gas to Japan, Indonesia and Malaysia. Completely changing how oil and gas is transported in Asia and boosting China's relations with other Asian countries to mitigate the threat the US represents regionally.
• What I'm interested to see is if Pakistan's vast lignite fields can be converted into liquid fuels not only for domestic consumption but also to be transported via that pipeline network into China and beyond.

Another large export to the Chinese is non-retail pure cotton yarn and Pakistan almost exports as much to China already.

Honestly in terms of most of India's other exports they're value added products that can easily be sourced elsewhere particularly countries like Pakistan.

You're right that supply chains don't change overnight but they can over time.

 

[HostileInsurgent]

Net Exports is a component of GDP and based on China's trade figures with India from 2018 it only accounted for for less than 0.5% of China's GDP whereas 4.5% of India's GDP is dependent on it's trade with China.

The nonsense the Indian government engages in or the propaganda it pushes regarding the impact they will have on China is for show. It helps distract its people from the truth while diverting their anger and energy into meaningless pursuits and away from criticism and hostility towards the Indian government.



Not really, you need to look at what India exports to the Chinese.

Iron Ore accounts for approximately 6% of India's exports to China and though Australia was a much larger supplier for the Chinese (65.4% of its ore imports vs 1.63% from India) it has a lot of other options:

• Simandou in Guinea houses the worlds largest undeveloped Iron ore deposit and is a very likely contender to replace Australia particularly considering the ore is of better quality.
• Brazil has increasing iron ore production which is already challenging Australia and they're seeking export markets.
• Pakistan's Kalabagh will need to be invested in and developed in particular for Pakistan considering our housing shortage is probably the worst in Asia just shy of Afghanistan while there are a host of other infrastructure investments that need to be made which will require an immense amount of steel. That level of production would make the ore and associated steel produced highly competitive globally and could be exported onwards into China.

India's largest export to China is probably refined petroleum which accounts for 17.3% of India's exports to the Chinese. In terms of refined petroleum not only can it be produced in a nation like Pakistan it also happens to be one of our fastest growing exports to China and it just makes a lot of sense to develop it in Pakistan to begin with:

• Iran's vast oil and gas fields lie next door and it's clear that Pakistan is seeking to interconnect our North South pipeline system with a future Iran-Pakistan pipeline system the Iranians have already built up to the border while developing a pipeline infrastructure that stretches from the West to the East of their own country. Based on what I've observed it appears that Pakistan is seeking to refine the fuel in the country to use locally and export via pipelines into China that could be extended further to supply oil and gas to Japan, Indonesia and Malaysia. Completely changing how oil and gas is transported in Asia and boosting China's relations with other Asian countries to mitigate the threat the US represents regionally.
• What I'm interested to see is if Pakistan's vast lignite fields can be converted into liquid fuels not only for domestic consumption but also to be transported via that pipeline network into China and beyond.

Another large export to the Chinese is non-retail pure cotton yarn and Pakistan almost exports as much to China already.

Honestly in terms of most of India's other exports they're value added products that can easily be sourced elsewhere particularly countries like Pakistan.

You're right that supply chains don't change overnight but they can over time.

I’m talking about steel, China is number 1 in producing steel and India is at number 2, and China produces 8 times what India does and yet China requires to import steel also, shows how much they use it for manufacturing, construction etc at an aggressive rate.

China emerges biggest consumer of Indian steel, bought 29% of April-September exports

Outbound shipments  to  China account for 29% of total in Apr-Sep

www.livemint.com

 

[rott]

Sad truth is Modi is addicted to China. He neeeeeeds China. He gets withdrawal symptoms when he doesn't get China.....and then he withdraws his when he gets too much China.

@rott

I think we should beat them more. Our trade will increase.

India should aim to be China's friend.

They can't be anyone's friend.
Only 2 option.
1. A bully (To smaller countries)
2. A pet. (To powerful countries)

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

What an irony! Mainland China beats US to be India's biggest trade partner in H1FY21
Indo-China bilateral trade registered a 15 per cent decline at nearly $38 billion while trade with the US dropped 27.5 per cent at $33.54 billion. Like China, India's bilateral trade with Hong Kong has also suffered -- declining by 25.7 per cent at $11.2 billion
Sumant Banerji | December 4, 2020 | Updated 22:48 IST


Key Highlights

• Indo-China trade stands at $38 billion as of H1 2020-21
• The US comes second as India's trade partner at $33.54 billion
• Bilateral trade with China declines by 15% but it suffered more with the US at 27.5%.
• India's overall trade declines by 32.5% reflecting the impact of the pandemic this year
• Overall imports decline by 40%, but those from China only by 24.5%
• Imports from Hong Kong drop by only 23.9% at $6.85 billion
• India's exports to China were also strong -- growing by 26.2% at $10.16 billion
• China overtakes UAE as the second biggest export market for India
• US stays ahead at $21.93 billion, but suffers a 17.8% decline

What an irony! At a time when the two nations' diplomatic, military and economic relations have hit a new low, mainland China has emerged as India's biggest trade partner in the first half of financial year 2020-21, pipping the US, which had held that position since 2018-19.

In a year that has been ravaged by the pandemic, India's overall trade with the world outside has suffered a 32.46 per cent drop in value terms at $275 billion. Mainland China has gained over the US by suffering less. Indo-China bilateral trade registered a 15 per cent decline at nearly $38 billion while trade with the US dropped 27.5 per cent at $33.54 billion. Even on the large base, India's trade with China has suffered the least as compared to any other region in the world.

Two factors have helped Indo-China trade. While India's overall imports have dropped nearly 40 per cent this fiscal at $149.53 billion, imports from China have dropped by only 24.53 per cent at $27.37 billion. In comparison, imports from the US declined 41 per cent and from the middle eastern countries like UAE, Saudi Arabia and Iraq -- India's main crude oil suppliers, by 42 per cent, 53 per cent and 52 per cent, respectively. The only other region to show similar resilience in imports was Hong Kong from where many of Chinese origin imports is routed to India. Like China, India's bilateral trade with Hong Kong has also, as a result, suffered less -- declining by 25.7 per cent at $11.2 billion. On its own, Hong Kong is India's fourth largest trade partner. Trade with China and Hong Kong together, was at $49.16 billion, 17.7 per cent less than in H1 2019-20.

The second factor that has contributed to India-China trade this year, is robust export of goods and merchandise from India to China. At a time when overall exports declined by 21.13 per cent at $125.53 billion, exports to China grew by a robust 26.2 per cent at $10.16 billion. Exports to most other regions including the US -- India's largest export destination, has declined.

"China was first to open up its economy and it simply came to the international markets and gobbled up whatever was available. They bought a lot of steel and iron ore from India in the middle of the year and that is what the figures indicate," said a commerce ministry official. "This is a very unusual year. A lot of goods that were ordered last fiscal are reflected on the books this year. So, we should take it with a pinch of salt."

The relatively modest decline in imports from China maybe surprising as due to rising geopolitical tensions and China's alleged role in COVID-19, there has been a proliferation of anti-China feeling in India. Trade organisations like Confederation of All India Traders have been campaigning against Chinese goods vowing to boycott as many as 3000 items that are usually imported from across the great wall. It has even set a target of reducing imports from China by as much as $13.3 billion by next December.

At the same time, the government has also taken a number of steps to curb imports from mainland China. These include a partial ban on import of colour televisions and a complete ban on import of air conditioners and refrigerants. Safeguard duties on import of solar panels and modules were also extended for a third year in July while anti-dumping duty has been imposed on a range of goods imported from China such as digital printing plates, aniline -- used for dyes and drugs, synthetic rubber and steel and glass measuring tapes among others. India also decided to screen each and every FDI proposal from China that has led to a hold up of the entry of a number of Chinese automobile players like Great Wall Motors, Geely, Changan and BYD.

Further, 267 software applications with origins in China have been banned in the country over the last three months. The bottom line is Chinese goods and investments are no longer encouraged in India. The proof of that, however, is yet to show in the numbers.

"It is too early to gauge that. The policy actions take some time to show on the ground. For them to be visible on trade statistics also takes a bit longer," said a government official. "This is not a short-term thing being done for short-term gains. It is a long-term strategy. For sure, the numbers will follow."

What an irony! Mainland China beats US to be India's biggest trade partner in H1FY21

Indo-China bilateral trade registered a 15 per cent decline at nearly $38 billion while trade with the US dropped 27.5 per cent at $33.54 billion. Even on the large base, India's trade with China has suffered the least as compared to any other region in t

www.businesstoday.in

Based on the Indian propaganda and Western News Media many would have imagined and assumed that Australia, Japan and Vietnam as India top trading partners.

 

[rott]

Modi laughs at idiots like you who believe his top agenda is to detach from China dependency. He says stuff he needs to say to get votes from idiots. Seems to be working. Meanwhile he laughs all the way to the bank however many biharis fall into freezing rivers.

Bro, why are you bullying them?

 

[lonelyman]

What an irony! Mainland China beats US to be India's biggest trade partner in H1FY21
Indo-China bilateral trade registered a 15 per cent decline at nearly $38 billion while trade with the US dropped 27.5 per cent at $33.54 billion. Like China, India's bilateral trade with Hong Kong has also suffered -- declining by 25.7 per cent at $11.2 billion
Sumant Banerji | December 4, 2020 | Updated 22:48 IST


Key Highlights

• Indo-China trade stands at $38 billion as of H1 2020-21
• The US comes second as India's trade partner at $33.54 billion
• Bilateral trade with China declines by 15% but it suffered more with the US at 27.5%.
• India's overall trade declines by 32.5% reflecting the impact of the pandemic this year
• Overall imports decline by 40%, but those from China only by 24.5%
• Imports from Hong Kong drop by only 23.9% at $6.85 billion
• India's exports to China were also strong -- growing by 26.2% at $10.16 billion
• China overtakes UAE as the second biggest export market for India
• US stays ahead at $21.93 billion, but suffers a 17.8% decline

What an irony! At a time when the two nations' diplomatic, military and economic relations have hit a new low, mainland China has emerged as India's biggest trade partner in the first half of financial year 2020-21, pipping the US, which had held that position since 2018-19.

In a year that has been ravaged by the pandemic, India's overall trade with the world outside has suffered a 32.46 per cent drop in value terms at $275 billion. Mainland China has gained over the US by suffering less. Indo-China bilateral trade registered a 15 per cent decline at nearly $38 billion while trade with the US dropped 27.5 per cent at $33.54 billion. Even on the large base, India's trade with China has suffered the least as compared to any other region in the world.

Two factors have helped Indo-China trade. While India's overall imports have dropped nearly 40 per cent this fiscal at $149.53 billion, imports from China have dropped by only 24.53 per cent at $27.37 billion. In comparison, imports from the US declined 41 per cent and from the middle eastern countries like UAE, Saudi Arabia and Iraq -- India's main crude oil suppliers, by 42 per cent, 53 per cent and 52 per cent, respectively. The only other region to show similar resilience in imports was Hong Kong from where many of Chinese origin imports is routed to India. Like China, India's bilateral trade with Hong Kong has also, as a result, suffered less -- declining by 25.7 per cent at $11.2 billion. On its own, Hong Kong is India's fourth largest trade partner. Trade with China and Hong Kong together, was at $49.16 billion, 17.7 per cent less than in H1 2019-20.

The second factor that has contributed to India-China trade this year, is robust export of goods and merchandise from India to China. At a time when overall exports declined by 21.13 per cent at $125.53 billion, exports to China grew by a robust 26.2 per cent at $10.16 billion. Exports to most other regions including the US -- India's largest export destination, has declined.

"China was first to open up its economy and it simply came to the international markets and gobbled up whatever was available. They bought a lot of steel and iron ore from India in the middle of the year and that is what the figures indicate," said a commerce ministry official. "This is a very unusual year. A lot of goods that were ordered last fiscal are reflected on the books this year. So, we should take it with a pinch of salt."

The relatively modest decline in imports from China maybe surprising as due to rising geopolitical tensions and China's alleged role in COVID-19, there has been a proliferation of anti-China feeling in India. Trade organisations like Confederation of All India Traders have been campaigning against Chinese goods vowing to boycott as many as 3000 items that are usually imported from across the great wall. It has even set a target of reducing imports from China by as much as $13.3 billion by next December.

At the same time, the government has also taken a number of steps to curb imports from mainland China. These include a partial ban on import of colour televisions and a complete ban on import of air conditioners and refrigerants. Safeguard duties on import of solar panels and modules were also extended for a third year in July while anti-dumping duty has been imposed on a range of goods imported from China such as digital printing plates, aniline -- used for dyes and drugs, synthetic rubber and steel and glass measuring tapes among others. India also decided to screen each and every FDI proposal from China that has led to a hold up of the entry of a number of Chinese automobile players like Great Wall Motors, Geely, Changan and BYD.

Further, 267 software applications with origins in China have been banned in the country over the last three months. The bottom line is Chinese goods and investments are no longer encouraged in India. The proof of that, however, is yet to show in the numbers.

"It is too early to gauge that. The policy actions take some time to show on the ground. For them to be visible on trade statistics also takes a bit longer," said a government official. "This is not a short-term thing being done for short-term gains. It is a long-term strategy. For sure, the numbers will follow."

What an irony! Mainland China beats US to be India's biggest trade partner in H1FY21

Indo-China bilateral trade registered a 15 per cent decline at nearly $38 billion while trade with the US dropped 27.5 per cent at $33.54 billion. Even on the large base, India's trade with China has suffered the least as compared to any other region in t

www.businesstoday.in

So much so called boycott China , rss does it in mouth not in action

 

[Leishangthem]

.

The cringe of being a lankan boy incessantly berating south Asian.You so desperately want to fit in the 1st world bloc but with the genetic (inherent appearence,character,aptitude & body language) deposition and culture, it wouldn't wrest.

 

[PakPrinciples]

I’m talking about steel, China is number 1 in producing steel and India is at number 2, and China produces 8 times what India does and yet China requires to import steel also, shows how much they use it for manufacturing, construction etc at an aggressive rate.

China emerges biggest consumer of Indian steel, bought 29% of April-September exports

Outbound shipments  to  China account for 29% of total in Apr-Sep

www.livemint.com

China imports an almost insignificant amount of steel.

For example in 2018 they imported around $750 Million USD of steel ingots. Yes, they import other steel products but even combined they're small compared to other metal imports like copper (refined, raw and scrap copper and copper plating) which they imported approximately $35 Billion USD worth in 2018 representing about 1/3 of their total metals imports that year whereas Iron Ore (mineral) imports amounted to almost $60 Billion worth in 2018.

So they produce a lot of steel but they don't import much.

Personally I am of the view that industry is moving towards localized and specifically automated manufacturing with most future steel demand coming from places like South Asia and continents like Africa that are going to either see the fastest population growth and/or growth in their middle and upper class populations necessitating the demand for new housing, commercial buildings, storage facilities, rail networks as well as consumer demand for goods.

China is hard to predict.

Personally I would think their infrastructure boom is largely over though this depends on the infrastructure requirements of Western China and how its population moves otherwise not sure what else there is to build. There are ghost cities they need to move people into and could likely fill them if they abandon the Hukou system which should have been abolished years back like the 1 child policy. However, that isn't going to create increased demand for housing or subways or other products that require steel like we saw in the past 30 years considering their population is projected to decline to 1.06 Billion by 2100.

So with less demand at home and all that extra capacity from their own production you're likely to see a decline in their overall steel and iron ore demand.

It's more likely Chinese companies will setup local manufacturing in other countries to meet those nations respective demands and India is probably better off doing the same.

Then again there are articles that say otherwise, that China's infrastructure will continue to see strong growth.

 

[HostileInsurgent]

China imports an almost insignificant amount of steel.

For example in 2018 they imported around $750 Million USD of steel ingots. Yes, they import other steel products but even combined they're small compared to other metal imports like copper (refined, raw and scrap copper and copper plating) which they imported approximately $35 Billion USD worth in 2018 representing about 1/3 of their total metals imports that year whereas Iron Ore (mineral) imports amounted to almost $60 Billion worth in 2018.

So they produce a lot of steel but they don't import much.

Personally I am of the view that industry is moving towards localized and specifically automated manufacturing with most future steel demand coming from places like South Asia and continents like Africa that are going to either see the fastest population growth and/or growth in their middle and upper class populations necessitating the demand for new housing, commercial buildings, storage facilities, rail networks as well as consumer demand for goods.

China is hard to predict.

Personally I would think their infrastructure boom is largely over though this depends on the infrastructure requirements of Western China and how its population moves otherwise not sure what else there is to build. There are ghost cities they need to move people into and could likely fill them if they abandon the Hukou system which should have been abolished years back like the 1 child policy. However, that isn't going to create increased demand for housing or subways or other products that require steel like we saw in the past 30 years considering their population is projected to decline to 1.06 Billion by 2100.

So with less demand at home and all that extra capacity from their own production you're likely to see a decline in their overall steel and iron ore demand.

It's more likely Chinese companies will setup local manufacturing in other countries to meet those nations respective demands and India is probably better off doing the same.

Then again there are articles that say otherwise, that China's infrastructure will continue to see strong growth.

I can’t understand economics much but can you pls explain me that I’ve heard that there were many cities developed but many of them became ghost towns then how are they not going in loss?

 

[PakPrinciples]

I can’t understand economics much but can you pls explain me that I’ve heard that there were many cities developed but many of them became ghost towns then how are they not going in loss?

I'm not an expert on this.

Personally I think this isn't a problem as some are making it out to be because China has hundreds of millions of people in rural villages that could flood into those towns and the government is currently working on reforms to the Hukou system.

It is very likely that those towns were actually built specifically to house those rural Chinese citizens that urbanize but reforms to the Hukou system were slower than expected hence why they sit empty.

Something like 500 Million Chinese citizens live in rural areas in which case, if true, and they do move into the cities which is very likely to happen China could see strong infrastructure development for years to come but I just don't see them needing as much steel as they did in the past.