U.S F35 beaten by F16 in dogfight

[AMDR]

Like I've said before on here 100000 times, the AIM-9X Block II + DAS will be the ace card for the F-35 that it needs in WVR. No worries

 

[holysaturn]

Let US know when the 3rd rated countries of their citizens who criticizes the F-35 can produce something even halfway capable.

May be 3rd RATED COUNTRIES are not willing to bankrupt their countries to feed a fat Military-Industrial-Congressional complex. What we are witnessing with the F-35 are the consequences of the "revolving door".

 

[Shinigami]

Let US know when the 3rd rated countries of their citizens who criticizes the F-35 can produce something even halfway capable.

i doubt if its halfway capable but a clone does exist

 

[IND151]

@gambit , a professional once commented, ''providing you see your opponent in time, nothing can beat you in an F-16''..... PAF pilots repeatedly fleecing the Typhoons and Eagles, while flying in a Falcon has also been documented.
What's your take on OP.... can we see the LM production line getting busy again.

If the opponent is using F 22, the F 16 will not win.

Same will be the case in WVR as F 22 has far better engines, far better jamming equipment and more energy (plus Supercrusie capability).

 

[Windjammer]

If the opponent is using F 22, the F 16 will not win.

Same will be the case in WVR as F 22 has far better engines, far better jamming equipment and more energy (plus Supercrusie capability).

But then again, how many opponents will or can field the F-22. !!

 

[IND151]

But then again, how many opponents will or can field the F-22. !!

You said "@gambit , a professional once commented, ''providing you see your opponent in time, nothing can beat you in an F-16''..... PAF pilots repeatedly fleecing the Typhoons and Eagles, while flying in a Falcon has also been documented.
What's your take on OP.... can we see the LM production line getting busy again."

I merely pointed out how wrong the above statement (bolded) is.

 

[thesolar65]

What are the best planes for dogfights??

 

[Windjammer]

You said "@gambit , a professional once commented, ''providing you see your opponent in time, nothing can beat you in an F-16''..... PAF pilots repeatedly fleecing the Typhoons and Eagles, while flying in a Falcon has also been documented.
What's your take on OP.... can we see the LM production line getting busy again."

I merely pointed out how wrong the above statement (bolded) is.

Maybe because that professional belongs to the USAF, who never envisaged going into battle against the F-22 or maybe because he knows much more than what we merely read off the screen.

 

[cerberus]

its More on Pilot Skill Not just on the Fighter

Rafale Bested F-22 in Dogfight is Proof

 

[F-22Raptor]

Joint Program Office Response to “War is Boring” Blog

The media report on the F-35 and F-16 flight does not tell the entire story. The F-35 involved was AF-2, which is an F-35 designed for flight sciences testing, or flying qualities, of the aircraft. It is not equipped with a number of items that make today's production F-35s 5th Generation fighters.

Aircraft AF-2 did not have the mission systems software to use the sensors that allow the F-35 to see its enemy long before it knows the F-35 is in the area. Second, AF-2 does not have the special stealth coating that operational F-35s have that make them virtually invisible to radar. And third, it is not equipped with the weapons or software that allow the F-35 pilot to turn, aim a weapon with the helmet, and fire at an enemy without having to point the airplane at its target.

The tests cited in the article were done earlier this year to test the flying qualities of the F-35 using visual combat maneuvers to stress the system, and the F-16 involved was used as a visual reference to maneuver against. While the dogfighting scenario was successful in showing the ability of the F-35 to maneuver to the edge of its limits without exceeding them, and handle in a positive and predictable manner, the interpretation of the scenario results could be misleading. The F-35's technology is designed to engage, shoot, and kill its enemy from long distances, not necessarily in visual "dogfighting" situations. There have been numerous occasions where a four-ship of F-35s has engaged a four-ship of F-16s in simulated combat scenarios and the F-35s won each of those encounters because of its sensors, weapons, and stealth technology.

The release of this FOUO report is being investigated. The candid feedback provided by our test community is welcomed because it makes what we do better.

The disclosure of this report should not discourage our warfighters and test community from providing the Program Office and Lockheed Martin with honest assessments of the F-35's capabilities.

Joint Program Office Response to "War is Boring" Blog | F-35 Lightning II

 

[Adecypher]

Actually, the report itself is distorted

What about this one...there might be some "truth" to the ongoing problems F-35 is facing...otherwise why a need to publish something? Just asking...

F-35 struggles in dogfight with F-16 it will replace: Pilot at ‘distinct energy disadvantage’

 

[jhungary]

What about this one...there might be some "truth" to the ongoing problems F-35 is facing...otherwise why a need to publish something? Just asking...

F-35 struggles in dogfight with F-16 it will replace: Pilot at ‘distinct energy disadvantage’

First of all, I did not say nor claim the F-35 project is flawless nor perfect, nothing is flawless and perfect Simply I cannot name any of the fighter or commercial aircraft made by the US have not suffer any inherit flaw from the start.

What I said "Distorted" is the source of the subject, as an former Army Intelligence Officer myself, I can tell you I know this game too well. When article like this is supposed to be from "An US Pilot" of any sort but when there are coming to exactly who or what position in that supposed pilot tell us, it would be impossible as they are usually anonymous.

Now, that's present a distinct opportunities here to write a blank cheque to establish what they want.

Now, when you ask the person who wrote this article, he would have said "Oh, since this is classified, I cannot give you the name of the source" Quite convenience.

What I was saying is, treat these kind of report with a grain of salt, use common sense. If the F-35 would actually be such a lemon, there would already be whistle blower like Edward Snowden and come here and tell us what was going on and it would have been on the record. Do you think we lack of people who won't cherish the chance to discredit the US Government anytime when there is a chance??

 

[Adecypher]

Do you think we lack of people who won't cherish the chance to discredit the US Government anytime when there is a chance??

I just hope that the negative speculations are not that substantial...the budget to maintain this birdy for the next 4 years is 1 B USD.

 

[IND151]

Maybe because that professional belongs to the USAF, who never envisaged going into battle against the F-22 or maybe because he knows much more than what we merely read off the screen.

F 16 will never be able to beat F 22.

 

[Arsalan]

How do you know that is a quote from a US Test pilot? Or if he is an Pilot of any kind? Because the article said so?

Even in that case was the media source from a third world country? please check that, before BLAMING anyone one must at least check out if there is anything to blame for. You cannot say that his response was because some PREVIOUS trend, we are here on this thread and the words used were uncalled for.

While I agree to some degree (On a condition that China will win a War with US only in home soil) that neither US nor China can win one on their side, but the problem is, today warfare don't need to win battle to win a war, Vietnam War told us just that.

Think about it, if a War indeed happened in SCS or even inside Chinese Border, US may not win the war, but the loser would be definitely China. At this point, the Military Threat from China is minimal, even Russia present a bigger challenge to US than China, as Chinese Influence only limited to some selective country (Namely Pakistan and Some Time North Korea, depending on how fat Kim feel that morning), basically that's contained in the Asian Region Russia have influence a lot more broadly, range from Asia, South America to Europe,

Trade are independent to Geo politic. Country trade, that's the business side of the story, People trade to make money, they don't trade to make power, it's naïve to expect one country can use trade as a weapon to force their view on geopolitics. You know in reality what those country is going to do? They will take your money and say thank you and walk away.

US had that in the 50s when Cuba say thank you and walk away
US had that in the 70s when Iran say thank you and walk away
US had that in the 80s when Afghanistan and Iraq say thank you and walk away.
US had that in the 90s and 2000 when Venezuela and Bolivia say thank you and walked away

Why do you think it won't happen to China?

You can change your trading partner, as long as there are money to be made, there will be trade, it does not matter which country, as long as there are better money to be made, that's where the Businessman gonna go, it have nothing to do with geopolitics

We can keep on arguing for as long as we want, discussing this and that!! the point remains the same that the statement was uncalled for, was made with out any bit of research and the poster was not sure what he is talking about, to who and about what!! It was a UK paper, quoting a US pilot, comparing two US planes now i dont find and of your supposed THIRD RATE countries here, as for Chinese influence, you need to look at the pace of progress and all that. AGAIN, I AM NOT COMPARING OR STATING THAT CHINA OR US CAN WIN THE WAR. BOTH WILL HAVE A LOT TO LOSE. Look at US largest trade partners list. AGAIN, NOT DECLARING A WINNER just saying that no one will be able to win now, and that is an achievement for any country against US.

Again, i guess i am getting off topic. The Simple point is that i fail to realize that why any other country was brought into this in the first place when the TOPIC was F-35 vs F-16, so yes, all this we are watching is a bit of crying trying to take attention from what was originally being discussed.

I don't think I am crying, even my brother wasn't when he work for Boeing and lost to the F-35 Program from LM, the person in the OP article is crying, not us

Don't take it personally but then if you even do what i say about it? i need to say it again, the OP was about a UK source quoting a US pilot comparing two US plains, it was that post by that "us" that started all this and made no sense. The main issue was it came from such a senior member, one i have followed on numerous threads and respect a lot and am sure is better than these cheap shots.