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Turkey Setting Sails on Big Naval Ambitions

It depends on many issue, and based on time, fuel prices, demand in cruise lining , comfort , affordability, the designers make an end decision. This is not solely about capacity, or whether its good or bad. Situation right now requires to use it economically, navy doesnt worry about economics.

Anyway, i still believe some cruise liners still use similar systems. Warstila, or other engine suppliers deliver diesel-electric systems, means that still there is a thruster but unclear if its podded, or something else.

Costa is europes largest cruise operator and doesn´t use Azipods anymore. All their new vessels have conventional propulsion. Costa says its easier to maintain.

Of course its diesel-electric. The conventional propulsion is moved by electricity generated by massive diesel engines. Even the elderly Costa neoRomantica is diesel electric.

When i sailed with my girl on the maiden voyage of the Costa Diadema i made some pics of her model where you can see her propulsion:

fa41ff-1462903737.jpg


Diadema is italias biggest, most advanced liner. They say the conventional propulsion system is more stable, more effcient and less prone to failure.

Cruise ships are far more complex than military ships. AFAIk they had massive problems with Azipod propulsion in their vista class vessels.
 
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Costa is europes largest cruise operator and doesn´t use Azipods anymore. All their new vessels have conventional propulsion. Costa says its easier to maintain.

Of course its diesel-electric. The conventional propulsion is moved by electricity generated by massive diesel engines. Even the elderly Costa neoRomantica is diesel electric.

When i sailed with my girl on the maiden voyage of the Costa Diadema i made some pics of her model where you can see her propulsion:

fa41ff-1462903737.jpg


Diadema is italias biggest, most advanced liner. They say the conventional propulsion system is more stable, more effcient and less prone to failure.

Cruise ships are far more complex than military ships. AFAIk they had massive problems with Azipod propulsion in their vista class vessels.

Lets make it clear at 1st, azipod is registered product of ABB, while generally they are referred as podded propeller, if it can rotate about an axis known as azimuth truster.

I cant really understand, but the pictures you have shown , simply a conventional open shaft configuration. The point is there is no use of a mechanical transmission via shaft if electric engine is utilized (unless ship is going high speed regime like frigates) . Its funny to hear you are calling military ships to be less complicated , so its about to end our debate in here.
In terms of efficiency, open shaft systems consume about 3-5-7 pct depends on shaft length, including additional brackets and shaft itself as drag source increases total resistance, so calling open shaft system more efficient makes no sense, podded systems are way efficient in terms of transmission ,also in hydrodynamic efficiency. Plus, that configuration ends up with shaft bourne and propeller bourne noise on ship.
Let me say that, maneuvrability is also improvised with a podded propeller.

Their choise concerns for other matters than efficiency, the total cost might be cheaper now thanks to the oil prices and in future they would go for podded propellers with no doubt.

You have been to a cruise ship for vacation and i have been in trial tests, let me state that sometimes diesele engines failure to start, and those air bottles are awaited to be filled, this is the main reason why departure is delayed , and you never sense it.

I wouldnt even mention why a naval vessel is way more complicated. Everyone knows the fact.
 
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@isoo which ones more costly, Juan Carlos, Australian built or the Turkish project?
 
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@isoo which ones more costly, Juan Carlos, Australian built or the Turkish project?

Turkish Project costs way more expensive than both , there are more armanement on TCG Anadolu , than the others with dual configuration for design.
 
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Lets make it clear at 1st, azipod is registered product of ABB, while generally they are referred as podded propeller, if it can rotate about an axis known as azimuth truster.

I cant really understand, but the pictures you have shown , simply a conventional open shaft configuration. The point is there is no use of a mechanical transmission via shaft if electric engine is utilized (unless ship is going high speed regime like frigates) . Its funny to hear you are calling military ships to be less complicated , so its about to end our debate in here.
In terms of efficiency, open shaft systems consume about 3-5-7 pct depends on shaft length, including additional brackets and shaft itself as drag source increases total resistance, so calling open shaft system more efficient makes no sense, podded systems are way efficient in terms of transmission ,also in hydrodynamic efficiency. Plus, that configuration ends up with shaft bourne and propeller bourne noise on ship.
Let me say that, maneuvrability is also improvised with a podded propeller.

Their choise concerns for other matters than efficiency, the total cost might be cheaper now thanks to the oil prices and in future they would go for podded propellers with no doubt.

You have been to a cruise ship for vacation and i have been in trial tests, let me state that sometimes diesele engines failure to start, and those air bottles are awaited to be filled, this is the main reason why departure is delayed , and you never sense it.

I wouldnt even mention why a naval vessel is way more complicated. Everyone knows the fact.


Militaryships are far less complicated simply because tehy dont have that enormous complex systems a liner needs to have instaleld., Its absicly a giant autonomous city. Entertainment, propulsion, sanitary, theatres. The energy output of a cruiseliner is magnitudes greater than that of a military ship.

You have 3900 paying passengers who expect absolute luxury + 1500 crew. You have giant suits, dozens of elevator systems, pools, spa areas and environmental aspects you have to consider.

Mitsubishi for example is a very good ship builder. It builds carriers, freighters, military vessels. Now it got its first cruise ship the Aida Prima and went to its knees. Mitsubishi was unable to meet the obligations because a military vessel is no liner. The maiden voyage was delayed almost 2 years. Mitsubishi made almost 1 billion $ negative and gave up on building a liner in the forseeable future again.

As for the Azipod systems, the QM2 has them and has regulary issues. They fail because the complex rotation mechanics break.

The kitchen alone of a liner has more technology than an entire military vessel.

Of course you lack the funds to ever cruise so you only know from the outside.

Are you sure?

yes.

cruise liners are bigger, filled with entertainment systems, must provide luxury, cost effectiveness.
military vessels house their crew like scum.

Show me a military vessel that has 130.000 tons mass is 309m long, has hundres of luxury suits , a theatre, dozens of bars, entertainment systems, could power an entire city, has to make 2500 different finest meals at same time ready and orders cooled down vine of evry sort:

This is Costa Diadema. We sailed on her maiden voyage in 2014. She is italias pride and the largest vessel ever under italian flag. The technology behind her is plain and simply awesome.

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Some pics of the Diadema:

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Militaryships are far less complicated simply because tehy dont have that enormous complex systems a liner needs to have instaleld.
What is a military ship in your dictionary?


In my understanding this bad boy can easily take on those tourist ships in terms of complexity.

ford-00.jpg





Or what about this? Not even all of its secrets are known to public.

USS_Zumwalt_(DDG-1000)_at_night.jpg





You are generalizing by simply saying Cruisers are more complex than military Ships while its generally assumed that military technology is decades ahead of civilian market.

All this a side you would never let a imbecile captain like Schettino command a AC or Destroyer. :D

The kitchen alone of a liner has more technology than an entire military vessel.
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@isoo This was a defence forum right?
 
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What is a military ship in your dictionary?


In my understanding this bad boy can easily take on those tourists ships in terms of complexity.

ford-00.jpg





Or what about this? Not even all of its secrets are known to public.

USS_Zumwalt_(DDG-1000)_at_night.jpg





You are generalizing by simply saying Cruisers are more complex than military Ships while its generally assumed that military technology is decades ahead of civilian market.

All this a side you would never let a imbecile captain like Schettino command a AC or Destroyer. :D


2O8vjfv.gif


@isoo This was a defence forum right?


and you have no idea what you talk about. :) How do you imagine a kitchen in a liner? That makes 4500 high quality luxury meals 4 times a day at exactly the same time, for 8 restaurants + 2 giant dining rooms?

This functions only with absolute accuracy + high tech.

And yes, i believe the stage of the theatre houses more technology than a single destroyer. Complexity has nothing to do with advancement of technology. The Space Shuttle was build in 1981 and is far more complex than rockets build today.

As for captains, liner captains usually have the highest rank possible. Including Schettino, who showed no more incompetency than the commander of the two destroyers that crashed togetehr. Or the nuclear submarine that smashed into an oil tanker.

As i said, you are a working class guy and never saw a cruise ship from inside. You dont know what it is like.
 
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Comparing cruisers with carriers, is this what PDF has come to? Please don't fill this thread with garbage Markus. Now you will claim the garbage collection and disposal system is more complicated than a carriers's aircraft launch system
 
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and you have no idea what you talk about. :) How do you imagine a kitchen in a liner? That makes 4500 high quality luxury meals 4 times a day at exactly the same time, for 8 restaurants + 2 giant dining rooms?

This functions only with absolute accuracy + high tech.
Yeah im pretty sure their stoves are much more advanced than AESA Radars. :lol:

And yes, i believe the stage of the theatre houses more technology than a single destroyer.
Are you for real? :what:

As for captains, liner captains usually have the highest rank possible. Including Schettino, who showed no more incompetency than the commander of the two destroyers that crashed togetehr. Or the nuclear submarine that smashed into an oil tanker.
Crash can happen, its humans controlling those vessels after all while crashing just for a show off and then abandoning your ship before the passengers is something else but if that counts as competent in Italy then im not in a position to judge... :coffee:

As i said, you are a working class guy and never saw a cruise ship from inside. You dont know what it is like.
Are you so insecure that you need to let out your superior complexity every time you lose a argument?
You dont know me, nor do you know what im doing for a living so im gonna leave you alone with your imaginary superiority.
PS: you are working in Airbus (or claim to), this also makes you working class, learn the definition of a term before trying to play with words pal.
 
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you are working in Airbus
I'm certain he works in tourism. His posts reveal this. He mentioned several times he had relationships with foreign girls, and they went on cruisers together etc. He frequently posts threads on the "booming" industry of Italy's tourism, comparing it with Turkey's diminishing tourism due to terrorism etc etc
 
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Yeah im pretty sure their stoves are much more advanced than AESA Radars. :lol:


Are you for real? :what:


Crash can happen, its humans controlling those vessels after all while crashing just for a show off and then abandoning your ship before the passengers is something else but if that counts as competent in Italy then im not in a position to judge... :coffee:


Are you so insecure that you need to let out your superior complexity evertime you loose a argument?
You dont know me, nor do you know what im doing for a living so im gonna leave you alone with your imaginary superiority.
PS: you are working in Airbus (or claim to), this also makes you working class, learn the definition of a term before trying play with words pal.


As i said, your oriental way of thinking doesnt allow you to grasp the complexity of a system.

I´m in the engineering business. Let me tell you that evry village is more complex than an aircraft carrier. That has nothing to do with advancement.

Mitsubishi for example builds wonderful helicopter carriers but totally failed in building a liner because the complexity of the work overwhelmed them. Its hard for a corporation to be an expert in ship engines and at same time in developing a functional pool system, theatre stage building as well as carpenters. Thats what i´m talking about. The complexity.
 
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As i said, you are a working class guy and never saw a cruise ship from inside. You dont know what it is like
You are funny guy,if he wishes,he can go on a cruise whenever he wants,whats so special about a cruise,i have been on two in the Caribian,started in Miami and ended there(2002 and 2009).
Did you work on a cruise ship as roomservice or something?:omghaha::omghaha::omghaha:
 
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As i said, your oriental way of thinking doesnt allow you to grasp the complexity of a system.
And this is where you lose a argument once again, whats worse is you loose it against a oriental brain, what a shame. :cray:

You are funny guy,if he wishes,he can go on a cruise whenever he wants,whats so special about a cruise,i have been on two in the Caribian,started in Miami and ended there(2002 and 2009).
Did you work on a cruise ship as roomservice or something?:omghaha::omghaha::omghaha:
He thinks its so special while i only need 1 week salary to book a cruise across mediterranian, wait till he shows his 600$ (or was it 300? I dont remember) watch as if it was something special. :lol:
 
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