South China Sea Forum

[Grand Historian]

we don't care what your ancestor think about Northeastern and eastern territory of China in this map. The map of Man Qing stated " 全圖 " mean "full map " or " toàn đồ " in Vietnamese. There is last point of China's territory is Hannan Island.

If you can only read 全圖 then you clearly don't understand the title.

皇朝直省地輿全圖 do you even understand what this means?

 

[EastSea]

If you can only read 全圖 then you clearly don't understand the title.

don't lie, when you lie about "direct" or "indirect" here the title of map, it related to northern China only. It is different story. What is Xin Jiang mean in Chinese ? There is "new border" of China. So why Uijgur (East Turkmenistan ) people are fighting with Han Chinese to regain independence from China.

 

[Grand Historian]

don't lie, when you lie about "direct" or "indirect" here the title of map, it related to northern China only. It is different story. What is Xin Jiang mean in Chinese ? There is "new border" of China. So why Uijgur (East Turkmenistan ) people are fighting with Han Chinese to regain independence from China.

Come back when you can actually read Hanzi.

 

[EastSea]

Come back when you can actually read Hanzi.

hoklo people can fight to regain independence of Republic Famosa too.

 

[Grand Historian]

hoklo people can fight to regain independence of Republic Famosa too.

Which has nothing to with your ability to read Hanzi.

 

[EastSea]

Which has nothing to with your ability to read Hanzi.

Han Zi is foreigner language to Viets, this is character of Han Chinese. I can translate my family tree written in Han Zi, it is enough.

OK, Viets has nothing to do with Independence of Famosa Republic of Hoklo people in Taiwan. Do it by ourselves.

 

[Grand Historian]

Han Zi is foreigner language to Viets, this is character of Han Chinese. I can translate my family tree written in Han Zi, it is enough.

OK, Viets has nothing to do with Independence of Famosa Republic of Hoklo people in Taiwan. Do it by ourselves.

You can't even read a title of a map shows how pitiful your command of Hanzi is.

There is no such thing as Foromsa Republic of Hoklo in Taiwan,nor are there aspirations for such a thing.

 

[xesy]

You can't even read a title of a map shows how pitiful your command of Hanzi is.

There is no such thing as Foromsa Republic of Hoklo in Taiwan,nor are there aspirations for such a thing.

Don't go around mocking other incapability of understanding Hanzi. In Vietnam, the most popular foreign language is English, then next are Japanese and Russian. Less popular one is French. Chinese is slightly above that, kind of in the middle. Many of Vietnamese living in the border with China can speak Chinese but don't understand Hanzi, because it's not an easy to understand writing system.

There are many Viet scholars who understand Hanzi and do reseach on such documents. Yet they cannot express their opinions over the net because they can't use English. What we do/ say here are in fact just doing the translating job. So you cannot disregard our points just because we cannot understanding Hanzi.

 

[NiceGuy]

Don't go around mocking other incapability of understanding Hanzi. In Vietnam, the most popular foreign language is English, then next are Japanese and Russian. Less popular one is French. Chinese is slightly above that, kind of in the middle. Many of Vietnamese living in the border with Chinese can speak Chinese but don't understand Hanzi, because it's not an easy to understand writing system.

There are many Viet scholars who understand Hanzi and do reseach on such documents. Yet they cannot express their opinions over the net because they can't use English. What we do/ say here are in fact just doing the translating job. So you cannot disregard our points just because we cannot understanding Hanzi.

We post here to let other nation can see why China's claim in SCS(east sea) is baseless, we dont need to reeducate brain-washed Chinese.

So, if Chinese want a serious debate and want some VNese who can write Hazi, then lets go to the international court to debate.Thats it.

 

[xesy]

We post here to let other nation can see why China's claim in SCS(east sea) is baseless, we dont need to reeducate brain-washed Chinese.

So, if Chinese want a serious debate and want some VNese who can write Hazi, then lets go to the international court to debate.Thats it.

Chinese govt just gives the world a big middle finger over the face, saying that they won't go to any courts relating to the SCS issues. That's why Chinese mems here are often mocking others whenever we touch on the international court.

 

[Grand Historian]

Don't go around mocking other incapability of understanding Hanzi. In Vietnam, the most popular foreign language is English, then next are Japanese and Russian. Less popular one is French. Chinese is slightly above that, kind of in the middle. Many of Vietnamese living in the border with China can speak Chinese but don't understand Hanzi, because it's not an easy to understand writing system.

There are many Viet scholars who understand Hanzi and do reseach on such documents. Yet they cannot express their opinions over the net because they can't use English. What we do/ say here are in fact just doing the translating job. So you cannot disregard our points just because we cannot understanding Hanzi.

Why can't I mock someone who purposely distorts the original text or makes ridiculous claims?

Vietnamese members have been using the 1904 map to prove that the Hainan was the Southern most island of China yet the title itself stated that it was land that was under direct imperial control.

Whenever Vietnamese make absurd claims about Chinese history/culture I'm able to show sources in Hanzi,yet every single time Vietnamese members make some poor excuse that Chinese history is fake and they can't read it.

 

[NiceGuy]

Whenever Vietnamese make absurd claims about Chinese history/culture I'm able to show sources in Hanzi,yet every single time Vietnamese members make some poor excuse that Chinese history is fake and they can't read it.

The Judges of international court know China's evidence r fake and VN's ones r real

 

[xesy]

Why can't I mock someone who purposely distorts the original text or makes ridiculous claims?

Vietnamese members have been using the 1904 map to prove that the Hainan was the Southern most island of China yet the title itself stated that it was land that was under direct imperial control.

Whenever Vietnamese make absurd claims about Chinese history/culture I'm able to show sources in Hanzi,yet every single time Vietnamese members make some poor excuse that Chinese history is fake and they can't read it.

"Direct imperial control" you said, that means Chinese govt at that time, the Quin dynasty I think, did not have govt level control over Spartly and Paracels. France at that time had the islands under their control and as the colony broke free from its master, Vietnam inherited French former colonial land and islands. Is that wrong?

Claiming one history is fake is not Vietnamese speciality. Chinese also do the same. Knowing a language does not help one understanding the history of a country. Like we all know English but what's about the history of Australia? They use English, right?

 

[EastSea]

You can't even read a title of a map shows how pitiful your command of Hanzi is.

There is no such thing as Foromsa Republic of Hoklo in Taiwan,nor are there aspirations for such a thing.

OK, read more here.

China’s Xi Jinping And The Map of China From the 18th Century — “Time to realise what a true re-emergence of China means.”
April 8, 2014

Poisonous gift: a map of China without annexed and oppressed nations (Tibet, East Turkestan, Mongolia, and Manchuria).

By Rachel Lu

German Chancellor Angela Merkel presents Xi Jinping with a map of China from the 18th century in Berlin, Germany.

Hong Kong — Last week German Chancellor Angela Merkel hosted visiting Xi Jinping at a dinner where they exchanged gifts.

Merkel presented to Xi a 1735 map of China made by prolific French cartographer Jean-Baptiste Bourguignon d’Anville and printed by a German publishing house.
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According to an antique-maps website, d’Anville’s map was based on earlier geographical surveys done by Jesuit missionaries in China and represented the “summation of European knowledge on China in the 18th-century.”
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The map showed China without annexed and oppressed nations (Tibet, East Turkestan, Mongolia, and Manchuria).
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The islands of Taiwan and Hainan — the latter clearly part of modern China, the former very much disputed — are shown with a different colour border.

The 1735 map of China made by French cartographer Jean-Baptiste Bourguignon d’Anville
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Historical maps are sensitive business in China.
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Every schoolchild in China learns that Tibet, East Turkestan, Taiwan, and the Senkaku Islands have been “inalienable parts of China since ancient times.”
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The d’Anville map, at least visually, is a rejection of that narrative.
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Unsurprisingly, China’s official media outlets don’t seem to have appreciated Merkel’s gift.
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The People’s Daily, which has given meticulous accounts of Xi’s European tour, elided any coverage of the offending map.
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More curiously, when news of the map’s presentation reached the Chinese heartland, it had somehow morphed into a completely different one.
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A map published in many Chinese-language media reports about Merkel’s gift-giving shows the Chinese empire at its territorial zenith, including Tibet, East Turkestan, Mongolia and large swaths of Siberia.
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This larger map was the handiwork of British mapmaker John Dower, published in 1844 by Henry Teesdale & Co. in London, and was certainly not the gift from Merkel to Xi.
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But this mistake was not noted or explained in Chinese reports.
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Both versions of the Merkel map have made appearances on Chinese social media, eliciting vastly different interpretations.
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Those who saw the d’Anville map seemed shocked by its limited territories.
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Hao Qian, a finance reporter, remarked that the map is “quite an awkward gift.”
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Writer Xiao Zheng blasted Merkel for trying to “legitimise the Tibet and East Turkestan independence movements.”
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Architect Liu Kun wrote, “The Germans definitely have ulterior motives.”
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One Internet user asked, “How is this possible? Where is Tibet, East Turkestan, the Northeast? How did Xi react?”
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The Dower map, on the other hand, seemed to stoke nostalgia for large territories and imperial power.
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An advertising executive enthused, “Our Manchu ‘ancestors’ are [awesome].”
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Another Internet user hoped Xi would feel “encouraged” by the map to “realise what a true [re-emergence] of China means.”
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Some suspected that Merkel tried to send Xi a subtle reminder that Russia had helped Mongolia declare independence from China in the mid-20th century, somewhat like what Russia did in Crimea in March 2014.
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All the cartographic brouhaha may be overblown.
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One Internet user refused to “overinterpret” the d’Anville map as a message about Tibet or East Turkestan.
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After all, “You can’t use a map of the 13 colonies of the United States made in 1776 to tell Americans that Texas or California is not US territory.”
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Chính's news: Angela Merkel's historical China map flap

German Chancellor Angela Merkel presents Xi Jinping with a map of China from the 18th century in Berlin | Peace and Freedom

 

[CN.Black]

don't lie, when you lie about "direct" or "indirect" here the title of map, it related to northern China only. It is different story. What is Xin Jiang mean in Chinese ? There is "new border" of China. So why Uijgur (East Turkmenistan ) people are fighting with Han Chinese to regain independence from China.

皇朝直省地域全图 means "the whole area directly controlled by the Royal".It is the map of one part of China.Not the whole China Empire.