Should Pakistan convert Mi-17 to optional attack role?

[Philip the Arab]

This thread is exactly what the title is, should Pakistan convert their Mi-17 to optional attack role from the South African company Paramount Group? This upgrade will significantly increase anti-tank capabilities through the addition of 8 ZT3 Ingwes which has about 1000mm of penetration after ERA and would prove deadly to Indian tanks be it T-72, or T-90s, or Arjuns. 8 Mokopas which can also take on any Indian tank around. A 23mm gun pod can also be integrated onto the helicopter which makes it even deadlier than it already is. New composite rotor blades, as well as a new cockpit, sighting system, and helmet system would further modernize the system and really make it equivalent to the American OH-58 Kiowa in terms of the role it plays. This could complement the Fennec with a helicopter already in service with Pakistan.

More info about Mi-17 upgrade here www.paramountgroup.co.za/media/1149/paramount-mi17-2015.pdf



Also, instead of Pakistan purchasing new Mi-35s from Russia, why don't they just buy other countries Mi-24s and get them again upgraded by a South African company? Again, new avionics, 20mm gun, Mokopa. This is arguably the best variant of the Mi-24 out there and puts this beast on a whole new level.

More info here www.paramountgroup.com/media/1320/paramount-night-hawk.pdf

 

[YeBeWarned]

I think there is no need , we just need to order more Mil-35's they will work with similar capabilities .

 

[Irfan Baloch]

This thread is exactly what the title is, should Pakistan convert their Mi-17 to optional attack role from the South African company Paramount Group? This upgrade will significantly increase anti-tank capabilities through the addition of 8 ZT3 Ingwes which has about 1000mm of penetration after ERA and would prove deadly to Indian tanks be it T-72, or T-90s, or Arjuns. 8 Mokopas which can also take on any Indian tank around. A 23mm gun pod can also be integrated onto the helicopter which makes it even deadlier than it already is. New composite rotor blades, as well as a new cockpit, sighting system, and helmet system would further modernize the system and really make it equivalent to the American OH-58 Kiowa in terms of the role it plays. This could complement the Fennec with a helicopter already in service with Pakistan.


View attachment 553607


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View attachment 553609
More info about Mi-17 upgrade here www.paramountgroup.co.za/media/1149/paramount-mi17-2015.pdf



Also, instead of Pakistan purchasing new Mi-35s from Russia, why don't they just buy other countries Mi-24s and get them again upgraded by a South African company? Again, new avionics, 20mm gun, Mokopa. This is arguably the best variant of the Mi-24 out there and puts this beast on a whole new level.

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More info here www.paramountgroup.com/media/1320/paramount-night-hawk.pdf

NO
get more Hinds instead for the intended role
keep Mi 17s for the role they are needed and they are needed a lot for that role.

 

[Philip the Arab]

NO
get more Hinds instead for the intended role
keep Mi 17s for the role they are needed and they are needed a lot for that role.

Old Mi-24s can be ordered and converted. Again the South African Mi-24 is probably the best Mi-24 variant in service today with advanced South African ATGMs. Much cheaper than buying new Hinds from Russia which is 3 Mi-35s for 100 million.
@Starlord

 

[nahtanbob]

China has attack helicopters that are cheaper

 

[Philip the Arab]

China has attack helicopters that are cheaper

An upgrade is way less expensive than a new built helicopter.

 

[nahtanbob]

An upgrade is way less expensive than a new built helicopter.

it depends upon the situation

 

[Philip the Arab]

it depends upon the situation

As I Said before, an upgraded Mi-24 gets many new things that makes it lighter, better protected, better armed, and with glass cockpits and has to be on par with the most modern Mi-35 variants. It would be much cheaper to buy older Mi-24s than buying new built helicopters considering they are 3 for 100 million for Pakistan's army.

 

[nahtanbob]

As I Said before, an upgraded Mi-24 gets many new things that makes it lighter, better protected, better armed, and with glass cockpits and has to be on par with the most modern Mi-35 variants. It would be much cheaper to buy older Mi-24s than buying new built helicopters considering they are 3 for 100 million for Pakistan's army.

Russian airframes and engines are not known for durability

 

[Sulman Badshah]

I think we will have sufficient attack helicopter fleet in future .. Current 48 AH-1F will entirely be replaced

Future / Current attack helicopter platform
> 48 Ah-1F (current, will be replaced in future)
> 4 Mi-35 (current) and more 5 reportedly ordered , speculations are that order maybe increased to 20 total
> 30 T-129 Helicopters reportedly on order (Deliveries awaiting)
> 15 AH-1Z Viper (9 air frames are already built but currently sanctioned, Talks of their retreivel from US are underway)
> 10 Fennec (Light attack and scout helicopters are in service as well

 

[nahtanbob]

I think we will have sufficient attack helicopter fleet in future .. Current 48 AH-1F will entirely be replaced

Future / Current attack helicopter platform
> 48 Ah-1F (current, will be replaced in future)
> 4 Mi-35 (current) and more 5 reportedly ordered , speculations are that order maybe increased to 20 total
> 30 T-129 Helicopters reportedly on order (Deliveries awaiting)
> 15 AH-1Z Viper (9 air frames are already built but currently sanctioned, Talks of their retreivel from US are underway)
> 10 Fennec (Light attack and scout helicopters are in service as well

what about chinese attack choppers ??

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

This thread is exactly what the title is, should Pakistan convert their Mi-17 to optional attack role from the South African company Paramount Group? This upgrade will significantly increase anti-tank capabilities through the addition of 8 ZT3 Ingwes which has about 1000mm of penetration after ERA and would prove deadly to Indian tanks be it T-72, or T-90s, or Arjuns. 8 Mokopas which can also take on any Indian tank around. A 23mm gun pod can also be integrated onto the helicopter which makes it even deadlier than it already is. New composite rotor blades, as well as a new cockpit, sighting system, and helmet system would further modernize the system and really make it equivalent to the American OH-58 Kiowa in terms of the role it plays. This could complement the Fennec with a helicopter already in service with Pakistan.


View attachment 553607


View attachment 553608

View attachment 553609
More info about Mi-17 upgrade here www.paramountgroup.co.za/media/1149/paramount-mi17-2015.pdf



Also, instead of Pakistan purchasing new Mi-35s from Russia, why don't they just buy other countries Mi-24s and get them again upgraded by a South African company? Again, new avionics, 20mm gun, Mokopa. This is arguably the best variant of the Mi-24 out there and puts this beast on a whole new level.

View attachment 553610

View attachment 553612

More info here www.paramountgroup.com/media/1320/paramount-night-hawk.pdf

Is IAF Mi17 V5 attack Helicopter?

 

[Sulman Badshah]

what about chinese attack choppers ??

3 were evaluated and than sent back (later we heard Turkish T129 got ordered)

 

[Philip the Arab]

Is IAF Mi17 V5 attack Helicopter?

Kind of, it is better armed that Pakistani ones though.
The helicopter is armed with Shturm-V missiles, S-8 rockets, a 23mm machine gun, PKT machine guns and AKM sub-machine guns. It features eight firing posts for aiming the weapons. Personally Pakistan should do the same as optional attack helicopters which wouldn't hurt. The Shturm has 500-600 mm of penetration while South African ATGMs have 1000+ after ERA.

Tell me which helicopter is better armed?

Indian Mi-17 V-5 armed with rockets.


South African Super Mi-17 armed with 8 Mokopas or Ingwes which can easily each take on any Indian tank. Also notice how the Indian one doesn't have a FLIR system.



Mokopa

South Africa
Entered service 2005
Armor penetration 1 350 mm RHAe after ERA
Range 10 km
Weight 49.8 kg
Missile length 2 m
Missile diameter 0.18 m
Fin span ?
Warhead HEAT, HE-FRAG, or Thermobaric
Warhead weight ?
Guidance Semi-active laser, infrared homing, or active radar


Ingwe ATGM

Entered service 1987
Armor penetration up to 1 000 mm
Range 250 - 5 000 m
Weight 28.5 kg
Missile length 1 750 mm
Missile diameter 127 mm
Warhead Tandem HEAT
Warhead weight ?
Guidance system Semi-active laser

 

[TOPGUN]

PA has no need to do so, although not a bad idea but again PA has no need for it those birds are for transport only with light machine gun.