Shiekh Rasheed Interview with Sami Ibrahim | May 3 2022

[SQ8]

This is very nice but does not lend itself to a survivable FP for Pakistan when push comes to shove.

I would like us to take IK's stand and pressure test that by taking his policy back to post 9/11 period. Replace Musharraf with IK and suggest what IK would have done when the call from Amreeka came i.e. "you are with us or against us".

What amazing option was IK going to spring up? Was he going to say no? Has any PTI-wala thought about the ramifications of saying no then? Could IK have said "Pakistan has nothing to do with this war" when Taliban were supported by Pakistan and hosting AQ in their country? I mean who are we trying to kid with these claims?

I honestly believe that IK has thanked his lucky stars that he was not in the hot-seat when the angry, red in the face Americans came calling post 9/11. He had no options back then to deny the Americans and he has found out that even now, Pakistan's options are extremely limited.

I know members, specially PTI ones, don't want to hear this but this is the reality of the situation. You all can curse the military and the establishment for whatever you desire, but IK knew these realities just as well. Relations with the US are a must for Pakistan and there is no alternate for the next some years if not decades.

While I differ a tad on the approach, it is ironic to see a lot of the anti-US opinions come from US flagged or US IP ones. Hypocrisy at its plainest.
Hating on realpolitik while sipping starbucks or manning the cash register at a 7/11.

America Murdabad while sitting and reaping the benefits of America.. typical Pakistanis.

 

[Wood]

India is now paying 35$ per barrel for Russian crude. The US is happy for Putin to sell his national treasure at fire sale prices

its win-win for India and the US

Amid mounting pressure from isolating sanctions imposed by the US, UK and EU among others on Russia, a Bloomberg report has revealed that the sanctioned nation offered India oil at a heavily discounted price of $35 a barrel. India bought Russian oil at a discount of $35 per barrel: Bloomberg Amid mounting pressure from isolating sanctions imposed by the US, UK and EU among others on Russia, a Bloomberg report has revealed that the sanctioned nation offered India oil at a heavily discounted price of $35 a barrel. Citing people familiar with the matter, Bloomberg reported that Russia... www.arabnews.com

India is paying rupees that Russia struggles to find use for

While I differ a tad on the approach, it is ironic to see a lot of the anti-US opinions come from US flagged or US IP ones. Hypocrisy at its plainest.
Hating on realpolitik while sipping starbucks or manning the cash register at a 7/11.

America Murdabad while sitting and reaping the benefits of America.. typical Pakistanis.

Their talk in worthless. Their tax $ is for uncle Sam

 

[Avicenna]

Having solid relations with the US are a compulsion, regardless of any right-wing propaganda.

For as long as a unipolar system is prevalent in the world, robust economic and security ties with the US have to be maintained for a country like Pakistan which does not have oil or any other significant resources to fall back on.

Most members here know this but fail to acknowledge this dependency because they have bought into IK's anti-US rhetoric hook, line and sinker. I can guarantee that if IK comes back to power, he will walk back on this strong rhetoric (primarily for domestic consumption) because this is a road to nowhere and nobody knows this better than IK and those who have sat in the chair, so I expect a full U-turn on his part when back in the hot-seat. Anything contrary is a complete and utter dead-end for at least another decade if not more for anyone wanting to walk-down this anti-American path. Keep in mind that IMF, WB, FATF, etc. all roads lead back to the US and there is no Chinese or Russian or Khaleeji alternate to any of these.

Second point, the military is facts based. It is looking at its existing capabilities and realizing that no matter what we get from China, it does not address the high-end of the technology spectrum just yet (our Chinese friends are looking at the same and they too realize that there is some catching up to do, no slight on what they graciously assist Pakistan with here) specially when our adversary is introducing a lot of high-end western gear. A case in point is the dismal performance of the Russian hardware against low-end, but high-tech western weaponry in the Ukraine war. Such lessons from this war are not lost on those in uniform.

Our high-end weapons systems are all US based. There is a reason for this. When push comes to shove, it is these very same American made artillery guns that fire thousands upon thousands of rounds without requiring a change of the barrels on account of the quality of metallurgy used. For the young generation so brought up on to this anti-amreekanism, it was the famous "AAA" that was touted by Pakistan in the 1965 war as its savior. Depending on whom you talk with, it was Allah, Army and the Air Force for some and Allah, Army and Artillery for others. At least two of the "A"s (AF and Artillery) were American origin and the Army was a US trained one which gave the country a fighting chance.

Even today, it is the high performance engines and airframes in the F-16s that can fly 12,000 hours, over their life, which is unmatched by any Russian/Chinese platforms. The Turks did what IK is doing, i.e. went full bore on anti-Americanism, then realized that they have no option but to go back to the American alignment (thus the request for F-16V upgrades for their Air Force).

So as I always say, naray-baazi and talk of khuddari are all fine, but these alone do not give confidence to those who have to carry out the job of fighting. Not having effective, modern combat aviation is already resulting in massive casualties in the FATA. Not being able to leverage EDA via MNNA is impacting the fight in both Balochistan and the FATA. If even IK on a populist platform could not make peace in these two areas (despite him claiming that nobody knows FATA/KP better than he does), the only option is to fight the anti-state elements and when doing so, having access to the best technology to do the job is a must and currently, US is the only source with such options.

Our Ertugril-fan club should also realize that Turkey has gone full circle and is now open to dealing with the Americans. They realized that at least currently and for the next decade plus, America is the dominant power with whom dealings cannot be put off. The Pakistani establishment has very correctly and objectively arrived at this very same conclusion.

Sadly what you've written is straight facts.

But there is a glass ceiling with this approach.

The question is what to do?

For Pakistan and alot of other nations out there.

To toe the line means propogation of the unipolar status quo.

To rock the boat means chastisement from Uncle Sam.

While I differ a tad on the approach, it is ironic to see a lot of the anti-US opinions come from US flagged or US IP ones. Hypocrisy at its plainest.
Hating on realpolitik while sipping starbucks or manning the cash register at a 7/11.

America Murdabad while sitting and reaping the benefits of America.. typical Pakistanis.

I wouldn't call it hypocrisy in the least.

Probably more a mix of enlightenment and pragmatism.

 

[Abdul Rehman Majeed]

Today's interview of Sheikh Rashid with Sami Ibrahim....

Watch from 32:14

"The only problem is that institution wants to stay with US and they say that IMF will give us money whereas you want to go with Russia and take gas/oil @ 30% less and you want to go with China & CPEC. This is the only problem"

Things have started to come out in the open confirming that our institution wants to stay as the lapdog of US and don't want to have an independent dignified position on the world stage. The real question is why?

1. Dollar Khori - Institution has been addicted to dollars after war on terror and the huge influx of non-audited dollars received from US. As it has been stopped so they are behaving like an addict without his fix.

2. Personal Interests - Personal interests of top generals and core commanders. Their children studying here, living there, doing businesses there, and the general themselves want to have a lavish retired life in the west.

3. Resistance to Change - Since last 70 years Pakistan has been aligned with US and the institution don't want to change the direction towards Russia & China. Don't know what kind of ally we were though considering Pak was one of the most heavily US sanctioned and droned country. US back stabbed Pakistan and left it high n dry everytime their interest was over.

Pakistan is very fortunate that PMIK has lost power.

 

[dbc]

India is paying rupees that Russia struggles to find use for

yeah..not great for Russia..

 

[Whirling_dervesh]

Why is he complicating things for khan?
Why do you need to say these things in public? Say if IK comes in power, Is it even possible to cut ties with USA? Do we want USA to be our Open enemy like North Korea? Why do we need to be in any camp?
He could have simply said We want to be neutral in this new cold war and staying neutral not take any steps that adversly effect our stretegic repations with China.
When will our statesmen learn diplomatic language.
Why dont you promise us a Pakistan that Exports to USA and Buys weapons from China at the same time?
What is diplomacy for if you want to come under a BLOCK

Because one side namely USA are not interested our betterment. They want to use, abuse and keep you downtrodden, they do this through proxies, traitors and anti state folk. The US are like a cancer, the tumour needs to be removed, you cannot let it coexist as it will spread time and time again

 

[dbc]

America Murdabad while sitting and reaping the benefits of America.. typical Pakistanis.

My great..great grand parents came here from Europe to escape persecution in the late 1800’s and never looked back. Their journals still somewhat perfectly preserved give no hint of remorse, longing or even interest in their country of birth - just a steely determination to make a new life for themselves in America. I often wonder why immigrants from Pakistan still cling on to everything they abandoned to come here. When do these ties get severed, if ever? First generation? Second ..?

I must admit, I‘ve never met America haters in real life, except in France and Jordon.

 

[SQ8]

My great..great grand parents came here from Europe to escape persecution in the late 1800’s and never looked back. Their journals still somewhat perfectly preserved give no hint of remorse, longing or even interest in their country of birth - just a steely determination to make a new life for themselves in America. I often wonder why immigrants from Pakistan still cling on to everything they abandoned to come here. When do these ties get severed, if ever? First generation? Second ..?

I must admit, I‘ve never met America haters in real life, except in France and Jordon.

You will see that with a lot of immigrants - not just Pakistanis. But its rare to see hating the very country you willingly came to leaving what was your original home. I have encountered that with some arabs, Pakistanis, Indians and occasionally eastern Europeans.

 

[Humble Analyst]

All viable options are considered and implemented to the extent possible, yet it does not mean that we get an out immediately. Had an out been possible, our Chinese friends perhaps would have bailed us out with a $100B loan and using their veto powers, gotten us off FATF and into the NSG among other things. Yet, they cannot do any of this whereas Amreeka's friend Israel gets all of the above and more. That should tell us a thing or two about the power disparity at work in the world.

Secondly, this is not about chains, it is about the reality on the ground. Russian economy has been destroyed not because of the military destruction visited by the West, rather on account of the financial instruments the US maintains controls over. We are FAR, FAR more dependent than Russia.

The course we have taken now and in the past is and was not a solution. Considering options does not mean we had or have the mindset which decides perfectly. We have been snd will continue to spiral down. We have problem and that is export market. But if the imports and exports are balanced out that can be a solution. Buying spare parts for F16, howitzers and radars is a moderate level issue

 

[Humble Analyst]

All viable options are considered and implemented to the extent possible, yet it does not mean that we get an out immediately. Had an out been possible, our Chinese friends perhaps would have bailed us out with a $100B loan and using their veto powers, gotten us off FATF and into the NSG among other things. Yet, they cannot do any of this whereas Amreeka's friend Israel gets all of the above and more. That should tell us a thing or two about the power disparity at work in the world.

Secondly, this is not about chains, it is about the reality on the ground. Russian economy has been destroyed not because of the military destruction visited by the West, rather on account of the financial instruments the US maintains controls over. We are FAR, FAR more dependent than Russia.

Even if I agree with you which I do not fully agree with good reason, the deconstruction of a legitimate government and orchestrating a no confidence to place so many corrupt politicians by deep state has started a process which is far dangerous thsn not bowing to the boss country. It was a poor judgement on the part of establishment and how it was handled. It shows an egoist decision based upon decades of playing the King maker instead of the real role. Establishment, meaning Army leadership and not the whole Army should have acted sensibly but they did not. Their reactions were of anger, reactionary and fully of anger snd the justification given was the same as your post. No middle ground was sought.

 

[Finer]

On one hand you have remittance and home to overseas Pakistan and on the other hand, you have nothing but possible alliance that finds itself in economic ruins.

It is not rocket science why main establishments are playing safe.

 

[Riz]

I was aware about the conspiracy, still i was satisfied how establishment can handover a country to criminals who are on bail , but they did , Imran khan in an interview

 

[SaadH]

koi faida nahi hai mere bhai, ultimately ghar pakistan hi hai. bahir rehna se shayed aap financially stable hojao, but is pooray process mein aap apni muslim & pakistani shanakht kho detay ho. aur saath mein aulaad bhi lghdtv jesi kanj** niklaygi. i have seen it happening

Muslim aur Pakistani shanakht hoti tu yeh saaray kaam hi kion kartay...

 

[Dalit]

Today's interview of Sheikh Rashid with Sami Ibrahim....

Watch from 32:14

"The only problem is that institution wants to stay with US and they say that IMF will give us money whereas you want to go with Russia and take gas/oil @ 30% less and you want to go with China & CPEC. This is the only problem"

Things have started to come out in the open confirming that our institution wants to stay as the lapdog of US and don't want to have an independent dignified position on the world stage. The real question is why?

1. Dollar Khori - Institution has been addicted to dollars after war on terror and the huge influx of non-audited dollars received from US. As it has been stopped so they are behaving like an addict without his fix.

2. Personal Interests - Personal interests of top generals and core commanders. Their children studying here, living there, doing businesses there, and the general themselves want to have a lavish retired life in the west.

3. Resistance to Change - Since last 70 years Pakistan has been aligned with US and the institution don't want to change the direction towards Russia & China. Don't know what kind of ally we were though considering Pak was one of the most heavily US sanctioned and droned country. US back stabbed Pakistan and left it high n dry everytime their interest was over.

100%. If we had to sum this whole fiasco in a nutshell this is exactly what it amounts to.

1. The Pakistani armed forces want to stay in US camp.
2. The PTI government wanted to diversify and also include China/Russia into the fold.

The generals and corrupt politicians have one thing in common. The top brass of the Pakistani armed forces doesn't have loyalty toward Pakistan. This compromised bunch will retire in the USA. Their children and relatives already reside in many Western capitals.

US never gives Pakistani army anything. They canceled AH-1Z sell.

The only thing Bajwa will get out of overthrowing a sitting government is more IMF loans and do more lectures. The truth is that Bajwa folded like a house of cards. The Americans managed to subdue Bajwa with a mere bluff.

LOL at American weapons landing in Pakistan. An absolute joke. Bajwa actually claimed how important US weapons are for Pakistan. The existing F-16s are monitored and inspected by the Americans 24/7 inside Pakistan. There are absolutely no US weapons coming to Pakistan.

 

[IceCold]

Having solid relations with the US are a compulsion, regardless of any right-wing propaganda.

For as long as a unipolar system is prevalent in the world, robust economic and security ties with the US have to be maintained for a country like Pakistan which does not have oil or any other significant resources to fall back on.

Most members here know this but fail to acknowledge this dependency because they have bought into IK's anti-US rhetoric hook, line and sinker. I can guarantee that if IK comes back to power, he will walk back on this strong rhetoric (primarily for domestic consumption) because this is a road to nowhere and nobody knows this better than IK and those who have sat in the chair, so I expect a full U-turn on his part when back in the hot-seat. Anything contrary is a complete and utter dead-end for at least another decade if not more for anyone wanting to walk-down this anti-American path. Keep in mind that IMF, WB, FATF, etc. all roads lead back to the US and there is no Chinese or Russian or Khaleeji alternate to any of these.

Second point, the military is facts based. It is looking at its existing capabilities and realizing that no matter what we get from China, it does not address the high-end of the technology spectrum just yet (our Chinese friends are looking at the same and they too realize that there is some catching up to do, no slight on what they graciously assist Pakistan with here) specially when our adversary is introducing a lot of high-end western gear. A case in point is the dismal performance of the Russian hardware against low-end, but high-tech western weaponry in the Ukraine war. Such lessons from this war are not lost on those in uniform.

Our high-end weapons systems are all US based. There is a reason for this. When push comes to shove, it is these very same American made artillery guns that fire thousands upon thousands of rounds without requiring a change of the barrels on account of the quality of metallurgy used. For the young generation so brought up on to this anti-amreekanism, it was the famous "AAA" that was touted by Pakistan in the 1965 war as its savior. Depending on whom you talk with, it was Allah, Army and the Air Force for some and Allah, Army and Artillery for others. At least two of the "A"s (AF and Artillery) were American origin and the Army was a US trained one which gave the country a fighting chance.

Even today, it is the high performance engines and airframes in the F-16s that can fly 12,000 hours, over their life, which is unmatched by any Russian/Chinese platforms. The Turks did what IK is doing, i.e. went full bore on anti-Americanism, then realized that they have no option but to go back to the American alignment (thus the request for F-16V upgrades for their Air Force).

So as I always say, naray-baazi and talk of khuddari are all fine, but these alone do not give confidence to those who have to carry out the job of fighting. Not having effective, modern combat aviation is already resulting in massive casualties in the FATA. Not being able to leverage EDA via MNNA is impacting the fight in both Balochistan and the FATA. If even IK on a populist platform could not make peace in these two areas (despite him claiming that nobody knows FATA/KP better than he does), the only option is to fight the anti-state elements and when doing so, having access to the best technology to do the job is a must and currently, US is the only source with such options.

Our Ertugril-fan club should also realize that Turkey has gone full circle and is now open to dealing with the Americans. They realized that at least currently and for the next decade plus, America is the dominant power with whom dealings cannot be put off. The Pakistani establishment has very correctly and objectively arrived at this very same conclusion.

The problem with this line of argument is that you always fail to see that it's not Pakistan or IK that runs on anti-US rhetoric but in fact, it's the US that always runs on anti-Pakistan one. For e.g can you point me out where IK ever said that we are anti-US? In fact, he has always maintained that we want friendly relations with everyone including the US and India. However, the US on the other hand dictates with whom we can or cannot have relations. This line is certainly not acceptable to any Pakistani and IK represents those Pakistanis.
The US has made its associations clear by aligning itself with India and no amount of what we do is going to change that, so what gives the US the right to dictate Pakistan to keep itself aligned with the West even though we never really went against the US or Western countries but kept a balanced profile?
As for the weapon system, that point is now moot. Have we been able to get those F-16s? What about those engines for the T-129? Do you believe the US is going to offer any weapon system to their installed regime? Heck no they won't yet they want Pakistan to remain engaged with the US and be thankful and gracious to whatever little crumbs they throw at us.
No matter how much we lay down, we are still getting nothing that leaves us to where exactly? Of course like the COAS said, we need to look for alternatives and this is where China came into and Russia could very well be.
As for the example of Ukraine, I could lay a similar example in Afghanistan where US-trained forces fell like a deck of cards. Even with all the advancements and weapon systems of the US and NATO combined, they could not win in Afghanistan. Nobody was supporting Afghanistan, at least not in the way the West is supporting Ukraine. I say Russia is still doing pretty well considering the amount of hardware pouring in through Poland and other countries.
Let me repeat IK or PTI or the followers of PTI like myself do not want bad relations with the US or any Western country. At the same, we do not want bad relations with China or Russia. If Pakistan could benefit from cheap Russian oil, why shouldn't we? If the US has a problem with that then it's theirs to solve, not us.
As for the US ambassador giving signals to the Establishment, that boat has long sailed and the kind of heat the Establishment is facing has never been in the entire history of Pakistan, maybe during Ayub era. If they still haven't learned their lessons, then I am afraid we are heading towards a very dangerous time ahead. Elections will happen one way or the other and IK will get his mandate and if for some reason that mandate is fiddled with or rigged then rest assured we are not going to sit idly by.