Pakistani flag and its heretic(pagan) roots

[Irfan Baloch]

symbols and icons are very part of human civilization, i dont think its easy to remove it.. I have seem pics of mecca, and the number 787 in picture frames in many indian households.. is not the islamic idea mainly against worshiping idols/symbols ?

it is actually 786
the numeration of the recitation Bishmillah (in the name of Allah..)

 

[Kambojaric]

If you are engaging Rome in this than it works fine as a symbol of democracy.

Why not. Although Augustus would not really agree on the democracy part given that he titled himself an emperor and liked to call himself Divi Filius

 

[Irfan Baloch]

symbols and icons are very part of human civilization, i dont think its easy to remove it.. I have seem pics of mecca, and the number 787 in picture frames in many indian households.. is not the islamic idea mainly against worshiping idols/symbols ?

your question can only be answered by an Islamic scholar, what you will get is half baked, emotional or opinionated responses.

your question is awesome (one has to read it few times to understand the depth of it)
I cant tell if you thought about your question or you just came up with it while finishing your message.

and I submit to you that in the literal sense of it, yes symbolism will be against the "popular" teaching of Islam.
but on the other hand this symbolism or pictures and words are not object of worship but respect and reminder of what they represent (and this is where I expect my respected Hindu friends to make some very compelling posts).

 

[Jungibaaz]

You mean to say cultures, nations and people adapt symbols and other customs and traditions from roots other than their current state?

I must say, that is a great revelation, I'll contact the nobel committee and tell them of your discovery right away.

Edit: almost forgot about the pagan flag on my dp. Left over from 14 aug.

 

[El Sidd]

Why not. Although Augustus would not really agree on the democracy part given that he titled himself an emperor and liked to call himself Divi Filius

Great let's do that.

Forget about Augustus. Think Cleopatra lol

 

[.]

Man you are overthinking ... we have no importance of moon and star in our country ... its just a symbol just like a name ... so in future if sombody relates our name with the name of some ancient goddess then will you change the name too ? So the crux of the matter is "your acts are dependant on your intentions" so here intention is to show our love of islam and in current culture islam is represented by moon and star then there is no harm is using that till you consider no more than a symbol without any meaning ...

Regarding second part of your post about burecrates,,, it was laughable ... i am sorry to hurt you feelings but it is just like the thinking of generals BLOODY CIVILIANS and burecreats are like BLOODY COMMON PEOPLE... i would like to suggest you dont be a well's frog and kindly visit some big professional commercial and scientific organizations and you will amazed to see that where the world is going and the pace of work ... the working style of so called burecreates is still a century old and you are calling them the most educated class ... sorry to say but the are one of the prime contributor is slow progress of Pakistan ... they do nothing other than leg pulling, dirty politics and refernces ...

Only handful are competent and honest majority are disaster ...

The first part of your post is about the symbol , Man I just care about the country and its history not the symbol and I'm not overthinking I've known about this long before I read any of the contributing links here.
Symbols are a representation of what a person holds in his belief system that is why symbols exist in the first place.
If what you're saying then we should all switch the sign of David and pretend to be Muslims and that would look really foolish which is the case here
Now Pakistan's belief system is not pagan symbolism but its religion which denounces it in its teachings and there is a clear historical trail to accede this rather than arguing in hiccups.

Regarding the bureaucrats and all , I just added that last part because many people would come to post the same rubbish that all Bureaucrats are corrupt (whatever).
You have such a limited view that depicts your social experience on this matter might I suggest to go leave home once in a while and see the world.
There are not just one institution in bureaucracy the police as you portray it.
Even in police I assure you that 2 out of every 5 cops are competent and dead honest.
I'll agree with you the day a BPS 18 officer gets the same privileges as a brigadier in the army. Now I've seen that a brigadier lives in Askari who happens to be a close family friend and a BPS-22 officer lives in a lower middle class neighborhood.
Now this is another debate which I will no longer participate in because I don't want to participate in a holier than thou argument and regarding the flag it's the same thing as having a swastika symbol while ignoring the historical relevance in which case is plain ignorance.

 

[The Accountant]

The first part of your post is about the symbol , Man I just care about the country and its history not the symbol and I'm not overthinking I've known about this long before I read any of the contributing links here.
Symbols are a representation of what a person holds in his belief system that is why symbols exist in the first place.
If what you're saying then we should all switch the sign of David and pretend to be Muslims and that would look really foolish which is the case here
Now Pakistan's belief system is not pagan symbolism but its religion which denounces it in its teachings and there is a clear historical trail to accede this rather than arguing in hiccups.

Regarding the bureaucrats and all , I just added that last part because many people would come to post the same rubbish that all Bureaucrats are corrupt (whatever).
You have such a limited view that depicts your social experience on this matter might I suggest to go leave home once in a while and see the world.
There are not just one institution in bureaucracy the police as you portray it.
Even in police I assure you that 2 out of every 5 cops are competent and dead honest.
I'll agree with you the day a BPS 18 officer gets the same privileges as a brigadier in the army. Now I've seen that a brigadier lives in Askari who happens to be a close family friend and a BPS-22 officer lives in a lower middle class neighborhood.
Now this is another debate which I will no longer participate in because I don't want to participate in a holier than thou argument and regarding the flag it's the same thing as having a swastika symbol while ignoring the historical relevance in which case is plain ignorance.

Well for your information my elder sister is a burecreate ... I have been part of various gov projects ... I have been to Pakistan secretariat in the capacity of professional consultant for months ... and I was not meeting assistant director level people ... My comments on bureaucrats is after working with both part of the world and its not biased ... Belief me these gov officers are atleast 3 decades behind the real world ...

Regarding symbolism, I agree that it represents belief system but in current days and time if moon and star is representative of Islam and in the current culture it has no relevance to pagan symbolism then it's fine ... Currently, we know that it is accepted all around the world and you can see those symbols on mosques as well. Actually the way I see it that moon and star no longer represents paganisim but they represents Islam ... tomorrow if something else become our symbol then we will use that untill and unless it is harmful to Islam

 

[darksider]

Check this

indian mighty hindu should attack the Makkah get back kaabah the preislamic vedic temple like they did with babri masjid and want do with tajmehal.
the guy who make the video forgot to mention who build kaabah.the man who worship one god only not idols.becuase of him we sacrifices goats bulls and cows now.
i think rss madrassa making you guys delusional.

 

[Hamza913]

Check this

You guys love to claim literally everyone was from Gangestan don't you?

Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him) came from the Quraysh tribe. His family were Hanifs, a monotheistic religion.

The symbol may have been associated with pagans, but it isn't anymore so it should be fine.

I mean, the Kaba was associated with pagans before Islam, should we no longer face it when we pray? Of course not, the present is what matters.

However, since there seems to be this revival of people acknowledging the crescent and star as a pagan symbol, we might need to change it in the future lol.

 

[Zhukov]

Another Crappy Conspiracy Nut head Production not worth the time for a debate.
Write some more articlles on Chinese Dragon American Hawk British crown Russian Bear Japanese Sun and all other National symbols and trave there roots into something mysterious. And crap out your time on this rubbish research

 

[StraightShooter]

You guys love to claim literally everyone was from Gangestan don't you?

Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him) came from the Quraysh tribe. His family were Hanifs, a monotheistic religion.

The symbol may have been associated with pagans, but it isn't anymore so it should be fine.

I mean, the Kaba was associated with pagans before Islam, should we no longer face it when we pray? Of course not, the present is what matters.

However, since there seems to be this revival of people acknowledging the crescent and star as a pagan symbol, we might need to change it in the future lol.

May be you should pick a new symbol then and stop worshiping the pagan stone too. As it stands today, it is very Vedic and does not gel well with the anti-pagan message of the contemporary Islam.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

May be you should pick a new symbol then and stop worshiping the pagan stone too. As it stands today, it is very Vedic and does not gel well with the anti-pagan message of the contemporary Islam.

So we should pick a new symbol because it was once a place of worship for pagans? And Prophet Ibrahim broke the idols and so on?

And we dont worship any stone... its just a stone for us.. unlike idols u worship.

Please stop embarrassing yourself.

 

[Hamza913]

May be you should pick a new symbol then and stop worshiping the pagan stone too. As it stands today, it is very Vedic and does not gel well with the anti-pagan message of the contemporary Islam.

Please Gangi stop, you're too much.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Be assured that Hilal vs Sitara (Ay-Yildiz) is the symbol of Muslim supremacy and domination to protect Jan, Mal and Namus in the Islamic heartlands. It was corroborated with thousands of Jihats, and tens of millions of Mujahit, Shehit and Gazi. Since the Muslim heartlands lost Ay-Yildiz they have seen complete and absolute capitulation under Kufr, and not a single day of peace. Millions after millions have lost their lives and honor. As for Ehl-I Iman, this should be a enough proof. Please don't fall for the propaganda of Iblis done through Masons/Murted/Munafik etc. There are excellent Turkish sources which relate Ay-Yildiz to Islamic symbols. InshaAllah I will translate them in future for PDF...

By the by, the Muslim conquest of Istanbul was foretold in a Hadis-I Sherif. And, Resullah (PBUH) praised the commander and his soldiers who would conquer Istanbul. Guess what? Fatih Sultan Mehmet Han (RA) fought the war to conquer Istanbul under the banner of Ay-Yildiz. Now, I would like to see any Muslim folk, who has an iota of Yakin left in him, to say Ay-Yildiz isn't a symbol of Muslim domination!!!!

On the other hand, when BD replaced Ay-Yildiz in their flag with sun, symbol of Mitra/Somnath/Sun-God etc., Indira Gandhi said, "We have taken revenge for thousand years of Muslim rule". Do Muslims really require any further proofs???

 

[StraightShooter]

So we should pick a new symbol because it was once a place of worship for pagans? And Prophet Ibrahim broke the idols and so on?

And we dont worship any stone... its just a stone for us.. unlike idols u worship.

Please stop embarrassing yourself.

Whatever way you want to spin it, the fact is your are still worshiping a pagan stone. This act of worshiping a pagan stone does not suit the current narrative of message of Islam. Hence for your own good, you should consider changing it.