Pakistan | The Warrior State | Book looks into Pakistan's failings.

[Kompromat]

30%? I might as well die now!

What do you expect from an Indian author

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

How true! Over dependence on foreign aid and freebies has been the bane of Pakistan's progress.

true....but foreign aid hasn't at all been a contributor to macro stability; old loans paid off with new ones. So it was only a liability and the dependence was done by the civilian leaders - not the people of Pakistan who havent even benefited and so therefore couldnt give two craps about it.

by the way, in real terms india is still a much larger recipient of foreign aid and assistance than Pakistan is.

Which Malam Jabba?

The way it was:

Or what it has become:

In many ways, that is emblematic of the way we imagine Pakistan to be, compared to what it actually has become.


Sometimes it takes a book like this to show us the mirror. But only if we open our eyes.

uh yeah - and its being restored. Ski federation and PAF are involved in spear-heading the restoration and already events have been taking place there

ski hill is rebuilt, fully operational.... adjacent hotel is being made functional in months to come.

so yeah it symbolizes Pakistan; despite fuckups and destructive behaviour of a small handful of criminals and terrorists - and despite the fuckups of the government - Pakistan is still a resilient nation and not one that can be put into submission

 

[VCheng]

Today, Pakistan faces some of the toughest challenges of its existence. It has to deal with the Taliban insurgency and a weak economy. It has to solve its deepening energy crisis. It has to address growing water scarcity. While I believe Pakistanis are a very resilient and determined people, the difficult challenges they face will test them, particularly their leaders who have been falling short of their expectations in recent years.

Isn't it ironic that after spending all those words and graphs trying to prove just how well Pakistan has done, the concluding paragraph concedes the poor law and order and economic situation, as well as the huge and mounting problems of power and water shortages. A country that ends up like this after 65 years cannot be expected to magically improve.

Nay, the downhill slide will continue.

You are the one facetiously claiming all of swat valley in under Tali influence even after I showed you a video of people skiing this year in Malam jabba.Any Military professional of pakistan or a resident of swat valley will agree with me not with some author who probably never visited pakistan or with some self-hating **** who thinks he's more American than Betsy Ross.

The fact is that vast areas of Karachi, northern areas (including Swat and Baltistan), and the hinterlands of all four provinces outside of the major cities are under Taliban influence, not just North Waziristan. The 30% may very well be a conservative estimate. Or would you like the world to forget just how easily the Taliban moved in the countryside during that brazen jailbreak in DI Khan? Or how about the massacre of passengers on the NATCO buses?

so yeah it symbolizes Pakistan; despite fuckups and destructive behaviour of a small handful of criminals and terrorists - and despite the fuckups of the government - Pakistan is still a resilient nation and not one that can be put into submission

What comment about Pakistan would be complete without mentioning the utter denial that is practiced by those who simply do not wish to acknowledge the reality?

The fvckups are pervasive in Pakistan, from top to bottom, not just the government.

 

[RiazHaq]

Isn't it ironic that after spending all those words and graphs trying to prove just how well Pakistan has done, the concluding paragraph concedes the poor law and order and economic situation, as well as the huge and mounting problems of power and water shortages. A country that ends up like this after 65 years cannot be expected to magically improve.

Nay, the downhill slide will continue.
---------------
The fvckups are pervasive in Pakistan, from top to bottom, not just the government.

My assessment is based on real credible data that refutes the basic thrust and assertions of TV Paul. It's far more balanced in recognizing real problems that Pakistan has (every nation has problems) while exposing Paul's falsehoods.

As to the talk of the 65 years, I suggest Paul (and you) look at the fact that Paul's country of origin is home to the world;s largest population of poor, hungry, illiterates where majority of population still defecates in the open and a farmer commits suicide every 30 minutes.

Haq's Musings: 63 Years After Independence, India Remains Home to World's Largest Population of Poor, Hungry and Illiterates

 

[VCheng]

My assessment is based on real credible data that refutes the basic thrust and assertions of TV Paul. It's far more balanced in recognizing real problems that Pakistan has (every nation has problems) while exposing Paul's falsehoods.

As to the talk of the 65 years, I suggest Paul (and you) look at the fact that Paul's country of origin is home to the world;s largest population of poor, hungry, illiterates where majority of population still defecates in the open and a farmer commits suicide every 30 minutes.

Haq's Musings: 63 Years After Independence, India Remains Home to World's Largest Population of Poor, Hungry and Illiterates

Any comments on this article Sir:


Rising poverty in Pakistan
Rising poverty in Pakistan
Pakistan’s progress on achieving the MDGs is disappointing. Reports prepared by national and international bodies show that Pakistan will not be able to reach the MDGs by 2015, as it is short of almost all its targets on the time scale

Salman Ali
June 14, 2014


Poverty is not a new phenomenon in Pakistan as every third Pakistani is caught in the ‘poor’ bracket, i.e. some 58.7 million out of a total population of 180 million subsist below the poverty line. This includes more than half the population in the forever remote Balochistan, 33 percent in Sindh, 32 percent in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa (KP) and 19 percent in Punjab. These are daunting figures for every Pakistani. According to the report Pakistan Living Standards Measurement (PLSM), survey data have registered a decline in the poverty headcount from 34.5 percent to 12.4 percent in 10 years. Though this indicates a lot of progress towards poverty alleviation, the realities on the ground do not match the conclusions. That is the reason why a technical group has been set up by the Ministry of Planning, Development and Reforms to review the official methodology for poverty estimation and validation of poverty numbers. According to a World Bank report, World Development Indicators 2013, 60 percent of Pakistan's population lives below the poverty line. The international poverty line is two dollars a day or an income of Rs 200 per day. The report showed that 21 percent of Pakistan's population lives below $ 1.25 per day, and a larger number lives under two dollars a day. A comparison of regional countries showed that the poverty rate in Sri Lanka and Nepal was significantly less than Pakistan with 23.9 percent and 57.35 percent, respectively.
An analysis of the data revealed that 30.9 percent of children under the age of five are suffering from malnutrition and are underweight. The youth literacy rate was recorded at 71 percent for the 15-24 age group. The vulnerable employment, the proportion of unpaid family workers and own account workers in total employment was 63 percent. In recent years, to help the poor, schemes like the Pakistan Poverty Alleviation Fund, Tameer-e-Watan Programme, Benazir Income Support Programme, Pakistan Bait-ul-Maal, subsidies on food, Employees Old Age Benefit Scheme and Workers Welfare Fund have been launched. But, according to independent observers, these initiatives have benefited a small percentage of the country's population. It is pertinent to note here that fighting poverty is at the core of the UN Millennium Development Goals (MDGs). Although the government has adopted a number of measures to achieve the MDG benchmarks by 2015, it is lagging behind in achieving most targets in various sectors. Regarding the goal on education, there has actually been a regression. The Net Enrolment Ratio (NER) improved from 42 percent in 2001-02 to 57 percent in 2011-12 but it is still far short of the target, while the Completion Rate to grade level five remains stagnant at 57 percent during the period. There is also little possibility of achieving the target of enabling all children to complete a course of primary schooling by 2015. The literacy rate is supposed to have risen from 35 percent in 1990-91 to 58 percent in 2008-9, but this falls far short of the MDG target of 88 percent by 2015. Similarly, the Gender Parity Index for primary and secondary education stands at 0.84 and 0.80 respectively, showing little change from the rates of 0.82 and 0.75 in 2001-02.
At a recent consultative workshop on the national accelerated plan of action for achieving the MDGs, it was claimed by government spokesmen that considerable progress had been made towards achieving MDGs four and five pertaining to maternal and child health. But some basic figures run counter to the claim. According to reports by international agencies, the maternal mortality rate is 276 per 100,000 live births, the under-five mortality rate is 89/1,000 live births and infant mortality is 73/1,000 live births. The most unfortunate figure relates to the neonatal mortality rate, which remained stagnant around 55/1,000 live births during the last three decades. According to government sources, of the 34 indicators on which Pakistan reports progress to the UN and on which data is available, Pakistan is on track only on 10. Unchecked food inflation has nullified the steps taken to eradicate poverty, and the poverty headcount ratio, which was 17.2 in 2007-08 according to the National Poverty Survey, has increased. Food insecurity is an increasing threat to over 60 percent of the people in Pakistan. The reasons cited for lagging behind in fighting poverty by achieving MDG goals include internal and external economic challenges, natural disasters, internal conflicts, and institutional, administrative and political bottlenecks. During the September session of the UN General Assembly this year, Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, explaining why Pakistan is not on track to achieving the MDG targets, told the gathering that a large proportion of our resources have been consumed by the war on terrorism. This is a standard excuse that Pakistan offers at every forum, though the world continues to ask why we have not been able to make progress on MDGs comparable to what the poor nations of sub-Saharan Africa have achieved. By all indications, Pakistan’s progress on achieving the MDGs is disappointing. Reports prepared by national and international bodies show that Pakistan will not be able to reach the MDGs by 2015, as it is short of almost all its targets on the time scale. Regarding the eradication of poverty and hunger, the reports say some progress has been made but the 2015 target is unlikely to be achieved.
In their various reports, civil society organisations have stressed that Pakistan will have to launch a new drive for internal resource mobilisation as well as divert resources from other non-productive pursuits and activities to move speedily towards achieving the MDGs. There is still half a year left to the goal and we can even now get our act together to achieve what other less well endowed nations have done. We need to devise a new national development agenda and a more responsive policy framework for this purpose. The first step towards this would be to learn from the experience of various countries in Asia and Latin America, which have successfully lifted the marginalised sections of their populations above the poverty line. Action against poverty needs to be taken at two levels. In the first category should be special food-and-cash schemes as part of a larger social safety net targeting the poorest of the poor in the urban slums and the rural hinterland who have no employable skills and face food insecurity on a daily basis. On a wider canvas, poverty can be fought only through a special package of policy measures designed to accelerate growth both in the agricultural and industrial sectors, launch new employment generation programmes and ensure a more equitable distribution of national income. Poverty is not evil but to remain poor and to accept poverty is really bad. In Pakistan, poverty is increasing day by day. Effective steps of government are required to reduce it. Government should provide credit facilities and use labour intensives techniques of production to reduce the poverty.

 

[RiazHaq]

Any comments on this article Sir:


Rising poverty in Pakistan
Rising poverty in Pakistan
Pakistan’s progress on achieving the MDGs is disappointing. Reports prepared by national and international bodies show that Pakistan will not be able to reach the MDGs by 2015, as it is short of almost all its targets on the time scale

Salman Ali
June 14, 2014

Does Pakistan have poverty? Yes it does.

Does poverty make a country a failed state?

If you answer is yes, then do you have a similar report for India, the country of origin of TV Paul?

Let me give share with you a World Bank CDG report that just came out:

Haq's Musings: World Bank Reports Sharp Downward Revision in Pakistan Poverty

The number of Pakistanis living below the 2005 $1.25 poverty line (set at $1.44 for 2011) is 4.8 million, less than one-seventh of the 35.1 million reported earlier. It is a huge drop from about 20% of the population to 3% of the population living below the international poverty line.

Poverty rates for many other nations, including India and Bangladesh, have also seen dramatic downward revisions. As a result, India now has 102 million poor, just slightly above China's 99 million. In fact, the new report has cut the world poverty rate in half from 19.7% to 8.9%. Reduction from 21% to 3% for Pakistan poverty is much sharper than the rest of the world because ICP 2011 found it to be the second cheapest in the world.

 

[VCheng]

Does Pakistan have poverty? Yes it does.
Does poverty make a country a failed state?

Sorry Sir, but the book under discussion makes no claims about a "failed state". It is about the "warrior state" that Pakistan has become, with all its consequences, including poverty.

 

[Rafi]

Sorry Sir, but the book under discussion makes no claims about a "failed state". It is about the "warrior state" that Pakistan has become, with all its consequences, including poverty.

You are a serious troll, with nothing better to do - than denigrate a foreign country, you know nothing or little of.

 

[RiazHaq]

Sorry Sir, but the book under discussion makes no claims about a "failed state". It is about the "warrior state" that Pakistan has become, with all its consequences, including poverty.

It's obvious you are defending the book without reading it.

 

[VCheng]

It's obvious you are defending the book without reading it.

I simply do not agree that Pakistan is a failed state.

Yet.

 

[VCheng]

What do you expect from an Indian author

Isn't it ironic that a Canadian Professor at McGill has his views discarded because he was born in India. Yet my views are discarded because I was born in Pakistan, but now live in USA.

Funny how that works, right?

 

[RiazHaq]

I simply do not agree that Pakistan is a failed state.

Yet.

So you agree that Pakistan is not a "conspicuous failure" as TV Paul claims? If you do disagree with the author's conclusion, then why do agree with him on the assertions which I have clearly refuted with evidence and data in my post?

Haq's Musings: Pakistan: Warrior State? Conspicuous Failure?

 

[VCheng]

So you agree that Pakistan is not a "conspicuous failure" as TV Paul claims? If you do disagree with the author's conclusion, then why do agree with him on the assertions which I have clearly refuted with evidence and data in my post?

Haq's Musings: Pakistan: Warrior State? Conspicuous Failure?

Where Pakistan has failed conspicuously, as the author concludes, supported by data, is in social development indices as it continues to dream of itself as the warrior state. Your cherry-picked data lead only to wrong conclusions.

 

[RiazHaq]

Where Pakistan has failed conspicuously, as the author concludes, supported by data, is in social development indices as it continues to dream of itself as the warrior state. Your cherry-picked data lead only to wrong conclusions.

First, it's obvious that you are continuing to defend TV Paul's book without first reading it.

Second, I have responded directly to the author's own assertion with data and evidence, not "cherry picked data" as you accuse me of.

Third, Pakistan is no warrior state. Its military spending is less than the world average of 3% of GDP even though it has suffered an invasion from its hostile neighbor and is currently engaged in battling a serious terrorist threat that has claimed over 50,000 Pakistani lives.

Fourth, Pakistan's defense budget is a tiny fraction of its hostile neighbor India, the birthplace of the author which is now the biggest buyer in the international arms bazaar in spite of its world's largest population of poor and hungry citizens.

Haq's Musings: India's Arms Buildup: Guns Versus Bread

 

[VCheng]

First, it's obvious that you are continuing to defend TV Paul's book without first reading it.

Second, I have responded directly to the author's own assertion with data and evidence, not "cherry picked data" as you accuse me of.

Third, Pakistan is no warrior state. Its military spending is less than the world average of 3% of GDP even though it has suffered an invasion from its hostile neighbor and is currently engaged in battling a serious terrorist threat that has claimed over 50,000 Pakistani lives.

Fourth, Pakistan's defense budget is a tiny fraction of its hostile neighbor India, the birthplace of the author which is now the biggest buyer in the international arms bazaar in spite of its world's largest population of poor and hungry citizens.

Haq's Musings: India's Arms Buildup: Guns Versus Bread

Pakistan's military spending is about one-third of its budget, and is the largest domestic head, by far. And unsustainable. Pakistan is starving itself into oblivion by feeding this parasite.