Pakistan Navy Should Create it own Independent Air wing

[Super Falcon]

I perosnally think that indian navy is growing its fleet of ships and Aircraft carrier and Naval Airwing with Mig 29K pakitan navy cant buy too costly ships in more numbers there are good and cheap options which pakistan navy could go for JH 7 is great thing for navy if we get 30 of these on loan from china for next 10 years time and lold Mirages from UAE for navy 30 from them will give pakistan navy something to hit Indian navy too badly JH 7 is heavy bomber too and it offers good war survivalibility for the jet and JH 7 can carry cruise missiles and with chinese help these will be great and easy to operate for navy

 

[Super Falcon]

Xian JH-7 or Jian Hong-7 is a twin engine, lightweight fighter bomber aircraft designed and manufactured by Xian Aircraft Industry Corporation, China to meet the requirements of People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) and People's Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF). Its NATO reporting name is Flounder. It was built to replace the Chinese ageing fleet of Harbin H-5 and Nanchang Q-5 aircraft.

The export version of two seat JH-7 fighter is known as the FBC-1 (Fighter Bomber China-1) Flying Leopard. The maiden flight was completed in December 1988 and the aircraft entered into service in 1992. About 70 JH-7 aircraft are currently operational worldwide. The aircraft can operate day and night in all weather conditions.

Variants

The JH-7 fighter bomber has four variants namely JH-7A, JH-7B, FBC-1 Flying Leopard and FBC-1A Flying Leopard II.

The JH-7A is an upgraded version of the original JH-7 aircraft. JH-7A is the first aircraft designed with CAD or CAM CATIA V.5 software. This variant is additionally equipped with digital fly by wire controls, ventral fins, a glass cockpit and a single piece windscreen. The number of hard points in the variant is increased to 11.

The JH-7B is an advanced version of JH-7A. It has stealthier features compared to JH-7A.

"The JH-7 or FBC-1 is armed with a single 23mm twin-barrel GSh-23L auto cannon."FBC-1 Flying Leopard is an export version of JH-7. It was unveiled in 1998 and features a helmet mounted sight, a glass cockpit and user defined radars.

FBC-1A Flying Leopard II is an export version of JH-7A and was unveiled to the public in September 2003. This variant features 11 hard points which can carry 9,000kg of external stores.

Orders and deliveries

The JH-7 was delivered to the PLANAF in 1990. Xian Aircraft Industry Corporation supplied 20 JH-7s to the PLANAF in 1992. The PLAN acquired 20 more aircraft between 2002 and 2004 upon completion of the aircraft's final design in 1998.

Development

The proposal to develop a new fighter bomber was submitted to the Ministry of Aeronautics (MoA) by the People's Liberation Army in 1970. Two different variants of single airframe were proposed by Xian Aircraft Industry Corporation to cater to the needs of both PLAAF and PLAN. The air force variant was dropped in 1980 while the naval variant was built to execute anti-ship missile strike missions. The full scale production of original JH-7 began in 1984. The first JH-7 prototype was rolled out in August 1988 and unveiled to the public in September 1988 at Farnborough International Air Show.

The first batch of 12 to 18 JH-7 aircraft was delivered to both PLNAF and PLAAF for evaluation in the 1990's. The PLAAF declined to acquire JH-7 due to its old technology and unreliable Spey turbofan engines. The air force finally agreed to procure aircraft after upgrading the avionics and weapons suite with state-of-the-art technology. The upgraded JH-7 is known as JH-7A and was delivered to PLAAF in 2004.

Cockpit

The aircraft incorporates a two seat tandem cockpit and fuel tanks. The cockpit accommodates a pilot and a weapons load officer and is protected by armour plates. The back seat is reserved for the weapons load officer and is fitted slightly higher than front seat to provide clear visibility of the battlefield. Each seat has its own back-hinged canopy.

Armaments

The JH-7 or FBC-1 is armed with a single 23mm twin-barrel GSh-23L auto cannon, which can fire 300 rounds per gun.

The aircraft has nine hard points of which six are located under wing, two beneath wing tips and one under the centreline fuselage section. It can carry 9,000kg of payload.

It is also equipped with PL-5, PL-8 and PL-9 air to air missiles (AAM), Yingji-8K, Yingji-82K anti-ship missiles (ASM) and Yingji-91 anti-radiation missile (ARM). The aircraft is fitted with 57mm or 90mm unguided rocket pods, and unguided and laser guided bombs.

Radars

The JH-7 is equipped with Type 232 H Eagle Eye multi-function fire-control radar, which tracks target information of YJ-8 (C-801) subsonic anti-ship missiles from a maximum distance of 70km to 100km. It also offers fixed air to air and navigation capabilities. The radar cannot operate on land due to its deficiency of terrain and precision strike abilities.

Countermeasures

The aircraft features an electronic countermeasures suite which encompasses Information Friend of Foe (IFF) transponder, radar warning receiver (RWR), noise jammer, and KZ-8608 electronic intelligence (ELINT) suite, chaff or flare dispensers.

Engines

The JH-7 is powered by two Rolls-Royce Spey Mk202 turbofan engines. Each engine can produce 54.29kN of dry thrust and its thrust after burner is 91.26kN.

"The first JH-7 prototype was rolled out in August 1988."The engine is 5.2m long. Its diameter is 1.09m. The dry weight of the engine is 1,856kg.

The Spey Mk202 engine was introduced in 1960. The engine was first received by China in 1975.

China signed an agreement with Rolls Royce in 1975 to reproduce the Spey Mk202 engine through reverse engineering.

The Chinese produced engine is designated as WS-9 Qinling turbofan engine and its trail production began in 1976. The WS-9 incorporated in the JH-7A aircraft is a licensed copy of the Spey Mk202 engine.

Performance

The aircraft can fly at a maximum speed of 1,808km/h. Its cruise speed is 903km/h. The normal and ferry ranges of the JH-7 are 1,759km and 3,700km respectively. The service ceiling of the aircraft is 16,000m. The aircraft weighs around 14,500kg while its maximum take-off weight is 28,475kg.

 

[Super Falcon]

Mirage 2000 is a multirole combat fighter from Dassault Aviation of France. It has been operational with the French Air Force since 1984, and has been selected by Abu Dhabi, Egypt, Greece, India, Peru, Qatar, Taiwan and the United Arab Emirates. By 2009, approximately 600 Mirage 2000 were in service worldwide.

Mirage 2000 fighters in operation with the French Air Force are: Mirage 2000C/B single seater and two seater for air defence; Mirage 2000N, two seater, designed for all weather nuclear penetration at low altitude and very high speed; Mirage 2000D, an upgraded version of the Mirage 2000N, for automated bombing using conventional and laser guided munitions; and Mirage 2000-5, incorporating advanced avionics, new multiple target air-to-ground and air-to-air firing procedures using the RDY radar and new sensor and control systems.

Orders for 110 Mirage 2000-5 have been placed by the air forces of France (37), Taiwan (60 aircraft), Qatar (12) and Greece.

Greece acquired 15 Mirage 2000-5 mk2 and upgraded ten of its Mirage 2000 to the same standard. The first entered service in September 2004 and deliveries concluded in November 2007. Mirage 2000 production line was shut down in 2007 after the last aircraft was delivered to Greece in November 2007.

The United Arab Emirates ordered 32 2000-9 aircraft, a customised version of the 2000-5, delivered between 2003 and 2007.

"Mirage 2000 is a multirole combat fighter from Dassault Aviation of France."In July 2005, the Government of Brazil agreed to purchase 12 ex-French Air Force Mirage 2000C aircraft. Deliveries began in September 2006 and concluded in June 2008.

Dassault has received a contract to upgrade the French Air Force's Mirage 2000N to K3 standard. The K3 upgrade includes the operation of the MBDA ASMPA nuclear stand-off missile and a new Thales Optronics Reco NG reconnaissance pod.

In October 2008, three French Air Force Mirage 2000D aircraft were deployed to Kandahar in Afghanistan in support of the Nato International Security Assistance Force (ISAF).

India is in discussions with French companies to upgrade a fleet of 51 Mirage 2000 aircraft operated by the Indian Air Force (IAF), at a cost of about $1.9bn.

Cockpit

Mirage 2000-5 is available as a single-seater or two-seater multi-role fighter. The aircraft has hands-on throttle and stick (HOTAS) control. Mirage 2000-5 incorporates the Thales VEH 3020 head-up display and five cathode ray tube multifunction advanced pilot systems interface (APSI) displays.

The combined head-up / head-level display is collimated at infinity, and presents data relating to flight control, navigation, target engagement and weapon firing. Sensor and system management data is presented on two coloured lateral displays.

Weapons

Mirage 2000 has nine hardpoints for carrying weapon system payloads: five on the fuselage and two on each wing. The single-seat version is also armed with two internally mounted, high-firing-rate 30mm guns.

Air-to-air weapons include the MICA multi-target air-to-air intercept and combat missiles, and the Magic 2 combat missiles, both from MBDA (formed out of a merger between Matra BAe Dynamics, EADS Aerospatiale and Alenia Marconi Systems). MICA supports a maximum operating range of 60km. The aircraft can carry four MICA missiles, two Magic missiles and three drop tanks simultaneously. The Mirage 2000-5 can fire the MBDA Super 530D missile or the MBDA Sky Flash air-to-air missile as an alternative to the MICA missile.

"Mirage 2000 is equipped to carry a range of air-to-surface missiles."Mirage 2000 is also equipped to carry a range of air-to-surface missiles and weapons including laser-guided bombs.

These include the MBDA BGL 1000 laser-guided bomb, MBDA AS30L, MBDA Armat anti-radar missile, MBDA AM39 Exocet anti-ship missile, MBDA rocket launchers, MBDA Apache stand-off weapon, and the stealthy cruise missile, SCALP.

The Mirage 2000-9 aircraft ordered by the United Arab Emirates carries the Black Shahine missile being developed by MBDA. The MBDA Storm Shadow / Scalp EG stand-off cruise missile will arm French AF Mirage 2000D, Greek Mirage 2000-5 and UAE Mirage 2000-9 aircraft. Storm Shadow was first deployed on UK RAF Tornado aircraft during Operation Iraqi Freedom in March 2003. Scalp EG entered service on French AF Mirage 2000D in December 2003.

MBDA has been awarded a contract in October 2003 to integrate the ASMPA medium-range air-to-ground missile on the French Air Force's new Mirage 2000NK3 aircraft. ASMPA has a tactical nuclear warhead and will replace the ASMP missile in service on the Mirage 2000N since 1988. The operational evaluation was completed in March 2009 and the new missile was scheduled to enter service on the Mirage 2000NK3 by end of 2009. The nuclear warhead is being provided by the French Atomic Energy Commission (Commissariat à l’Energie Atomique).

Targeting

Mirage 2000 has an upgraded digital weapon delivery and navigation system (WDNS). The aircraft can be fitted with a TV/CT CLDP laser designation pod from Thales Optronics, which provides the capability to fire laser-guided weapons by day and night. A number of French Air Force Mirage 2000D aircraft are being fitted with the Damocles laser designation pod with thermal imaging camera, also from Thales Optronics, under a contract awarded in July 2008.

Mirage 2000-5 is equipped with a multi-mode Thales RDY doppler radar which provides multi-targeting capability in the air defence role and the radar also has look down / shoot down mode of operation. The radar can simultaneously detect up to 24 targets and carry out track while scan on the eight highest priority threats.

Countermeasures

The aircraft is equipped with a self-protection suite installed internally. Mirage 2000-5 carries the ICMS mk2 automated integrated countermeasures system from Thales.

"The aircraft is equipped with a self-protection suite installed internally."ICMS mk2 incorporates a receiver and associated signal processing system in the nose section for the detection of missile command data links.

The system can be interfaced to a new programmable mission planning and a post-mission analysis ground system.

Engines

Mirage 2000 is equipped with an SNECMA M53-P2 turbofan engine, which provides 64kN thrust and 98kN with afterburn. The air intakes are fitted with an adjustable half-cone-shaped centre body, which provides an inclined shock of air pressure for highly efficient air input.

 

[Super Falcon]

with this our airforce wil get relax of load on them to defend pakistan in air sea and land if navy will take this challange on its own so will make life easy for airforce and they have to just think of just air and land superiority

 

[Donatello]

I would say, Navy should have 8 frigates and 4 destroyer for area defence.

6-8 submarines along with FACs and Corvettes.

That should be sea going fleet.

Rest, all we need to do is defend our coastline, primarily Karachi and Gwader.

Nothing offers the speed an accuracy of air power, hence PN should stop wasting money on ships and spend more on raising at least two squadrons of it's own fighter/attack aircraft armed with long range 200km+ missiles.

J-10s can be the bombers while JF-17s can be the escort.

JF-17s can carry AA missiles and external tanks for extended range.
J-10s can carry the heavier Anti-Ship missiles/Recon pods.

Keep in mind in order to defend our coast we need combat radius of at least 300km, which these aircraft would easily provide.

PN can either spend a billion dollars on 3-4ships of medium tech or raise a squadron of J-10s which would bear better fruit.

Having same aircraft as the Airforce would reduce the maintenance/arming/purchasing costs along with pilots that can be exchanged b/w airforce and navy for better tactics.


We have no ambition to conquer anyone, just deny the sea.

 

[Super Falcon]

JH 7 was made specially for Naval warefare and it is heavy and it can take damage from ships CIWS system becoa its body is made to take damage like A 10 Thunderbolt and very very good system for navy JF 17 is light weight and cannot carry heavy weapons which required to destroy ship even if carry than in small number JH 7 offer 11 hardpoints

 

[GodlessBastard]

The PN does, in fact, operate several Mirage-IIIs in a maritime interdiction role. However, I think they will be relatively useless against modern Indian naval fighters, including Sea Harriers (which shot down several Argentine Mirage-IIIs during the Falklands War) and MiG-29Ks.

The PN's focus should be on acquiring submarines for sea denial. Surface combatants and naval aviation are two areas where the IN has an overwhelming conventional advantage over the PN; it would be a waste of Pakistan's time and resources to try and match India's strong points.

 

[notorious_eagle]

The PN does, in fact, operate several Mirage-IIIs in a maritime interdiction role. However, I think they will be relatively useless against modern Indian naval fighters, including Sea Harriers (which shot down several Argentine Mirage-IIIs during the Falklands War) and MiG-29Ks.

The PN's focus should be on acquiring submarines for sea denial. Surface combatants and naval aviation are two areas where the IN has an overwhelming conventional advantage over the PN; it would be a waste of Pakistan's time and resources to try and match India's strong points.

Thats incorrect, the reason why the Harriers prevailed against the Mirage III's was due to superior training and tactics of the RAF pilots. Argentinean pilots used their Mirage III's in the worst possible form, they would fly their aircrafts straight without aggressively maneuvering them. Now this is possibly the worst tactic you can use against an enemy that is launching IR missiles at you; Result, RAF launches 24 AIM9's and 22 hit their targets. I can assure you PAF wont be making the same mistake the Argentines made, PAF actually studied this conflict in depth and their is a world of difference on how we deploy our Mirage III's as compared to the Argentines. This was proved in 1997 during an exercise with USS Kitty Hawk when our Mirage III's managed to sneak through undetected and zoomed passed the Kitty Hawk, and yes they didnt fly in a straight pattern , the Americans were left stunned and it was a real eye opener for them.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

PAF Mirages are upgraded to ROSE standards.Keep tht in mind.

 

[Hyde]

Since the time, our Sea boundary is extended by 50,000 square kilometers, We are yet to see any expansion in the Naval forces/development

Oh well, Money is a biggest problem and I hope something better happens soon

 

[Last Hope]

Since the time, our Sea boundary is extended by 50,000 square kilometers, We are yet to see any expansion in the Naval forces/development

Oh well, Money is a biggest problem and I hope some better happens soon

That is why it is written as take it as a a loan from China for next 10 yrs

 

[Safriz]

Pakistan has a big menace of coastal smuggling..specially from gulf states via launches..Thats devastating law abiding tax paying local retailers who cant compete with the torrent of smuggled cheap and yet better quality goods form those smuggling boats...
May the navy create a special wing to tackle this problem,that will be much better than buying aircraft carriers..specially for the economy.

 

[Donatello]

The PN does, in fact, operate several Mirage-IIIs in a maritime interdiction role. However, I think they will be relatively useless against modern Indian naval fighters, including Sea Harriers (which shot down several Argentine Mirage-IIIs during the Falklands War) and MiG-29Ks.

The PN's focus should be on acquiring submarines for sea denial. Surface combatants and naval aviation are two areas where the IN has an overwhelming conventional advantage over the PN; it would be a waste of Pakistan's time and resources to try and match India's strong points.

Typical reply without proper explanation.

Argentine Mirages were deadly. The only problem was they were operating from inland bases and not Falklands islands themselves, which limited their range. No air refueling meant that problem was even worse. The Mirage had only 5 mins of hover time to attack and escape the British ships. Once they were engaged they wasted too much fuel. The tactics didn't play out well.

PAF Mirage are based in Karachi, can be fitted with aerial pods and can give a tough fight to harriers any day as they won't be as limited by fuel and range as the Argentine ones, and they can carry a wide array of weapons in AA to Anti-Ship configuration.

 

[PakSher]

The PN does, in fact, operate several Mirage-IIIs in a maritime interdiction role. However, I think they will be relatively useless against modern Indian naval fighters, including Sea Harriers (which shot down several Argentine Mirage-IIIs during the Falklands War) and MiG-29Ks.

The PN's focus should be on acquiring submarines for sea denial. Surface combatants and naval aviation are two areas where the IN has an overwhelming conventional advantage over the PN; it would be a waste of Pakistan's time and resources to try and match India's strong points.

Pakistan has a good number of submarines and there are plenty of Babur cruise missile to strike the IN fleet multiple times. Aircraft carriers are easy target because they are big and easy to find.

 

[mikey]

Pakistan has a good number of submarines and there are plenty of Babur cruise missile to strike the IN fleet multiple times. Aircraft carriers are easy target because they are big and easy to find.

this is why americans opperating 12 of them and china looking for 3 ...BTW you want to ask about babur well its still not a surface to sea CM or i must say its still not inducted in PN,while its better if you dont compare indian navy with yours .